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Old 06-08-2019, 02:21 PM
 
Location: PSL
8,231 posts, read 2,202,308 times
Reputation: 2936

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BoBromhal View Post
the 45% stat was very interesting, and made me double-check some info I was pretty sure of...

1. UT is so low because of the # of Mormons who then do their missionary service immediately, rather than later.

2. Knowing that 40% of adults = college graduates puts a state in the top 10 of educational attainment, I then found this ....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...nal_attainment.

3. It made me wonder ... what's the value of NY state having 70% of HS grads go to college if then only 35% of their adult population has a college degree? Do 1/2 the students really drop out w/o getting a degree? Certainly NYS doesn't have a large net migration OUT of young degree-holders?

4. One would think that of course, there are "a lot" of highly-ranked HS's in urban areas. If 71% of the US population lives in urban areas, wouldn't they have 70% of the best schools?

the problem is - see NYC - where the # of seats available is so far below those that want to attend.
Yes. Alot do drop out. Of the 50 or so of who I was closest with in highschool, there is me, my little sister, and about a dozen who did complete college, graduate, and be employed in the fields we studied.
14-16 tops.

Why do they drop out? Because the fools wanted to have the "college experience" party and spring break... or fell hook line and sinker for used car salesman tactics of you need my college and my courses if you want to make it.

And decided halfway through this isn't all that it's cracked up to be...

Hey... when mom and dad are refinancing the house and flipping most of the bill... why stay and keep your nose to the grind stone? You didn't have to put money up for it. Why take it so serious?

It'll be fine... not like you can't move back in with mom and dad anyways...

This is why I vehemently disagree with going to college immediately after graduating highschool... take 2 or 3 years off and work. Get a taste of the real world in a field you are interested in... then decide if it's worth pursuing debt for...
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Old 06-08-2019, 02:26 PM
 
Location: Washington State
18,521 posts, read 9,574,204 times
Reputation: 15782
Quote:
Originally Posted by NY_refugee87 View Post
Yes. Alot do drop out. Of the 50 or so of who I was closest with in highschool, there is me, my little sister, and about a dozen who did complete college, graduate, and be employed in the fields we studied.
14-16 tops.

Why do they drop out? Because the fools wanted to have the "college experience" party and spring break... or fell hook line and sinker for used car salesman tactics of you need my college and my courses if you want to make it.

And decided halfway through this isn't all that it's cracked up to be...

Hey... when mom and dad are refinancing the house and flipping most of the bill... why stay and keep your nose to the grind stone? You didn't have to put money up for it. Why take it so serious?

It'll be fine... not like you can't move back in with mom and dad anyways...

This is why I vehemently disagree with going to college immediately after graduating highschool... take 2 or 3 years off and work. Get a taste of the real world in a field you are interested in... then decide if it's worth pursuing debt for...
I'm going to lightly disagree with you because I think you have a good point but too many don't go directly to college and then get off track...I would say don't get off the education cycle until you have at least a BS degree.
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Old 06-08-2019, 02:26 PM
 
Location: PSL
8,231 posts, read 2,202,308 times
Reputation: 2936
Quote:
Originally Posted by lchoro View Post
Utah has one of the lowest percentage of high school graduates who go on to college.

45 percent

The dollar numbers also aren't comparable since real estate values and cost of living are much higher.

Families don't choose states because of schools. They choose neighborhoods and specific schools, public or private. A lot of the top nationally ranked high schools are in urban areas.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freak80 View Post
True about New York state.

Even so, Iíd rather live in secular NY then ultra-religious UT. I donít want people voting for things just because they think ďgodĒ demands it.
Don't knock it until you've tried it...
I moved into an area in Florida that is very... bible belty...

The people are far more pleasant than NY... exception being snowbirds... those rude old pricks can leave. The ones that berate and tell others how they do things back home...

I side with native Floridians in their stance of Yankee go home. Can't say conservatives are closed minded to change... it's those transplants who want to turn Florida into the chitholes they ruined who want Florida to be just like back home... only tropical...
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Old 06-08-2019, 02:32 PM
Status: "think locally, act yokelly." (set 24 days ago)
 
Location: Clyde Hill, WA
3,302 posts, read 580,763 times
Reputation: 983
Quote:
Originally Posted by lchoro View Post
Utah has one of the lowest percentage of high school graduates who go on to college.

45 percent

The dollar numbers also aren't comparable since real estate values and cost of living are much higher.

Families don't choose states because of schools. They choose neighborhoods and specific schools, public or private. A lot of the top nationally ranked high schools are in urban areas.
The numbers don't lie. This has been shown over and over. The US is routinely in the top 2-5 in the world in per-pupil spending. We're in the mid-twenties (and sliding) in educational results, as measured by PISA scores.
http://www.city-data.com/forum/53778079-post10.html

Quote:
In public education, of particular significance for citizen opportunity, in math the U.S. was ranked 31st out of 35 OECD countries (the other advanced economies using the respected PISA process) in 2015, down from 25 in 2009, ... As political divisions have kept increasing, the ability of the parties to come together on landmark legislation has become a thing of the past (see Figure 4). A broken political system has become the greatest threat to our nationís future. (emphasis added)
You can slice it and dice it all you wish with real estate and other data. Denial, it ain't just a river in Egypt.
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Old 06-08-2019, 02:35 PM
 
6,328 posts, read 2,690,658 times
Reputation: 2334
Quote:
Originally Posted by lovecrowds View Post
https://www.governing.com/topics/edu...enue-data.html

https://www.nationsreportcard.gov/pr...MN&year=2017R3

287 average math score in Utah vs 282 in NY and 277 in California.

NY spends $23,000 per-pupil, DC spends $21,000 and Utah spends $7,100 yet Utah has much higher test scores.

Looks like Utah has much better education systems, despite spending less than one-third of the amount per pupil.

With the emphasis on STEM these days, Utah students seem to much, much prepared than New York while they spend a third of the price per student.

California spends 50% more per student than Arizona, yet Arizona has much, much higher test scores. ($12,000 per student in California, compared to $8,000 in Arizona)
Isn't that like comparing the cost in a high cost of living state vs a low cost state?
Of course it will be higher in NY.


You can get a job at McDonald's in Alabama for 7 bucks an hour or in NY for 15 bucks an hour.
Which is better for the worker?
It is a moot point...
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Old 06-08-2019, 04:58 PM
 
29,741 posts, read 16,436,124 times
Reputation: 13817
Just proves that some govt schools are worse than others, but doesnt change the fact that all are terrible
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Old 06-08-2019, 05:22 PM
 
Location: Wartrace,TN
5,549 posts, read 8,892,941 times
Reputation: 11061
Rochester N.Y. is spending close to 30,000 per student and has abysmal results. I suspect the reason is paying for outsize pensions and overpaid administrators along with widespread corruption. It costs less to attend a S.U.N.Y. college than educate the hood rats in Rochester.
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Old 06-08-2019, 05:44 PM
 
Location: Japan
10,727 posts, read 4,424,866 times
Reputation: 6904
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldhag1 View Post
School success, including test scores, are primarily determined by the quality of the parents and their parenting practices, regardless of any other factor. It is not that Utah has a much better education system, itís that they have better parents.
Regardless of any other factor? Really? Tell me, why do you think siblings growing up in the same house with the same parents have different educational outcomes?
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Old 06-08-2019, 05:54 PM
 
Location: Japan
10,727 posts, read 4,424,866 times
Reputation: 6904
Quote:
Originally Posted by remco67 View Post
Every Morman i have ever meet has had very strong families and valued education, this cannot help but increase Utah's scores. Especially when compared with States who are dealing with larger populations of single parent households and population groups that don't necessarily value education as much as they probably should.
Groups go with their strengths. They tend to put value on what they are good at. Why would we expect people who have a tough time with, for example, math... or basketball, to develop cultures which value putting in a lot of time studying math or practicing basketball?
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Old 06-08-2019, 05:58 PM
509
 
2,977 posts, read 4,081,098 times
Reputation: 3526
Quote:
Originally Posted by remco67 View Post
Every Morman i have ever meet has had very strong families and valued education, this cannot help but increase Utah's scores. Especially when compared with States who are dealing with larger populations of single parent households and population groups that don't necessarily value education as much as they probably should.
Yeah, they really need to include the spending on "education" by the LDS church in those statistics!!

Your absolutely right....
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