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View Poll Results: Would you rather pay $5000 more in private premiums than $2000 more in health care taxes?
Yes, paying more to the insurance companies ensure that I am free 27 29.67%
No, paying less into a Medicare-style system is the sensible thing to do 64 70.33%
Voters: 91. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-08-2019, 06:00 PM
 
Location: SGV
24,791 posts, read 9,655,665 times
Reputation: 9722

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Choices for us slaves?

Who says humanity is in decline?
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Old 06-08-2019, 06:10 PM
 
Location: Upstate NY
35,480 posts, read 10,503,840 times
Reputation: 33590
I like pie.
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Old 06-08-2019, 06:19 PM
 
Location: Divided Tribes of America
13,696 posts, read 5,520,095 times
Reputation: 5378
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea View Post
I would prefer you be like Switzerland.

Ban healthcare monopolies like Switzerland has.

In addition to banning monopolies like Switzerland has, limit healthcare providers to one facility per region, like Switzerland has (the Swiss limit one per canton).

In addition to banning monopolies and limiting healthcare providers to one facility per region, like Switzerland has, encourage competition like Switzerland has.

The second you ban hospital monopolies and cartels, the cost of medical care drops 30% to 60%.

The second the cost of medical care drops 30% to 60%, the cost of health plan coverage drops 30% to 60%.

The second you repeal federal and state laws banning clinics and polyclinics, healthcare will shift from the antiquated costly ineffective and inefficient Hospital Model to the modern, inexpensive, highly effective and highly efficient Clinic and Polyclinic Model like Switzerland, Germany, the Netherlands, France, Belgium, Poland, Romania, Hungaria, Austria, Norway, Denmark and Finland use.

That will reduce medical costs another 10% to 30% and in turn reduces the cost of health plan coverage another 10% to 30%.
Sounds great. Do you think the Republican Party will enact any of it?
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Old 06-08-2019, 06:29 PM
 
Location: Watervliet, NY
4,250 posts, read 1,570,647 times
Reputation: 7801
Quote:
Originally Posted by neko_mimi View Post
The insurance company doesnít dictate anything. You can use the services of any doctor you want. If your insurance doesnít cover it, either change plans or change providers to one that does.
Really... ever heard of "in network" and "out of network" coverage? Not every plan offers OON coverage, which means you can only use doctors or providers that are in their networks.

You also can't just change plans whenever you want to either, especially if you have a plan that only allows enrollment during a certain period of time.
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Old 06-08-2019, 09:03 PM
 
Location: Barrington
45,815 posts, read 34,041,047 times
Reputation: 15303
Quote:
Originally Posted by petch751 View Post
I worked in healthcare starting in 1984 and it is very different since Hillary tried to enact Hillary care. Before that health care was patient centric (and better), after Hillarycare hospitals became proactive and made changes. Your healthcare became insurance centric.

The ER will always look chaotic to the onlooker but everyone there is part of a team each performing their own job all with the goal of helping the patient.
Hillarycare was conceptual legislation that died in 1994.

ER was a fictional show set in a county trauma level one hospital.

I was referring to the portrayal of insurance, lack thereof, costs and ongoing references to obesity being a serious contributing factor to disease.
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Old 06-08-2019, 09:17 PM
 
Location: Barrington
45,815 posts, read 34,041,047 times
Reputation: 15303
Quote:
Originally Posted by Originalist View Post
You have it backward.



The only people unwilling to pay more and leaving it up to the state do not actually use or need it.


Those of us over 50 know full well the difference.


ACA is what drove prices through the roof for insurance with $12k deductibles. Few of us could keep our plans and our doctors. It was a complete farce.




exactly correct!
No such thing as a $12,000 deductible on an individual plan. The maximum out of pocket for 2019 is $7900 for an individual and $15,000 for family. This includes the deductible.

Insurance premiums increased 100% between 2000-2010, before the ACA. Most plans excluded preexisting conditions and had either an annual or lifetime cap on claims.

The average deductible is $1573 for an individual and $2,788 for a family plan.
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Old 06-08-2019, 09:27 PM
 
Location: Barrington
45,815 posts, read 34,041,047 times
Reputation: 15303
Quote:
Originally Posted by citidata18 View Post
You do realize the ACA's health care plans are still administered by the private insurance industry, yes?
9 years later and no shortage of people persist in the belief that the ACA is insurance, instead of legislation. States continue to have primary responsibility for regulating insurers. No two states have the same regulations. For example, one state may mandate insurers cover ABC medication while an adjoining state does not. Makes no diff unless you need the ABC medication.

Many factors beyond an individualís control impact premiums. Premiums for the same plan, underwritten by the same insurer, in the same state are variable.

Number and type of claims in your local market

Ratio healthcare providers : local population

Ratio hospital beds : local population

Number insurers operating in your local market
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Old 06-08-2019, 09:34 PM
 
Location: Barrington
45,815 posts, read 34,041,047 times
Reputation: 15303
Quote:
Originally Posted by skeddy View Post
can you imagine what emergency rooms would look like if we had universal health care? lol

there's a whole culture of people that have always gone to the emergency for care, they don't want a private doctor, those numbers will just quadruple. Visits to the Emergency rooms went up under Obamacare, it would only get worse.
Hospitals, especially trauma hospitals, do a good job of triage assessments.

Most major hospitals operate urgent care clinics for diversion purposes to take the load off the ER, where state allow it. Again, so much of what is healthcare is regulated by the state.
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Old 06-08-2019, 09:38 PM
 
Location: Barrington
45,815 posts, read 34,041,047 times
Reputation: 15303
Quote:
Originally Posted by citidata18 View Post
It would help if states would lift their restrictions on the expansion of urgent care clinics.

Georgia is one state that's still stuck in the stone ages when it comes to establishing and expanding hospitals.
Many states have no restrictions.

There are 5 Urgent Care Clinic within a 10 minute drive of my house.

I appreciate that those living in rural areas often have to travel 100+ miles.
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Old 06-08-2019, 09:48 PM
 
Location: Barrington
45,815 posts, read 34,041,047 times
Reputation: 15303
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea View Post
Taxes would cost more $5,000.

I would prefer you be like Switzerland.

Ban healthcare monopolies like Switzerland has.

In addition to banning monopolies like Switzerland has, limit healthcare providers to one facility per region, like Switzerland has (the Swiss limit one per canton).

In addition to banning monopolies and limiting healthcare providers to one facility per region, like Switzerland has, encourage competition like Switzerland has.

The second you ban hospital monopolies and cartels, the cost of medical care drops 30% to 60%.

The second the cost of medical care drops 30% to 60%, the cost of health plan coverage drops 30% to 60%.

The second you repeal federal and state laws banning clinics and polyclinics, healthcare will shift from the antiquated costly ineffective and inefficient Hospital Model to the modern, inexpensive, highly effective and highly efficient Clinic and Polyclinic Model like Switzerland, Germany, the Netherlands, France, Belgium, Poland, Romania, Hungaria, Austria, Norway, Denmark and Finland use.

That will reduce medical costs another 10% to 30% and in turn reduces the cost of health plan coverage another 10% to 30%.

After you've done those things, come talk to us about "Medicare-for-All."
There is no public insurance in Switzerland. Everyone from birth to death is covered by private insurance. Insurers are not allowed to profit off basic insurance. The healthy 20 year old pays the same premium as a sickly 88 year old.

Most carry supplemental insurance to cover what basic insurance does not. The population is culturally risk adverse and 99+% of the population buys insurance.

About 40% of premiums are subsidized by government.

Most hospitals are public vs most in the US are private.

the clinic/ poly clinic model is alive and well in Switzerland.
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