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Old Yesterday, 05:44 PM
 
Location: Upstate NY
35,910 posts, read 10,646,911 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fat lou View Post
There are neighborhoods where mostly black people live that have massive crime problems. How does removing the criminals from those neighborhoods harm black people? If anything it helps. I used to live in such a neighborhood and I would have been glad to see any criminal removed from the streets.

That's what "mass incarceration" is?

The things you learn on CD!
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Old Yesterday, 05:49 PM
 
Location: Boston
8,115 posts, read 2,361,951 times
Reputation: 5791
Quote:
Originally Posted by MPowering1 View Post
I think you're misunderstanding what's being referred to. There have been laws that resulted in the mass incarceration of black males. Bill Clinton's three strikes law incarcerated millions of black males.

I know people don't want to hear this, but studies have shown that sentencing is much harsher for black males than it is for other groups. Justice isn't blind. The end result is incarceration of people for piddly marijuana possession. Tulsi Gabbard referenced Kamala Harris doing this during the debate last night.
Clinton signed it, Biden wrote it.
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Old Yesterday, 05:49 PM
 
2,549 posts, read 1,138,922 times
Reputation: 1466
Quote:
Originally Posted by Northman83 View Post
The US has more people in Jail, adjusted for population then the USSR did under its darkest Gulag days!
The US incarcerates more black men, adjusted for population then South Africa did under Apartheid!

Young black men, are arrested more often for the same crimes then white men.
Young black men, get jailed more often for the same crimes then white men.
Young black men, get longer sentences for the same crimes then white men.


So, young black men, are arrested for non-violent drugs, get longer sentences, and are jailed more often.
This creates a vicious circle, destroying many of their lives, due to a record.
More broken families, loss in salary, education etc etc etc..


Its REAAAALY easy to blame black men, but the system that brakes up black families and how blacks are treated in the justice system gives a WHOLE other picture.

Institutional Racism... breaking up the Black family... then blaming them for it.



.
But there are many communities in this nation that still have awful crime problems. I lived in a neighborhood in Pittsburgh that was bad enough, but it wasn't even close to being the worst neighborhood in Pittsburgh, which is hardly America's most crime-ridden city. I don't even want to think about how bad the worst neighborhoods in Detroit, New Orleans, etc. are.

So how can you say that there are too many people in prison?
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Old Yesterday, 05:50 PM
 
2,549 posts, read 1,138,922 times
Reputation: 1466
Quote:
Originally Posted by Delahanty View Post
That's what "mass incarceration" is?

The things you learn on CD!
So what is mass incarceration then? I notice that you didn't bother to explain.
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Old Yesterday, 06:22 PM
 
Location: New Albany, Indiana (Greater Louisville)
9,932 posts, read 21,200,074 times
Reputation: 9465
Mass incarceration is not about locking up murderers but people for minor things like simply possessing an illegal drug. The problem is drug use is common across demographics but most people imprisoned are poor and non white. Rather than rich college students.

M-I increases crime because so many people get criminal records for minor things and then can't get good employment because of their 'criminal record'. Then they have to sell drugs or steal things to pay the bills.
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Old Yesterday, 06:50 PM
 
2,549 posts, read 1,138,922 times
Reputation: 1466
Quote:
Originally Posted by censusdata View Post
Mass incarceration is not about locking up murderers but people for minor things like simply possessing an illegal drug. The problem is drug use is common across demographics but most people imprisoned are poor and non white. Rather than rich college students.

M-I increases crime because so many people get criminal records for minor things and then can't get good employment because of their 'criminal record'. Then they have to sell drugs or steal things to pay the bills.
No one is doing serious prison time solely for possessing a small amount of any drug. And it's up to employers to hire who they want to hire. If drug possession isn't a bad thing, and doesn't even warrant being arrested for, then why would it keep anyone from hiring someone?
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Old Yesterday, 07:55 PM
 
Location: Suburb of Chicago
21,143 posts, read 10,189,282 times
Reputation: 20427
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdmil View Post
You're oversimplifying things here.

If you're arrested and charged with a crime, depending on the nature of the crime, you may be remanded to jail pending trial, released on your own recognizance, or granted bail that you'll have to pay if you want to get out prior to trial. That's just how the system works. More than likely if you're given high bail or no bail it's a serious offense -- likely of the "violent crime" variety -- rather than they caught you with two joints in your pocket.


"Innocent people" taking plea deals because the prosecutor scared them is unfortunate, but...the prosecutor is just doing their job. I think this is moreso a matter of education than the system being biased. Don't talk to the police without an attorney present, and don't plead guilty if you're not guilty.
I know how the system works. I'm explaining HOW prisons are filled with people who haven't even been found guilty. You're OVER explaining because the situation I'm talking about only refers to people who are being told they must pay bail. The other examples aren't pertinent to the discussion.

As for bail - these are poor people who can't afford bail of any amount most of the time.

And many prosecutors will screw their mothers to further their careers. The only thing they care about is their conviction rate - and they have high conviction rates because of shady plea deals and intimidation.
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Old Yesterday, 08:13 PM
 
Location: Suburb of Chicago
21,143 posts, read 10,189,282 times
Reputation: 20427
Quote:
Originally Posted by fat lou View Post
No one is doing serious prison time solely for possessing a small amount of any drug. And it's up to employers to hire who they want to hire. If drug possession isn't a bad thing, and doesn't even warrant being arrested for, then why would it keep anyone from hiring someone?
https://www.aclu.org/other/marijuana...ts-punishments

  • Harsh mandatory minimum sentencing laws for drug offenses result in prisons overfilled with non-violent marijuana offenders serving long sentences, often disproportionate to their crime. Take, for example, the case of Joe Pinson, convicted in 1993 of marijuana cultivation and possession - his first offense - and sentenced to a mandatory five-year jail term, despite the fact that he grew the marijuana because it helped treat his debilitating asthma symptoms.< Source: ACLU Spring Spotlight 98, above website.


  • Under New York State law, the penalty for possession of 16 ounces of marijuana is equivalent to that for illegally selling a firearm, or for possession an explosive bomb or machine gun: a minimum jail sentence of one to three years (and a maximum of seven). The penalty for selling 16 ounces of marijuana is equivalent to that for illegally selling 10 firearms: 3? to 15 years in jail. The absurd message: pot is as or more harmful than guns. Source: "Drugs and Guns in New York State," compiled by Carl Bromley, from The Nation magazine, Sept. 20, 1999, "Beyond Legalization: New Ideas for Ending the War on Drugs."
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Old Yesterday, 08:14 PM
 
Location: Suburb of Chicago
21,143 posts, read 10,189,282 times
Reputation: 20427
Quote:
Originally Posted by skeddy View Post
Clinton signed it, Biden wrote it.
Yes, the important thing to me is that Clinton signed off on it.

I couldn't remember who wrote it - so thanks for that information.
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Old Yesterday, 08:20 PM
 
15,675 posts, read 13,630,338 times
Reputation: 21556
Quote:
Originally Posted by fat lou View Post
No one is doing serious prison time solely for possessing a small amount of any drug. And it's up to employers to hire who they want to hire. If drug possession isn't a bad thing, and doesn't even warrant being arrested for, then why would it keep anyone from hiring someone?
If possessing the drug is illegal, why even possess in the first place?
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