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Old 04-12-2008, 09:07 AM
 
Location: Brooklyn, New York
878 posts, read 1,877,074 times
Reputation: 304

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I think that it is because some people do not understand exactly how slavery or discrimination affected the American Black community, and also the stereotypes that are affecting the Black community today. Just reading some of the posts on this thread and other threads on this forum, you see a lot of the same things written about Blacks, which I don't see as true at all. I don't see these lazy, uneducated, violent Blacks that other people see. I see hard working Blacks that understand the value of education and are constantly striving to make life better for themselves, their families and their community. I don't see the media fed image of Blacks that some people take as the true face of the Black community. I don't see the face of welfare being a Black issue, I don't see the face of crime being a Black issue, I don't see the face of affirmative action being a Black issue but this is what, over the years, have been fed and some members of society have taken these images and put some kind of faith in them. I don't see Blacks being influenced by Al Sharpton, Farrakhan, Wright that some people see. I see people who will listen to what they have to say and then make up their own minds about what they believe. I don't see this one size fits all image that some people see about Blacks. What I see and what other people see is vastly different. I don't see Blacks sitting around talking about the "White man", even though some people think that is all that we have to do. I don't see Black people sitting around talking about slavery but some people think this is an average conversation.

What I do see is people equating a poor neighborhood with Blacks. What I do see is the ghetto is technically defined as being a Black area in America. What I do see is that once Blacks start to benefit from a program that others benefit from, it all of a sudden becomes a program that has no value. What I do see is that young Black men have a high unemployment rate due to the scarcity of jobs. What I do see is what I experience on a regular basis and the understanding of if I am experiencing it because of my color or because of another reason. What I do see is the reaction of people when they find out that I am Black.

Yes, there are problems within the Black community but I would say that there are problems in most communities. Yes, some Blacks live in high crime areas but these same areas tend to be poorer areas of the community, which historically, Black or White, have a higher crime percentage. Not a race issue that I can see but more a socio-economic issue. Yes, there are certain cultural differences that Blacks have but every culture has their differences and I don't see why ours are any different then any other cultures. Being an American Black (and there is a reason why I am stating American) is a unique thing that most people don't understand or are willing to accept but that does not mean that we are prone to be underachievers, uneducated, crime ridden, lazy or violent. The slave culture has affected us in a certain way and that needs to be understood also. It is not that we are holding on to slavery but it has affected us. I think "Old Gringo" stated it very well in his post.

It's not that Blacks should get over it but it is more that everyone needs to get over the stereotypes that have been portrayed and accept each person for who they are, and not what they perceive them to be. I can't lump all Whites as being racist, or all Asians as being smart and knowing kung fu or all Jewish people as being rich or all Italians as being Mafioso or all Mexicans as living in one room or all Irish being drunks so why is it okay to lump all Blacks under one category?

Also, I think that people should get over the idea that nowadays some Blacks are benefiting from some of the same programs that help to make the White middle class. Just because it is being done later does not mean that the programs that strive to do the same thing should be eliminated. The GI Bill helped a lot of Whites achieve middle class status. Was the bill itself discriminatory? No it was not and when it was helping to lift Whites up, there was no problem with this social program. Why didn't Blacks lift themselves up with this program also? Because even though the bill was not discriminatory, the way it was administered allowed discrimination thereby excluding Blacks from benefiting in the way that Whites benefited from it. Homeownership benefited many people but red lining was a common practice, thereby eliminating Blacks from owning homes, business etc. Some of these things are just beginning to happen but change does not occur overnight but it is happening and I for one, am glad to be able to be able to see it.

 
Old 04-12-2008, 09:17 AM
 
5,485 posts, read 4,027,687 times
Reputation: 5358
Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Gringo View Post
I think it's largely because very few whites ever personally experience the discrimination that blacks encounter on a regular basis. Since they never deal with it, they assume it doesn't exist. They seem to think that everyone has the same life experiences that they themselves have had. And it's difficult for anyone to "put themselves in the other guy's shoes."

Each one of us is a product of our family history. Very few whites have an appreciation for how the slave legacy deeply influences black America to this very day. I think that the slave history is an inescapable engine powering the very core of the black soul. There's no way they'll just "get over it." It's part of their being. It's part of their identity. It's the lathe that has shaped black America.

Until we Americans can truly unite and break down the remaining ethnic barriers, our society will continue to suffer from being less than it should be. America's minority populations are a vast underutilized resource that has largely been set aside rather than brought into the mainstream. Who knows how many geniuses have been wasted due to lack of opportunity?

That said, things are improving and progress has been made. But it's moving slowly. I'd wager that the vast majority of white folks would be militantly angry if they were forced into living under the conditions that blacks and other minorities endured for generations. But perhaps then they'd understand. Perhaps then they'd appreciate that the pace of progress needs to quicken.
I don't agree. I am white and I KNOW racism exists, and I can imagine how soul damaging it must be, but I can't do anything about it, but try to understand. If a black person works hard to become a good, strong person in society I can hire them or patronize their businesses and I will appreciate that they probably had to work twice as hard to achieve their success, but if they use racism and slave history to justify not becoming a success, I can't do anything.

Many whites are not racist and would be happy to know and work with those black geniuses, but when a black person insists on painting whites as evil racists working to keep them down, we are left with nothing to do but feel bad and that helps no one.
 
Old 04-12-2008, 09:47 AM
 
Location: South Central PA
1,561 posts, read 2,915,979 times
Reputation: 337
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lets agree to disagree View Post
Why Do Whites insists that Blacks just "get over it" and move on. Or "let forget about it and treat everyone equal" ? Why do I see so many posts from whites that want blacks to forget their past. To forget slavery, discrimination. Civil Rights era. I hear...get over it! Let's just move on and treat everyone the same. Like it's that simple. Does talking about race make whites uncomfortable. Should we ask the Jews to forget the Holocaust too? Seems to me that the reason that the black community suffers from proverty, lack of self esteem, and other ills is because of the past. The discrimination of the past has lead to the endless cycle of dispair and proverty. Why are whites so scared or uncomfortable when it comes to talking about race?
There's a diffrence between forgetting and moving on. The jews moved on, the japanese moved on (we intered them during WWII), the irish have moved on, the asians who were shanghai'ed have moved on, the latin americans try to move on. The only culture stuck in the past it seems are african americans. They are the only culture to have a whole month dedicated to them, holidays, etc. If you want equality, move forward.
 
Old 04-12-2008, 09:58 AM
 
Location: New Mexico
8,264 posts, read 5,062,640 times
Reputation: 3888
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marodi View Post
There's a diffrence between forgetting and moving on. The jews moved on, the japanese moved on (we intered them during WWII), the irish have moved on, the asians who were shanghai'ed have moved on, the latin americans try to move on. The only culture stuck in the past it seems are african americans. They are the only culture to have a whole month dedicated to them, holidays, etc. If you want equality, move forward.
Of all the groups you just mentioned, which were brought to America as slaves?
 
Old 04-12-2008, 10:27 AM
 
8,187 posts, read 7,939,849 times
Reputation: 2837
From a white persons perspective, nothing can be gained by rehashing slavery. It cannot be changed, and it seems (again from a white person perspective) that to discuss slavery is to blame white people living and dead. And we don't want to go there. Blame the people who owned slaves, who victimized slaves, who legalized the practice and of course those that caught Africans and sold them in the first place (other Africans), but don't blame whites who are alive today. We don't want, need or deserve the guilt trip.
Now, if you want to talk about Jim Crow laws, you might have a better leg to stand on since the people who benefited from them and pushed them into law and defended the practices are still alive. But it also needs to be remembered that doesn't include all whites. And that is a mistake some blacks make when wanting to discuss slavery and Jim Crow.......not all whites participated in or even agreed with those practices.
We should always remember the mistakes and travesties of the past so that we don't repeat them.....but we cannot use them as excuses for continued victimhood. Surely there are more relevent problems that can be addressed and sought to change.
 
Old 04-12-2008, 10:39 AM
 
Location: Transition Island
946 posts, read 1,416,644 times
Reputation: 333
Quote:
Originally Posted by miu View Post
America could have survived without any slaves. What about all the pioneers and farmers in the north, midwest and west that cleared the land by themselves and without slave labor? I think that you give the work of black slaves too much credit. If I could turn back time, I would wish that the blacks were never brought over as slaves, but I can't.

And the Chinese, Irish and many other immigrant groups weren't exactly welcomed to America with open arms and love. So many other groups came to these shores with nothing by the clothes on their backs. Only with stubborness, deaf ears to shut out the racial slurs, and a willingness to do menial hard work, were they able to better themselves.

Anyway, complain all you want, I have no pity for the blacks at this point in time. I remember about 20 years ago while working at a Japanese restaurant, the Japanese people there had no sympathy for blacks. All they knew was that they got to where they were from working long hours and saving their money. From their perspective, they didn't observe the poor blacks in their neighborhood working as hard as they were. You don't see Japanese people just hanging out on stoops listening to their boomboxes. Yes, that is a terrible stereotype, but if that's what they saw the poor blacks in the city doing, then what else are they to think?

And it comes down to the fact that ultimately that everyone has to take responsibility for ourselves. How much money I make is up to me. Only I am responsible for my actions. If I choose to be a lazy @ss, then it's my fault when I am short of funds. And there have been several times in my life where I worked two full time jobs at the same time in order to meet my goals. The jobs and opportunities are out there. And sometimes, it means working a job that is less than desirable, but honest work is honest work. I've been a waitress, a bike factory worker, a shipping clerk and a cashier. I've even sold cars and sold at flea markets. I sell on eBay. There are always ways to make money.

And how I make the most of my income? I chose not to have children. I drive cars that are over ten years old. Manual transmission Hondas last forever. I purchase secondhand goods. My tv and computers are craigslist specials and one computer is from a garbage pile. I don't dress flashy and I love thrift stores. I don't own a cellphone.

And I love the internet because it makes it even easier to research and learn about new things. I also love to visit my local public library. Having knowledge is the one power. No one is keeping the black people away from acquiring this true knowledge. If there schools are underfunded, it's still possible to get a decent education as long as the students want to learn.

To be honest, more money thrown at schools will not solve the educational issues with blacks. Not as long as the students don't want to learn and the teachers are getting assaulted in those schools. I know a few teachers and the best teachers in the world can't teach an unwilling student. So the black community needs to instill in their youth that passion for learning before any real progress can be made. Listen to Bill Cosby and not Farrakhan and Rev. Wright.
Your comment continue to lack any merit or significance MIU. No I will not listen to Bill Cosby-he is not my idol nor is he the spokesperson for the black people. Not once have we asked you to have pity for us. Who personally has asked you to have pity for them?

Your statements about working hard and getting educated is the norm for most black people, so why do you continue to speak on this topic. You sound like a broken record that has more scratches detected each time your comments roll out on this forum. Do you know the inventions of black people in this country-I doubt it because you have mentioned so many negatives, you fail to want to know the positive contributions they have made. I sincerely detect that you do not like black people by the statements that you make-which is always negativity towards how we think, feel, and behave. Are you upset that your people did not have the black man's experience here in America. You keep trying to compare our experiences, and they were drastically different MIU. GOOD THAT YOUR PEOPLE ADOPTED A DIFFERENT WAY OF LIFE COMPARED TO BLACK PEOPLE. Does that make you feel better MIU!!

All the students I have taught want to learn. Most student do, but something does happen around early adolescent time that prevents some of them from staying on track. Dropouts occur from many racial groups, just not black students-although they may be the majority.
 
Old 04-12-2008, 10:41 AM
 
522 posts, read 911,141 times
Reputation: 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by skoro View Post
Of all the groups you just mentioned, which were brought to America as slaves?

Chinese women and children. Used as easily replaceable "throw-away" prostitutes.
 
Old 04-12-2008, 10:43 AM
 
Location: Transition Island
946 posts, read 1,416,644 times
Reputation: 333
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lets agree to disagree View Post
With all due respect, you as an Asian can not tell Blacks to get over it. Because of the Slaves work, this country was able to grow and prosper.Your family wasn't brought her on slaves ships across the pacific in horrifc, subhuman conditions. Asians did not live in the South and told to sit in the back of the bus and drink from seperate fountains. So YOU have NO RIGHT to tell blacks to get over it. Chip on their shoulder...ignorance!And Jews can hide their religion...blacks can not hide the color of their skin. You need to learn a lot about race in this country.
Miu needs to learn about many races throughout the country other than her own. Sounds like a broken record most times and really has a host of negative comments to spew towards people who are not like herself. Miu's anger is definitely misdirected.
 
Old 04-12-2008, 10:49 AM
 
522 posts, read 911,141 times
Reputation: 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heaveno View Post
Your statements about working hard and getting educated is the norm for most black people, so why do you continue to speak on this topic. You sound like a broken record that has more scratches detected each time your comments roll out on this forum. Do you know the inventions of black people in this country-I doubt it because you have mentioned so many negatives, you fail to want to know the positive contributions they have made. I sincerely detect that you do not like black people by the statements that you make-which is always negativity towards how we think, feel, and behave. Are you upset that your people did not have the black man's experience here in America. You keep trying to compare our experiences, and they were drastically different MIU. GOOD THAT YOUR PEOPLE ADOPTED A DIFFERENT WAY OF LIFE COMPARED TO BLACK PEOPLE. Does that make you feel better MIU!!

.
Wow, did she hit a nerve?

Last I checked this was a discussion board. Why must you personally attack somebody when they make an intelligent post? Look at my previous post. Maybe Miu is Chinese. Maybe she should get her own history month for all the bad things that may have happened to her ancestors when they were bought and caged and brought to America to sexually service the men in the Old West? Look it up.
 
Old 04-12-2008, 10:53 AM
 
1,739 posts, read 2,127,279 times
Reputation: 1903
Becuase it helps no one. I'm Black/White, and guess what, I don't care about Slavery. Wanna know why? Becuase I don't let racism stop me from living the life I want to live. I go out and have fun, work hard, travel, read, and flirt with women (including White ones)


I have mad love for Black people and their extrodinary talents, but if you stew in hate, it will come back to bite you. Jesus himself said "Judge not, les ye be judged". Maybe if the ethnicites of the world stopped keeping score and focused on making themselves happy, their may never be wars or any of this bull****.
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