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Old 07-19-2019, 11:37 AM
 
13,194 posts, read 6,293,100 times
Reputation: 10950

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Quote:
Originally Posted by notnamed View Post
This is what I replied to...




They don't all just stay forever. They make their buck and take it back home to their families. Many went back during the recession when construction jobs dried up. Illegal immigrant population peaked right before that.

So the real answer here to reduce the population is to have another recession...




Factory jobs are disappearing due to automation much more so than immigration. Roofing, drywall, landscaping, cooks, maids, agriculture, janitors, etc are where the bulk are.

FAIR is not an independent source. Most show a net benefit. Notably it leaves out the fact that they make citizen descendants. The illegal immigrant population is disproportionately young working age compared to the domestic population.

"The bias from excluding the adult U.S.-born children of immigrants, together with their children, becomes apparent when we recompute and take them into account. When we count all the relevant descendants of still-living immigrants we find a net positive fiscal impact of about $24 billion. There is a very large positive fiscal impact of $51 billion at the federal level, partially offset by a large negative fiscal impact of -$27 billion at the state and local levels. Looking separately at the federal, state, and local components, we find that at the state and local levels, the results including all descendants are little different from the immigrant household results: -$27 billion versus -$29 billion. The impacts of the two missing groups (adult children of immigrants and grandchildren of immigrants) offset each other. This is not true at the federal level, where the discrepancy is severe. Including all concurrent descendants of immigrants triples the federal surplus!"
https://www.nap.edu/read/5985/chapter/6#194

Even just with a straight common sense approach. If immigration(legal and illegal) is such a problem why is unemployment so low?
Not as many leave when there is a recession. Those who have anchor babies and are sucking on the welfare teet due to said anchor babies aren't going to go anywhere. Besides, how can you, personally, say that a lot of them leave when no one knows just how many there are here?

If you don't like what FAIR has to say, well...too bad. It is the truth. Who do you think pays for it every time illegals use the ER as their personal physician? Answer: the taxpayers. Who do you think pays for it when they birth anchor babies? Answer: the taxpayers. What little rent illegals pay for their spots at the flophouses doesn't even come close to paying for even one child's education. Where I live, a house has to be assessed at $1 million to cover the cost of educating one child.

As for the rest of your nonsense, you are deliberately blurring the lines between illegal aliens and legal immigrants. Thus, what you write is irrelevant.

As for low unemployment rates---you don't have a clue as to how the unemployment figures work. People who are working and underemployed aren't factored in. Plus, if unemployment is so low, then why are there people who are having trouble finding jobs? Illegals have displaced many Americans in the construction fields. Honest contractors can't compete with sleazy ones who hire illegals and pay under the table.

You obviously haven't seen your neighborhoods and schools get destroyed by illegal aliens. Nor have you ever had a flophouse filled with them on your street.

Wake up already! Besides, why do you want to reward illegal behavior?

 
Old 07-19-2019, 11:57 AM
 
7,344 posts, read 4,259,284 times
Reputation: 9711
Every estimate I've seen acknowledges that the illegal population has declined from its 08 peak.

U6 unemployment rate does factor in underemployed and that is also historically low. Anyone having trouble finding jobs now has undesirable skills and needs to retool or a bad work history.

There are tons of positions open in the trades to the point even our education system is advocating for folks interested in that to skip college and go into trades.

I don't want to reward illegal behavior. I'm just calling out propaganda even if the end result is something I agree with.

It's morally wrong, but we are dependent on this illegal labor.
 
Old 07-19-2019, 12:57 PM
 
11,608 posts, read 8,495,747 times
Reputation: 7155
Quote:
Originally Posted by RunD1987 View Post
Disagree if you pay taxes you should have the right to vote.

Feel we should raise the quota to 100,00 to 120,00 from Mexico a year
Which taxes? How about the amount of income tax ones pays determines the amount of votes they get?

Watch Numbers USA Roy Beck gumball video. He explains about immigration.
 
Old 07-19-2019, 01:00 PM
 
1,655 posts, read 333,172 times
Reputation: 1469
Quote:
Originally Posted by notnamed View Post
Every estimate I've seen acknowledges that the illegal population has declined from its 08 peak.

U6 unemployment rate does factor in underemployed and that is also historically low. Anyone having trouble finding jobs now has undesirable skills and needs to retool or a bad work history.

There are tons of positions open in the trades to the point even our education system is advocating for folks interested in that to skip college and go into trades.

I don't want to reward illegal behavior. I'm just calling out propaganda even if the end result is something I agree with.

It's morally wrong, but we are dependent on this illegal labor.
Where does CASA publish its estimates?
 
Old 07-19-2019, 01:58 PM
 
Location: Willowbrook, Houston
764 posts, read 652,318 times
Reputation: 969
My issue with illegal immigration is that it's a slap in the face to immigrants who came over here the RIGHT way. Illegals come over here and get the world thrown at their laps, whereas we have American citizens who can't get the assistance they need because the illegals are clogging up the waiting list. I have no issue with immigrants coming over, but come the right way. If Americans tried to enter another country illegally, they would be crucified and rightfully so, so why should illegals have free reign to come over illegally?

I also feel employers who benefit from illegal immigrant labor should be held accountable because they're benefitting illegally off those who aren't supposed to be here.

Last edited by AcresHomes44; 07-19-2019 at 02:07 PM..
 
Old 07-19-2019, 02:07 PM
 
1,032 posts, read 510,228 times
Reputation: 1128
They don't think it is right. They are pandering to a new class and its an attempt to import voters to ensure democrats can win from now on. Once that is achieved they will quit pretending to care and move onto the next thing.
 
Old 07-19-2019, 03:01 PM
 
13,194 posts, read 6,293,100 times
Reputation: 10950
Quote:
Originally Posted by notnamed View Post
Every estimate I've seen acknowledges that the illegal population has declined from its 08 peak.

U6 unemployment rate does factor in underemployed and that is also historically low. Anyone having trouble finding jobs now has undesirable skills and needs to retool or a bad work history.

There are tons of positions open in the trades to the point even our education system is advocating for folks interested in that to skip college and go into trades.

I don't want to reward illegal behavior. I'm just calling out propaganda even if the end result is something I agree with.

It's morally wrong, but we are dependent on this illegal labor.
Per the bolded --- That's BS.

I have a relative who got laid off. He applied for several jobs---all were jobs he had experience doing. He has a good work record. One would think, according to you, he would have been fielding several job offers. The reality is that he got one job offer out of all the applications he put out there, which he took, and fortunately, it paid better than his last job. His story is not unique.

All those honest people in the construction trades who lost their livelihoods to sleazy contractors who hire illegals and pay under the table. You can't say these honest people didn't have "a bad work history" or have "undesirable skills".

When our house was getting built over 20 years ago, Americans were the ones doing the work---and they did good work. These were men who lived in the next state over, which is an impoverished state. When they had construction work, they would come here in their campers and live in campgrounds for the duration of their job. Look at any construction site in this area today, and all you see are illegals. What happened to those American men? Do you think that they suddenly got advanced degrees and are making a fortune?: The truth, most likely, is that they have struggled to find any work and perhaps many are working part-time minimum wage jobs, which now counts them as being employed. In fact, they are underemployed.

As for the illegal alien population, even you admit it's just "an estimate". The fact is that no one knows how many are here. The government keeps telling us it's 11 million and that number has stayed the same for years. Once again...even us math challenged people know that everyday illegals sneak across the border and people overstay visas. If you believe, despite the facts, that the number has stayed steady at 11 million, then I have some oceanfront property in AZ to sell to you.
 
Old 07-19-2019, 03:30 PM
 
7,344 posts, read 4,259,284 times
Reputation: 9711
So he got a job and a raise? Poor him? Job economies are also local. You should be willing to relocate. There's an abundance of jobs out there.

Just built a house last year. A lot of Russian/Ukrainians of unknown immigration status(and no command of English so I could chat with them) but also plenty of white Americans who've been in the industry for decades doing the more skilled finish work. It's estimated between 15-25% of construction jobs are taken by illegal immigrants. A problem yes, but hardly the whole industry. And those numbers are down since the recession/housing bust.

Can you point to anything that indicates the population is up? Other than just your common sense reckoning?
https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tan...on-in-the-u-s/
 
Old 07-19-2019, 03:33 PM
 
10,799 posts, read 13,722,333 times
Reputation: 6315
Quote:
Originally Posted by BOS2IAD View Post
Per the bolded --- That's BS.

I have a relative who got laid off. He applied for several jobs---all were jobs he had experience doing. He has a good work record. One would think, according to you, he would have been fielding several job offers. The reality is that he got one job offer out of all the applications he put out there, which he took, and fortunately, it paid better than his last job. His story is not unique.

All those honest people in the construction trades who lost their livelihoods to sleazy contractors who hire illegals and pay under the table. You can't say these honest people didn't have "a bad work history" or have "undesirable skills".

When our house was getting built over 20 years ago, Americans were the ones doing the work---and they did good work. These were men who lived in the next state over, which is an impoverished state. When they had construction work, they would come here in their campers and live in campgrounds for the duration of their job. Look at any construction site in this area today, and all you see are illegals. What happened to those American men? Do you think that they suddenly got advanced degrees and are making a fortune?: The truth, most likely, is that they have struggled to find any work and perhaps many are working part-time minimum wage jobs, which now counts them as being employed. In fact, they are underemployed.

As for the illegal alien population, even you admit it's just "an estimate". The fact is that no one knows how many are here. The government keeps telling us it's 11 million and that number has stayed the same for years. Once again...even us math challenged people know that everyday illegals sneak across the border and people overstay visas. If you believe, despite the facts, that the number has stayed steady at 11 million, then I have some oceanfront property in AZ to sell to you.
Yep. The liberal elitist d-bag response to working class people who've had their jobs taken by illegals is a great strategy.
 
Old 07-19-2019, 03:41 PM
 
Location: Texas
35,386 posts, read 19,397,828 times
Reputation: 21012
Quote:
Originally Posted by dman72 View Post
Yep. The liberal elitist d-bag response to working class people who've had their jobs taken by illegals is a great strategy.

Who is it, exactly, that's giving those jobs to illegals over American workers?

Hint...

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