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Old 07-24-2019, 10:32 AM
 
2,923 posts, read 971,373 times
Reputation: 2080

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahzzie View Post
So helping the less fortunate is immoral but letting them die isn't? Got it. Where do you conservatives get your logic?
Who is 'letting them die'? Its not societies job to take of you. And who said helping the less fortunate is immoral? Conservatives have never been against a safety net for those who actually need it. Someone who makes terrible decisions and ruins their own life does not count as the less fortunate.

You don't know what logic is because its all about the feels with you guys.
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Old 07-24-2019, 10:34 AM
 
2,923 posts, read 971,373 times
Reputation: 2080
Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
$29 trillion was spent bailing out corporate America. https://www.cnbc.com/id/45674390

And yet providing basic healthcare access like every other developed country of the world is a problem?
those were loans that were paid back doofus
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Old 07-24-2019, 10:41 AM
 
2,923 posts, read 971,373 times
Reputation: 2080
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gualdo Gatico View Post
If you agree poor people who work more than 40 hours a week don’t deserve to have access to affordable healthcare then you are basically agreeing to some sort of slavery or caste system. Plain and simple.

Of course the main problem is that our healthcare prices are ridiculous. We have a healthcare bubble where we charge 10-20 times for the same procedure in other develop countries.
No, bs. Why stop at healthcare? Why not 40 hrs guarantees you a nice place and a car. YOU are responsible for YOUR needs. If you don't make enough at 40 hrs you need to get another job and not have kids so you can't work. We have a healthcare bubble because too many people don't pay for their own care.
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Old 07-24-2019, 10:48 AM
 
21,989 posts, read 15,644,058 times
Reputation: 12943
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheEmissary View Post
Here in North Carolina, the Republican-dominated legislature has consistently defeated any type of Medicaid expansion. What that means, is that a lower-middle class family who is "too rich" for Medicare (because the income limit to exclude eligibility is so low) and cannot afford ACA plans, is between a rock and a hard place.

A 40 year old woman with breast cancer from such a family will probably die from lack of treatment. This is especially true in rural areas, where the local hospital has closed down, and even charity care is only available in a major city many miles away. So she ends up untreated with Stage 4 cancer and dies at home.

This type of family is the kind that voted for Trump. So when you think about it, the Republican party in NC is killing off its own voters. Rural Republicans in NC, please enjoy your TrumpCare! Here's to your tenuous good health!
This is how I see it. Red state voters who oppose and vote against health care for themselves (while also supporting the massive Disability use in Appalachia plus $50 billion in farm subsidies and tariff relief) only harm themselves so, unfortunately, the problem becomes self-solving. They voted for it so no pity.

And for those saying end Medicaid, Medicaid is how most nursing home care is paid for as well as poor children. As we see time and again, the same people that oppose abortion have no problem allowing the children to suffer after they are born.
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Old 07-24-2019, 10:55 AM
 
Location: San Diego
18,654 posts, read 7,514,651 times
Reputation: 14917
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheEmissary View Post
A 40 year old woman with breast cancer from such a family will probably die from lack of treatment. This is especially true in rural areas, where the local hospital has closed down, and even charity care is only available in a major city many miles away. So she ends up untreated with Stage 4 cancer and dies at home.
So, after 9 years of Obamacare's promises that "everyone will be covered" and "We will cut your medical costs", the leftists have given us nothing but abject failure?

It's nice to see at least one liberal starting to smell what they have been shoveling, not just for the last decade, but for the last several generations.
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Old 07-24-2019, 10:58 AM
 
19,764 posts, read 12,006,490 times
Reputation: 17500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeerGeek40 View Post
I'd like to see the analysis on the 15,000 so called deaths. Just because some liberal group says it is so....doesn't mean it is so.



Don’t hold your breath. She isn’t coming back. OP’s entire contribution to her own thread is “The pro life party, amirite?”

She chummed the water and bolted.
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Old 07-24-2019, 11:03 AM
 
Location: NJ
23,398 posts, read 17,072,575 times
Reputation: 17436
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellise View Post
The pro life party, amirite?

https://www.esquire.com/news-politic...ion-obamacare/

"On June 28, 2012, the day that the Supreme Court upheld most of the Affordable Care Act, the sighs of relief were so loud that they drowned out one part of the Court's decision that has come to haunt the lives of millions of poor people around the country, and that also has come to represent the fanatical refusal of Republican politicians, specifically Republican governors, to associate themselves with anything that had anything to do with President Barack Obama. In his opinion upholding the ACA, Roberts allowed individual governors to refuse to accept the Medicaid expansion in their states. In other words, just because it came from an Democratic president—and because it came from that Democratic president—these governors violated one of the fundamental tenets of state government that date back to the dawn of human greed: they refused FREE MONEY!"
100k died of medical errors


how many died when obamcare forced the shutdown of so many rural hospitals?


what did you expect to happen when all the dems who approved obamacare never read or understood its legal ramifications???????????????????????


we have to pass it to find out what is in it' doesn't raise a red flag?????????????????
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Old 07-24-2019, 11:05 AM
 
Location: Toronto
2,802 posts, read 3,843,993 times
Reputation: 3153
Quote:
Originally Posted by miu View Post
Yes! In America, anyone can succeed if they make the effort and live by commonsense.

People are trapped in poverty by their own really bad and stupid life decisions... like not putting an effort into their grade school studies, not acquiring a desirable job skill, making babies before they have a career and a long term stable healthy relationship... not learning English... not knowing how to act, dress and speak professionally.

And no, a job at a fast food restaurant should not pay a living wage.
So who is entitled to a living wage, then, in your opinion? What makes a fast food worker less deserving of a living wage than anyone else? If a fast-food worker working full-time is not entitled to a living wage - and I mean a living wage, not anything lavish - then why do they not deserve to make a living? They are working hard, doing a job that is in high demand.

First, the argument was that those who use government services like Medicaid are poor because they are lazy. Now, the argument has changed - it's not about laziness anymore. Now it's about having the right kind of job, because apparently working hard is not enough.

From your perch, I imagine everyone who works in a low-wage job is there because of some defect in their character that makes them unworthy of a decent life.

But let's take this idea and see where it leads...If everyone made all the right choices (like you have, apparently) and had advanced degrees or training in fields where demand was high, who would pick your fruits and vegetables, butcher your meat, cook your food, serve it to you, clean the streets, pick up trash, book your hotel ad clean the room when you leave, stock the shelves so you can buy products, package those products, take care of the sick and elderly, mind someone's children, landscape their yard, and so on? Do you see the problem?

If everyone is an architect or engineer, who does the low-paying grunt work that gets the architect's vision built according to the engineer's plans? If everyone is a manager, who does the work that the manager delegates?

I'm not saying a fast-food worker should be wealthy necessarily, but why do you believe they are undeserving of a living wage? What makes you so special that you deserve a reasonable income, and who gets to choose which professions are worthy? If you are going to complain about your tax dollars being used to fund social programs for the poor and ALSO claim that only certain jobs should pay a living wage, you have created a bit of a paradox in which only the few can make a living, and those who cannot must suffer in abject poverty because...they made poor choices, I guess? Which brings us back to the same place: if everyone makes all the "right" choices and gets advanced degrees, who is going to do the labor, the service jobs, the jobs that make the American lifestyle possible?

There was a time when working in a fast-food restaurant or stocking shelves in a grocery store or waiting tables was for young people getting their first taste of the working world in order to prepare them for life as a self-sufficient adult. However, in case you didn't notice, the economy has changed drastically in thirty years due to automation, globalization, and consumer demands for cheap goods. Now you can find plenty of people with advanced degrees making lattes at Starbucks because the economy in which their education was once valuable has disappeared.

This brings me back to my initial post in this thread - one that no right-wing members have bothered to comment on in a meaningful way. Corporate America refuses to pay living wages because no one is asking them or forcing them to. In the past, unions were able to effectively raise wages and the standard of living so that workers could make a living wage. Think about post-war America and its prosperity and relative economic equality. Isn't this what MAGA is all about? Getting back to a time when Americans were more prosperous?

Instead, governments at all levels have systematically destroyed the power of organized labor, and now the fox is not just in the hen house - he's running the hen house! And that seems to be just fine to many on the right, who then complain about homelessness, poverty, and their taxes being used to fund social programs that fill in the massive gaps corporate America has left in their quest to become money-making machines for a small group of executives and shareholders. And you wonder why the younger generation looks at the current system and starts thinking come socialism might not be a bad thing.

Meanwhile, the corporate welfare continues unabated and no one on the right complains about their tax dollars being used to give multi-billion dollar companies tax breaks. It's the programs that help the poor that bother you. What the hell is that? What kind of twisted value system leads to that kind of thinking?

Thing is, the posters complaining about their taxes being used for social programs are probably not going to read this post. Those who do will either ignore it completely, or select one point to attack (kind of like you did). I don't understand when so many Americans became so cold-hearted that they would not only claim that the working poor deserve their poverty, but that they object to any of their tax money going to programs who assist those people. Meanwhile, they either ignore or approve of the billions and billions in tax dollars flowing to the wealthiest individuals and corporations. Is that what the right believes? What about the so-called Evangelicals that make up such an important part of its base? What part of the Bible are they reading?
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Old 07-24-2019, 11:12 AM
 
36,118 posts, read 30,603,369 times
Reputation: 32367
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheEmissary View Post
Here in North Carolina, the Republican-dominated legislature has consistently defeated any type of Medicaid expansion. What that means, is that a lower-middle class family who is "too rich" for Medicare (because the income limit to exclude eligibility is so low) and cannot afford ACA plans, is between a rock and a hard place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2mares View Post
Well medicare is for those 65+. How are you too rich for it. Do you mean medicare part B?
I thought ACA plans were going to take care of everyone, make insurance coverage affordable?
Quote:
I guess you don't know the difference between Medicare and Medicaid! Google it!

Or you dont.





Medicaid vs. Medicare: An Overview
While they sound alike, Medicare and Medicaid are two different programs. Both can help you pay for health care and medical expenses, but Medicare is an age-based federal health insurance program that guarantees coverage for individuals ages 65 and over and some younger people with disabilities. By contrast, Medicaid is a public assistance program for needy Americans of all ages. Here’s how to tell them apart and discover whether you qualify for either or both of them.
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Old 07-24-2019, 11:13 AM
 
Location: Jacksonville, FL
11,096 posts, read 10,649,408 times
Reputation: 9730
Quote:
Originally Posted by TOkidd View Post
If someone chooses to be poor? Do you really believe poverty is a choice? That people want to be poor and make the decision to be so?
The majority of poor people make crappy life choices. They spend money on stupid things. Nobody says "I'm going to be poor." They just make decisions which lead them down that road.
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