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Old 06-10-2019, 08:17 PM
 
1,352 posts, read 691,441 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usayit View Post
You missed the point.... let me clarify.. it is irrelevant.. privacy is right as well.

No one's stopping you from flying to Germany or Thailand, or driving to Mexico.
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Old 06-10-2019, 08:20 PM
 
7,109 posts, read 1,785,681 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nedergras View Post
No one's stopping you from flying to Germany or Thailand, or driving to Mexico.

It is illegal in Mexico but tolerated in certain areas.



Just drive to your nearest city in the bad part of town in America. You pretend that the fact its illegal means its not happening all the time.
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Old 06-10-2019, 08:21 PM
 
1,352 posts, read 691,441 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklazona Bound View Post
Just drive to your nearest city in the bad part of town. You pretend that the fact its illegal means its not happening all the time.

Go ahead.
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Old 06-10-2019, 08:22 PM
 
Location: NNJ
9,523 posts, read 5,365,231 times
Reputation: 10477
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGirl415 View Post
I never said all prostitutes are any of those things. I 100% stand by the statement that for most women it is not truly voluntary and they are desperate and that it is not something most women aspire to do, even in the best circumstances.

I also have experience working in sex crimes in general. Including prostitution and trafficking. And studying it from a legal aspect.
Again.. incorrect assumption since you only have observation from the crime aspect of it. Not all sex workers are trafficked.. nor will ever run into a sex crime enforcement.

Most a voluntary.

Most of the involuntary victims are kept in that situation with no escape in part because of the illegal nature of their work. The vary laws that are suppose to protect them are turning them into victims. There are case studies regarding decriminalizing of minor in prostitution in CA... they are treated as victims rather than criminals and the johns are prosecuted under statutory rape which carries a higher penality. These minors come forward because they no longer fear being arrested. Now just imagine if that were applied to prostitutes in general.
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Old 06-10-2019, 08:22 PM
 
18,833 posts, read 9,626,388 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGirl415 View Post
I never said all prostitutes are any of those things. I 100% stand by the statement that for most women it is not truly voluntary and they are desperate and that it is not something most women aspire to do, even in the best circumstances.

I also have experience working in sex crimes in general. Including prostitution and trafficking. And studying it from a legal aspect.
For most women, it’s voluntary.

What you are talking about, street prostitutes and brothels, are the minority.

The vast majority of prostitution, trading sex for money or other favors, happens voluntarily.
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Old 06-10-2019, 08:24 PM
 
Location: NNJ
9,523 posts, read 5,365,231 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nedergras View Post
No one's stopping you from flying to Germany or Thailand, or driving to Mexico.
Again.. you missed the point.


How does my flying over there grant my friends safety from victimization? dominion and right over body? How does me flying over there protect the privacy between two consenting adults?
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Old 06-10-2019, 08:25 PM
 
7,109 posts, read 1,785,681 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nedergras View Post
Go ahead.

Go ahead and what? I have no use for prostitutes. I also believe marijuana should be legal but I don't use it at all. I am looking at what is best for society not personal gain.

Prohibition before, the war on drugs and our prostitution laws have shown over time that they fail to achieve their objectives. Just otherwise good people go to jail and illegal enterprises flourish.
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Old 06-10-2019, 08:26 PM
 
12,657 posts, read 10,501,376 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklazona Bound View Post
I respect your opinion. And in a perfect world prostitution would not exist. I would argue that overall women will be in a better situation with it legal than how it is now. Not every single woman but a majority. Not perfect by any means but better. You seem to agree with that. So I don't get what point you are trying to make.


What realistic solution outside of legalization do you have?
I don't have a realistic solution unfortunately. I don't think anyone does which is why problems persist even in places where it is legal. There probably is no ideal one, you either have to make it illegal and punish either the customers or prostitutes or both or you have to legalize it, regulate it to make it as safe as possible, and continue to fight the trafficking that won't go away despite it being legal. My concern though like I said (which really was my point) is that I don't like the social implications of legalized prostitution or prostitution in general, but legalizing it I think almost endorses it, makes it okay - well, it obviously makes it okay. No one has to agree with me but that is my opinion, that commodifying sex is bad for women.

Quote:
Originally Posted by usayit View Post
Again.. incorrect assumption since you only have observation from the crime aspect of it. Not all sex workers are trafficked.. nor will ever run into a sex crime enforcement.

Most of the involuntary victims are kept in that situation with no escape because of the illegal nature of their work. The vary laws that are suppose to protect them are turning them into victims. There are case studies regarding decriminalizing of minor in prostitution in CA... they are treated as victims rather than criminals and the johns are prosecuted under statutory rape which carries a higher penality. These minors come forward because they no longer fear being arrested. Now just imagine if that were applied to prostitutes in general.
Again, I did not say they are all trafficked. Me saying they are desperate and have no other options is not the same as me saying they are trafficked.

Women do not aspire to be prostitutes. Not even legal ones. And even legal prostitution is largely frowned upon by society.
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Old 06-10-2019, 08:27 PM
 
1,352 posts, read 691,441 times
Reputation: 782
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklazona Bound View Post
Go ahead and what? I have no use for prostitutes. I also believe marijuana should be legal but I don't use it at all. I am looking at what is best for society not personal gain.



Prohibition, the war on drugs and our prostitution laws have shown over time that they fail to achieve their objectives.

What's best for our society is that people don't support those industries. We aren't Mexico, we aren't Europe, we aren't Thailand. If that's what you want, go teach English in those countries.
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Old 06-10-2019, 08:40 PM
 
7,109 posts, read 1,785,681 times
Reputation: 4211
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGirl415 View Post
I don't have a realistic solution unfortunately.
There is no perfect solution. But regulating it instead of chasing it around with the black market is the better solution. In my opinion. In did not start this tread trying to imply legalization is perfect. Its just a step in the right direction.



And what about male prostitutes who have women customers or gay prostitutes with male customers? That is fine?


Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGirl415 View Post
Again, I did not say they are all trafficked. Me saying they are desperate and have no other options is not the same as me saying they are trafficked.

Women do not aspire to be prostitutes. Not even legal ones. And even legal prostitution is largely frowned upon by society.
Lots of people have jobs and careers that they did not aspire to have. Most peoples have lives do not go exactly as planned. If you are 30 and working in fast food things are not as planned. There are lots of people in that situation.

And when society deems something illegal its frowned upon. 30 years ago growing pot was frowned upon by most. Today that has changed in most of America.



The only possible way to stamp out prostitution is to have a police state where everyone is monitored and watched and no one has any rights. That is not something that I want.

Last edited by Oklazona Bound; 06-10-2019 at 08:53 PM..
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