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But what if these young men did not comply with instructions? Saying that people are not complying with instructions does not make it the fault of driver.....when the instructions are unjust. Some times you are having a bad day....and you are just tired and don't feel like putting up with BS from police.....or jack boys for that matter. If the jack boys ask you to "run it"....you might not comply because you are just not taking slit no more that day. It's not really their fault if they get shot by the robber. Same thing holds with police like in the videos. They were in the wrong and if their wrong actions created bad reactions that lead to police shooting.....its really the police at fault.
If you don't "feel like" complying, don't complain about the consequences.
But what if these young men did not comply with instructions? Saying that people are not complying with instructions does not make it the fault of driver.....when the instructions are unjust. Some times you are having a bad day....and you are just tired and don't feel like putting up with BS from police.....or jack boys for that matter. If the jack boys ask you to "run it"....you might not comply because you are just not taking slit no more that day. It's not really their fault if they get shot by the robber. Same thing holds with police like in the videos. They were in the wrong and if their wrong actions created bad reactions that lead to police shooting.....its really the police at fault.
1. If someone does not comply with instructions, then they have crosses a threashold and deserve what happens. Cops are often faced with armed people who may seek to kill or injure them. As a result, ALWAYS follow instructions or face the consequences.
2. No doubt in my mind that more blacks are pulled over proportionately than whites due to profiling.
3. Whites are racist.......... but so are blacks. In fact, blacks are probably worse racists than whites. Witness the common public negative comments made toward whites in the news among actors, sports characters, and politicians. It would be considered shocking if a white person said the same thing.
4. Most crimes are committed by blacks- as such, profiling makes logical sense, even though it may not be "fair". If one is fishing for trout, you do so in cool, fast moving stream, not on asphalt. Likewise if you are looking for criminals, the most likely demographic is young black males. That is simply a fact. Does it condone profiling? Maybe yes- maybe no.
If you want to cut profiling, seeking to reduce crime among your cohort is a good start.
5. Police are people as well. Police are often killed by criminals in confrontations such as the one you describe. Who knows what happened to them the day or week before? While it does not make what they did correct, it is more understandable. On the other hand, maybe these cops have a habit of roughing up everyone, regardless of race.
If you don't "feel like" complying, don't complain about the consequences.
One should never "feel" like complying when instructed to do something that is wrong. What if a male officer stopped a female driver and then instructed her to take expose her breast so that he can be sure she is not hiding anything?
Here is the thing. We are all the time hearing statistics about black crime. One of the officers was even mentioning statistics when speaking with the mother of the young man detained by police. Hence, people highly aware of statistics, consciously or subconsciously, are likely going to see black people as more likely to be criminal and dangerous than a white person. Thus, while I do not think such behavior is exclusive for blacks, I do believe that it is endemic with blacks.
There are studies that show a good percentage of whites hold some degree or racial bias. Is it unreasonable to suggest, therefore, that the police force would be reflective of this general propensity and that the actions of some officers are indeed influenced by race?
I agree with all of that, but it doesn't address my question, at all.
You specifically made this thread about American descendants of slaves. I'm saying this kid would have gotten the same treatment had he been of Afro-Caribbean extraction. No sense - or value - dividing it any further than "black" in this scenario, IMO.
1. If someone does not comply with instructions, then they have crosses a threashold and deserve what happens. Cops are often faced with armed people who may seek to kill or injure them. As a result, ALWAYS follow instructions or face the consequences.
The same can be said of victims of robberies who end up getting shot and killed. Robbers have to deal with armed people all the time....they are under a lot of stress and danger so if you are being robbed and you do not comply....I guess you deserve to be shot.
2. No doubt in my mind that more blacks are pulled over proportionately than whites due to profiling.
Thanks for the patronage.
3. Whites are racist.......... but so are blacks. In fact, blacks are probably worse racists than whites. Witness the common public negative comments made toward whites in the news among actors, sports characters, and politicians. It would be considered shocking if a white person said the same thing.
Racism is rooted in the doctrine of one race being inferior to another and attributing behavior and outcomes to race. I mostly see blacks as racist against blacks more than I see them as racist against whites. Think about it. After all these centuries of abuse....whites are not the primary target of black anger and violence, like one would think. Rather, blacks release that anger upon each other.
4. Most crimes are committed by blacks- as such, profiling makes logical sense, even though it may not be "fair". If one is fishing for trout, you do so in cool, fast moving stream, not on asphalt. Likewise if you are looking for criminals, the most likely demographic is young black males. That is simply a fact. Does it condone profiling? Maybe yes- maybe no.
Yeah...but that is a symptom of most racism coming from whites.
If you want to cut profiling, seeking to reduce crime among your cohort is a good start.
Ultimately, reducing white racism and its historical damage would resolve that.
5. Police are people as well. Police are often killed by criminals in confrontations such as the one you describe. Who knows what happened to them the day or week before? While it does not make what they did correct, it is more understandable. On the other hand, maybe these cops have a habit of roughing up everyone, regardless of race.
Well....some police officers manage to get it right. Why can't all of them? When a black person becomes successful, whites like to say that such is proof that the other blacks have no excuses. Well, these other other officers have no excuses for their behavior due to the fact that others are not acting like that and they deal with the same threats.
I agree with all of that, but it doesn't address my question, at all.
You specifically made this thread about American descendants of slaves. I'm saying this kid would have gotten the same treatment had he been of Afro-Caribbean extraction. No sense - or value - dividing it any further than "black" in this scenario, IMO.
That is true.....but the reason is that these others are assumed to be ADOS when stopped.
I consider myself lucky. I'm turning 30 this year, African-American male, and have never had this happen to me. Even when I was driving without insurance in a predominately white area after work, I basically got a slap on the wrist- a ticket and having to carry a SR-22 for 3 years, but car wasn't towed.
But I will be lying to you if I my heart didn't beat a little faster than normal on occasions when I see the siren flashes behind me. You just never know.
Last edited by Chicagoland60426; 04-25-2019 at 10:40 AM..
One should never "feel" like complying when instructed to do something that is wrong. What if a male officer stopped a female driver and then instructed her to take expose her breast so that he can be sure she is not hiding anything?
That is a whole lot different than asking someone to sit down, or put their hands up or be still. I believe you know exactly what I meant. The spirit of rebellion in so many young people leads to consequences from authority- always has, always will.
By whom and how do you know? You think that those cops gave one second to differentiating between ADOS' and, say, Haitians? You're crazy.
Those cops probably don't know what a Haitian looks like. It also depends on the type of care you are driving. If you are driving a Honda Civic....that is not a stereotypical car of the type of people the police are trying to catch.
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