Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I do not want any medical care/ treatment whatsoever. Not my right as an adult? OT but I wanted to get a DNR and bracelet. Husband asked HIS doctor about that. "She will have to come see me and we talk about it". Go, suck an egg on that. Why should an adult need a DOCTOR to sign a DNR form? I will go to an ATTORNEY before going to any Doctor. Trust them more than you people.
While I agree that you should not need to talk to a doctor about getting a DNR, if you need to in order to have it honored, then not doing so would mean it isn't honored, wouldn't it? If you need a medical professional to sign off on it, maybe you can just stop into the hospital or even the health dept and get it done? It seems to me that you could just order a bracelet that says "DNR" and wear it, though I don't know if that would be honored without any official paperwork... I don't know anything about it, those are just thoughts.
Anyway, I don't think "mandated" for adults actually means mandated. I think it more means that you wouldn't be able to work in certain places. I don't have that type of a job (public health, teaching, etc) and nobody has ever asked me about vaccines other than my own doctor and, in the case of the flu shot, my daughter's cardiologist (because she is high risk for the flu and they recommend -- not mandate -- that everyone in her household gets it each year). Although I am careful about vaccinations and don't take everything they offer, I would be perfectly fine with a hospital insisting that the employees get flu shots. Don't want a flu shot? Don't work there. I'd also be cool with a school having the same rule for employees.
Obesity, drinking, and smoking are the main risk factors for pretty much everything.
I guess employers have a right to not hire fat people, alcoholics or smokers too.
Maybe they should scour medical records for every drug a doctor wanted someone to take that they didn't, every surgery that was recommended that people didn't have, every well visit that was missed. Maybe they could take a look at all pharmacy records, check all the refills, make sure people were taking all their drugs.
Freedom.
Some people really have no idea what it means.
Your "freedom" ends where it encroaches on another person's freedom. I think you are the one who does not understand that "freedom" doe not mean you may do whatever you want to do with no regard for the effect it might have on other people.
Employers already can refuse to hire smokers. They can fire people for excessive drinking, which often impacts absenteeism and may be problematic for those who do work related driving or operate machinery.
Many employers underwrite wellness programs to promote a healthy weight, including gym memberships. So do insurance companies.
Quote:
Originally Posted by animalcrazy
Vaccines are necessary and measles are on the rise because of people not vaccinating their children. I was forced to be vaccinated for flu every year at work or I would be terminated. I resented it because the flu vaccine was only 50% effective on some years and there are risks with the vaccine. I haven't taken a flu shot since I retired 4 years ago and I haven't had the flu either. If they could make more effective like 90% I would take a flu shot every year. The measles vaccine is around 90% effective with one dose and 97% effective with two doses according to the CDC. I would vaccinate my child if I had one.
What risks with flu vaccine? Why is a 50 to 60% effectiveness (in most years) not worth taking the vaccine for?
By the way, 80% of children who die from flu are not vaccinated.
Suzy, you said “your freedom ends where it encroaches on another person’s freedom”. You also claim in in one breath that everyone has a choice when it comes to vaccines yet in the next talk about limits to employment, getting driver’s licenses, paying fines, not being able to go to school (public or private) if one refuses vaccines which seriously limits a persons ability to even make a living or live life.
Are you and others who push these extremes not able to understand that your “freedom” to not come into contact with anyone who hasn’t been vaccinated ends when the cost is forcing others to give up their freedom through coercion to get forgo a medical intervention, an injection aka a vaccine against their will (because otherwise they lose the ability to work, drive, pay bills, get an education)?
Last edited by MissTerri; 03-18-2019 at 06:39 PM..
Suzy, you said “your freedom ends where it encroaches on another person’s freedom. You also claim in in one breath that everyone has a choice when it comes to vaccines yet in the next talk about limits to employment, getting driver’s licenses, paying fines, not being able to go to school (public or private) if one refuses vaccines which seriously limits a persons ability to even make a living or live life.
Are you and others who push these extremes not able to understand that your “freedom” to not come into contact with anyone who hasn’t been vaccinated ends when the cost is forcing others to give up their freedom through coercion to get forgo a medical intervention, an injection aka a vaccine against their will (because otherwise they lose the ability to work, drive, pay bills, get an education)?
The bottom line is that they fear their vaccinations won't work so they need to force their vaccinated Herd Immunity. Those of us who are old and had these diseases ourselves do not fear the unvaccinated because we trust our own natural immunity to prevent us from catching these diseases AGAIN. If someone is immune, they cannot spread it to others. I will include in this all those who have had measles in these outbreaks in Disney, Minnesota, and now Washington. How many have DIED??? These people will never need to get vaccinated, or will give others measles.
I will repeat that I am Pro Choice. Get as many as you want, but if you trust in your vaccinations then why do you worry about the unvaccinated? Isn't that the purpose of your vaccines? To prevent you from getting the disease in the first place?
Suzy, you said “your freedom ends where it encroaches on another person’s freedom. You also claim in in one breath that everyone has a choice when it comes to vaccines yet in the next talk about limits to employment, getting driver’s licenses, paying fines, not being able to go to school (public or private) if one refuses vaccines which seriously limits a persons ability to even make a living or live life.
Are you and others who push these extremes not able to understand that your “freedom” to not come into contact with anyone who hasn’t been vaccinated ends when the cost is forcing others to give up their freedom through coercion to get forgo a medical intervention, an injection aka a vaccine against their will (because otherwise they lose the ability to work, drive, pay bills, get an education)?
You choose another job and choose another route to an education. I have no idea what you mean about driver's licenses. I have never discussed those at all.
The only "fine" I have discussed is penalizing those who do not vaccinate through health insurance premiums. However, I also do like the Australian approach of denying certain income tax breaks to families that do not vaccinate their children. They have now added a monthly fine to that.
The bottom line is that there is no valid reason not to vaccinate your healthy child in the absence of a medical contraindication. The ant-vaccinationists enormously overplay the risks of vaccines and pretty much ignore the risks of the diseases they prevent.
Sorry, the vast majority of the country vaccinates. Until you come up with a valid reason not to use a vaccine (not just that you do not want to), the rest of us would prefer not to have your children in school with ours, and many doctors will not want you in their practices, either.
When I was a kid (77 years ago), I contracted actual measles, mumps and chicken pox. All the kids did. Don't recall many adults getting those diseases although people knew rubella in pregnant women was bad. However, since then (late-40s/early 50's), the US population has more than doubled and everyone is a lot more mobile.
My dad made sure my brother, sister and I got the polio vaccine as soon as it was released. We lived in fear of the iron lung in those days - every summer polio was a worry.
When my son was born in 1967, he got the usual DPT, polio and boosters. He probably got MMR in 1971 or thereabouts when it was developed as he visited his pediatrician regularly. He may have had a measles shot earlier, I don't recall any longer. I think he contracted chicken pox as a child, but not mumps or measles.
He never had any of the more recent vaccines they're pushing these days and he grew into adulthood without any issues.
My personal belief - shooting tiny babies with eight or ten different vaccines so early in life is unsafe. Period. Staggering the less critical until the kids are older - as in my son's case he was four or five when he got the MMR makes more sense.
And HPV and HepC and whatever else is being promoted these days - dangerous for tiny bodies. Why do this to an infant or toddler??
Only inoculations I've had my entire life are DPT and polio. I've never had the flu shot, but would consider pneumonia and flu shots if my health deteriorates. At the moment, I'm in great shape. Haven't even lost any height. Still 5' 11". Very careful about diet and lifestyle, however.
In short, there is a place for vaccines - but like everything else these days, there is overkill in some areas, imho.
Last edited by Ariadne22; 03-18-2019 at 07:07 PM..
Here health workers can wear masks instead of getting the flu shot. I am middle of the road with vaccines and think flu shots should be optional. I also think children’s shots should be spread out.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
