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Old 06-01-2019, 07:57 AM
 
Location: Ft Myers, FL
2,591 posts, read 1,286,906 times
Reputation: 4812

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Red Flag laws

Quote:
A red flag law is a gun violence prevention law that permits police or family members to petition a state court to order the temporary removal of firearms from a person who may present a danger to others or themselves.
"a person who may present a danger to others or themselves."

Stand Your Ground laws

Quote:
A stand-your-ground law (sometimes called "line in the sand" or "no duty to retreat" law) establishes a right by which a person may defend one's self or others (right of self-defense) against threats or perceived threats, even to the point of applying lethal force, regardless of whether safely retreating from the situation might have been possible.
"against threats or perceived threats"

Both laws allow or disallow firearm usage based upon perceptions.

Opponents of Red Flag Laws claim, "The Govt cannot take firearms away from someone who has not yet acted on a threat." Lack of Due Process. A valid, Constitutionally protected right.

Adherents to Stand Your Ground laws claim, "I can use my firearm against someone who has not yet acted on a threat." Right of self-defense. A valid, Constitutionally protected right.

The Govt can't take a gun away from someone who has not acted on a threat, but Average Joe can take their life. It's the law. Power to the People.

But there are already twenty-two thousand unenforceable, illegal gun laws on the books. Should we get rid of these two, since they're both based on mere perception? How could it be claimed that one's a good law and the other is a bad law?
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Old 06-01-2019, 08:47 AM
 
Location: Bellevue WA
1,194 posts, read 354,850 times
Reputation: 1355
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corvette Ministries View Post
Red Flag laws



"a person who may present a danger to others or themselves."

Stand Your Ground laws



"against threats or perceived threats"

Both laws allow or disallow firearm usage based upon perceptions.

Opponents of Red Flag Laws claim, "The Govt cannot take firearms away from someone who has not yet acted on a threat." Lack of Due Process. A valid, Constitutionally protected right.

Adherents to Stand Your Ground laws claim, "I can use my firearm against someone who has not yet acted on a threat." Right of self-defense. A valid, Constitutionally protected right.

The Govt can't take a gun away from someone who has not acted on a threat, but Average Joe can take their life. It's the law. Power to the People.

But there are already twenty-two thousand unenforceable, illegal gun laws on the books. Should we get rid of these two, since they're both based on mere perception? How could it be claimed that one's a good law and the other is a bad law?
The stand your ground law was used as a tool by Raul Rodriguez to kill his neighbor in 2012. He got a new trial in 2014, and the jury came back with life, which was more than what he was given at his first trial. The stand your ground law is transparent. It's justification for murder, and where is the law predominantly? In the South and the East Coast. Imagine that. Hardly any out here in the West and the Rocky Mountain region.
I think the red flag law was made for people here in Washington. It gives the police the right to take the gun(s) from unstable individuals, and not give them back until the person has been cleared by a mental health professional. Don't they have to have a history of mental instability?
We have alot of people with mental instability up here. I believe in the red flag law. . The stand your ground law, not so much. It's going to mess up people's lives if they think it means they can act with impunity.
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Old 06-01-2019, 08:56 AM
 
Location: SGV
24,761 posts, read 9,647,370 times
Reputation: 9715
Fictional scribblings vs fictional scribblings for $1000, Alex.
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Old 06-01-2019, 09:04 AM
 
1,833 posts, read 1,082,877 times
Reputation: 1500
Years ago (or maybe decades) there was a concept widely accepted in governmental and corporate institutions called “perception is reality” whereby managers and supervisors could deal with delusional but harmless employees with moderate personal problems.
This concept has now spread throughout society to excuse the harmful behaviors of fanatics on both ends of the political spectrum.
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Old 06-01-2019, 02:53 PM
 
Location: Ft Myers, FL
2,591 posts, read 1,286,906 times
Reputation: 4812
Both laws are based on a perception of a threat.

Both laws favor the gun owner.
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Old 06-01-2019, 03:45 PM
 
9,580 posts, read 4,592,411 times
Reputation: 5453
The "stand your round" law allows you to protect yourself instead of being expected to try to run away. In Missouri, you cannot be sued for shooting someone that you deem a threat.
The "red flag" law means if someone lies about you, you are considered guilty until you can prove you are innocent.
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Old 06-01-2019, 04:10 PM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
66,458 posts, read 33,763,754 times
Reputation: 14226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corvette Ministries View Post
Both laws are based on a perception of a threat.

Both laws favor the gun owner.
Why are you yourself, no longer able to purchase a fully automatic weapon? They took that away and turned it into a privilege.
Why are you yourself, no longer able to purchase a short barrel shotgun? They took that away and turned it into a privilege.
Why are you yourself, no longer able to purchase a short barrel rifle? They took that away and turned it into a privilege.
Why are you yourself restricted from carrying a weapon? They took that away and turned it into a privilege.
Why are you yourself, restricted from walking into a retail establishment picking out what you want, paying the bill and walk out of the store in 5 minutes? They took that away and turned it into a privilege.

Let me read what the contract actually says.


The right of the people. The only time you are no longer considered a person, is when you yourself are incarcerated and placed into bondage, or dead.


To keep. It is my liberty to keep my arms where ever I wish, even crammed up my ass as I walk down the street. In my pocket, in my waistband, or holstered. Government has no say what so ever, according to the contract, that allows government to even exist in the first place.


And bear. That means brandish. Straight up. There is no other interpretation available for that.


Arms. The reason it is not specific in what arms. Because that is your individual liberty to choose for yourself, how you defend yourself, your family and your property. It surely doesn't state "small arms".


They were not running out of ink. They could have been specific as down to the material used, to create the peoples arms. If it is not specific in any contract, it is called LIBERTY. The freedom for you to decide for yourself.
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Old 06-01-2019, 04:39 PM
 
18,800 posts, read 9,617,882 times
Reputation: 5281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corvette Ministries View Post
Red Flag laws



"a person who may present a danger to others or themselves."

Stand Your Ground laws



"against threats or perceived threats"

Both laws allow or disallow firearm usage based upon perceptions.

Opponents of Red Flag Laws claim, "The Govt cannot take firearms away from someone who has not yet acted on a threat." Lack of Due Process. A valid, Constitutionally protected right.

Adherents to Stand Your Ground laws claim, "I can use my firearm against someone who has not yet acted on a threat." Right of self-defense. A valid, Constitutionally protected right.

The Govt can't take a gun away from someone who has not acted on a threat, but Average Joe can take their life. It's the law. Power to the People.

But there are already twenty-two thousand unenforceable, illegal gun laws on the books. Should we get rid of these two, since they're both based on mere perception? How could it be claimed that one's a good law and the other is a bad law?
Intellectual honesty deficiency is the new plague.
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Old 06-01-2019, 05:35 PM
 
9,580 posts, read 4,592,411 times
Reputation: 5453
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corvette Ministries View Post
Red Flag laws



"a person who may present a danger to others or themselves."

Stand Your Ground laws



"against threats or perceived threats"

Both laws allow or disallow firearm usage based upon perceptions.

Opponents of Red Flag Laws claim, "The Govt cannot take firearms away from someone who has not yet acted on a threat." Lack of Due Process. A valid, Constitutionally protected right.

Adherents to Stand Your Ground laws claim, "I can use my firearm against someone who has not yet acted on a threat." Right of self-defense. A valid, Constitutionally protected right.

The Govt can't take a gun away from someone who has not acted on a threat, but Average Joe can take their life. It's the law. Power to the People.

But there are already twenty-two thousand unenforceable, illegal gun laws on the books. Should we get rid of these two, since they're both based on mere perception? How could it be claimed that one's a good law and the other is a bad law?
You can only respond under the "stand your ground" law if they are perceived as a threat.
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Old 06-01-2019, 05:46 PM
 
4,446 posts, read 876,221 times
Reputation: 1890
Quote:
Originally Posted by No_Recess View Post
Fictional scribblings vs fictional scribblings for $1000, Alex.
Screw that, I just want $1000.
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