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Old 01-25-2019, 07:26 PM
 
Location: Arizona
12,852 posts, read 7,045,006 times
Reputation: 9842

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I'm sick of getting involved in 3rd world countries politics all it brings is spilling of American blood and high cost to American tax payer. Middle east has cost us billions and 1000's of lives what have we gained from it what has the common man middle eastern man gained from it nothing but death.

If people of Venezuela want to change their government then they should do it on their own. It's obvious not all people in Venezuela want change. The news media makes lot of claims that a majority of people want Maduro out I'm not so sure that's true. What ever the case doesn't matter anyway we should not be involved.
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Old 01-25-2019, 09:24 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
29,641 posts, read 24,661,879 times
Reputation: 28268
I think Venezuela is best left alone as a shining example of socialism's many failures. Let it's failure burn bright as a constant rebuttable to moron AOC's hilarious push for socialism in America. Let Bernie Sanders answer to the struggles faced daily in real life socialist hell. Just know and understand that real people are suffering because of the mistake called socialism, and it can happen here, if we allow it to. The struggle is real.



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Old 01-25-2019, 09:27 PM
 
7,520 posts, read 2,779,702 times
Reputation: 3940
We should help them in so far as we are part of a coalition of other neighboring countries to help them diplomatically right their ship. We should not send even one troop however.
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Old 01-25-2019, 09:37 PM
 
10,513 posts, read 5,113,497 times
Reputation: 14056
Quote:
Originally Posted by andywire View Post
I think Venezuela is best left alone as a shining example of socialism's many failures. Let it's failure burn bright as a constant rebuttable to moron AOC's hilarious push for socialism in America. Let Bernie Sanders answer to the struggles faced daily in real life socialist hell.
This tired old talking point is false and righties post it over and over.

Venezuela is NOT a Social Democracy or Democratic Socialist state. It is a totalitarian regime, more in common with the USSR and North Korea.

Social Democracies or Democratic Socialist states like Denmark, Finland, Norway and Iceland all have a higher quality of life, the people are happier and a longer life expectancy than the U.S.
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Old 01-25-2019, 09:39 PM
 
7,520 posts, read 2,779,702 times
Reputation: 3940
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elliott_CA View Post
This tired old talking point is false and righties post it over and over.

Venezuela is NOT a Social Democracy or Democratic Socialist state. It is a totalitarian regime, more in common with the USSR and North Korea.

Social Democracies or Democratic Socialist states like Denmark, Finland, Norway and Iceland all have a higher quality of life, the people are happier and a longer life expectancy than the U.S.
Those are not socialist countries. They are capitalist countries with huge social programs.
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Old 01-25-2019, 09:41 PM
 
5,051 posts, read 3,548,420 times
Reputation: 6511
Quote:
Originally Posted by redwood66 View Post
Those are not socialist countries. They are capitalist countries with huge social programs.

That is what Social Democracy is...
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Old 01-25-2019, 09:46 PM
 
6,115 posts, read 3,050,494 times
Reputation: 2405
Quote:
Originally Posted by kell490 View Post
I'm sick of getting involved in 3rd world countries politics all it brings is spilling of American blood and high cost to American tax payer. Middle east has cost us billions and 1000's of lives what have we gained from it what has the common man middle eastern man gained from it nothing but death.

If people of Venezuela want to change their government then they should do it on their own. It's obvious not all people in Venezuela want change. The news media makes lot of claims that a majority of people want Maduro out I'm not so sure that's true. What ever the case doesn't matter anyway we should not be involved.
Perhaps big corporates make big money, and modern war is actually a very profitable industry?
They don’t give a flying flock as to how many innocent lives are lost, as long as it makes them money!
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Old 01-25-2019, 09:48 PM
 
7,520 posts, read 2,779,702 times
Reputation: 3940
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vacanegro View Post
That is what Social Democracy is...
The original post was about socialism (totalitarianism) and not social democracies so that goal post was moved.
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Old 01-25-2019, 09:56 PM
 
5,051 posts, read 3,548,420 times
Reputation: 6511
Quote:
Originally Posted by andywire View Post
I think Venezuela is best left alone as a shining example of socialism's many failures. Let it's failure burn bright as a constant rebuttable to moron AOC's hilarious push for socialism in America. Let Bernie Sanders answer to the struggles faced daily in real life socialist hell. Just know and understand that real people are suffering because of the mistake called socialism, and it can happen here, if we allow it to. The struggle is real.

That is a very simplistic view - Capitalism>Socialism>Communism. Socialism works fine in many European forms.



VZ was never socialist any more than Today's China or Russia is a Communist country.



Chavez was a populist who wrapped himself in socialism to draw a distinction for all his dirt poor supporters living in the slums between himself and the many failed Capitalists who had tried to run VZ. He used the burgeoning oil prices at the time to fund programs of subsistence payments to the poor, electrifying the slums, providing basic services and setting up Cuban-run clinics. They loved him for that for a time. He diverted billions of dollars in oil wealth into state and personal coffers and fixed the currency setting off a black market and inflationary spiral that has driven the economy into the ground. All was well for a number of years and during that time his regime went about suppressing free expression, replaces judges, military commanders civil servants and legislators with loyalists. What you see today with his chosen successor Maduro are the last days of a dying regime. All the top officials have looted billions from the national treasury and are already thinking about where they will be moving in the next 5 years.
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Old 01-25-2019, 09:58 PM
 
10,513 posts, read 5,113,497 times
Reputation: 14056
Quote:
Originally Posted by redwood66 View Post
The original post was about socialism (totalitarianism) and not social democracies so that goal post was moved.
It was user AndyWire who moved the goalpost into another stadium by saying AOC and Bernie Sanders support socialism (totalitarianism) when they do not.

You can talk about Venezuela. You can talk about the Progressive movement in the US Democratic Party. Two separate topics as they have nothing in common.
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