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Old Today, 10:53 AM
 
Location: Jacksonville, FL
7,051 posts, read 7,823,985 times
Reputation: 5739

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Quote:
Originally Posted by EddieB.Good View Post
People not having access to credit does not make them financially smarter. It makes them people who don't have access to credit. People bounced checks and delayed paying their utilities then just like people overdraft and pay their cell phone bills after payday.
Those people weren't allowed to have credit though. Honestly, easy access to credit is probably the worst thing that ever happened to Americans.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EddieB.Good View Post
Just bc you can't keep up with the conversation, don't try to turn it on me and say my argument is inconsistent. My argument was and is that you can't back "living within your means" without also backing the US economy crashing. Or economy is based on people spending money. If people stop spending money, our economy crashes.
Yes, you can encourage people to live within their means without crashing the economy. The difference will be that consumers will spend their own money rather than someone else's. They'll still buy unnecessary crap, don't worry. People won't suddenly become misers, but perhaps if they had a better understanding of how interest rates work they'll make wiser purchases. Nobody is going to stop spending money.
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Old Today, 10:59 AM
 
1,035 posts, read 217,860 times
Reputation: 1552
Quote:
Originally Posted by EddieB.Good View Post
People not having access to credit does not make them financially smarter. It makes them people who don't have access to credit. People bounced checks and delayed paying their utilities then just like people overdraft and pay their cell phone bills after payday.

Just bc you can't keep up with the conversation, don't try to turn it on me and say my argument is inconsistent. My argument was and is that you can't back "living within your means" without also backing the US economy crashing. Or economy is based on people spending money. If people stop spending money, our economy crashes.
Yeah and their utilities got cut off. And to get them turned on again one had to make an even bigger deposit. You see back then was more black and white...pay your utility bills or your service was cut off.

Your argument is inconsistent because you are ASSUMING life has always been like it is today.
You obviously aren't old enough to have experienced it. Easy credit was not available to the majority of Americans in the 60's and 70's.
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Old Today, 11:07 AM
 
Location: Watervliet, NY
4,338 posts, read 1,605,771 times
Reputation: 7917
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMSRetired View Post
Oh they did grow up more financially literate than today's generation.
There wasn't "easy credit" as there is today.

Savings accounts/Christmas club accounts were where you saved your money until you could afford to buy something and most businesses were "cash only" sales. If you wanted something but didn't have the money you did layaway where they held it in the back and you didn't get it until you had your bill paid off.

You're probably a young poster if you think consumers "were always like this".
Thet were also raised on stories about the Depression. My father's parents were both adults when the Depression hit, plus his grandparents could remember back to the 1870's when there was a comparable recession that completely wiped out his great-grandparents' finances, to the point where they never fully recovered. They owned a coffee plantation in Jamaica, and after losing
everything they moved to NYC where my g-g-grandmother got a job in a sweatshop and also sold her jewelry (the stones in those pieces were real, not fakes) piece by piece to help support the family.

My parents still keep their wealth close to the belt. You'd never know to look at them but my dad is worth well over 6 figures in cash money. They still live in the fixer upper they bought in 1972 and drive a 13 year old car.
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Old Today, 11:23 AM
 
1,035 posts, read 217,860 times
Reputation: 1552
Quote:
Originally Posted by ContraPagan View Post
Thet were also raised on stories about the Depression. My father's parents were both adults when the Depression hit, plus his grandparents could remember back to the 1870's when there was a comparable recession that completely wiped out his great-grandparents' finances, to the point where they never fully recovered. They owned a coffee plantation in Jamaica, and after losing
everything they moved to NYC where my g-g-grandmother got a job in a sweatshop and also sold her jewelry (the stones in those pieces were real, not fakes) piece by piece to help support the family.

My parents still keep their wealth close to the belt. You'd never know to look at them but my dad is worth well over 6 figures in cash money. They still live in the fixer upper they bought in 1972 and drive a 13 year old car.
For many early boomers their parents and grandparents grew up during the Depression.
They didn't just hear stories though; their parents knew first hand what it was like living through those times. These early boomers grew up with conserving, saving and not wasting.

I'm a mid boomer and I grew up hearing the stories from my parents and grandparents.

There was no "instant gratification" via revolving debt because it was out of reach to the majority of Americans.
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Old Today, 12:02 PM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
6,932 posts, read 3,447,023 times
Reputation: 2937
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMSRetired View Post
Yeah and their utilities got cut off. And to get them turned on again one had to make an even bigger deposit. You see back then was more black and white...pay your utility bills or your service was cut off.

Your argument is inconsistent because you are ASSUMING life has always been like it is today.
You obviously aren't old enough to have experienced it. Easy credit was not available to the majority of Americans in the 60's and 70's.
I'm not assuming life in the past is the same as it is now. I point out that the only thing that saved baby boomers from being as bad as the current generation is that they made enough to cover their bad financial decisions. They also weren't spreading their money into as many pots bc there weren't as many pots to put money in. If most boomers were working today, they'd be making the same dumb financial moves.


Quote:
Originally Posted by JimRom View Post
Those people weren't allowed to have credit though. Honestly, easy access to credit is probably the worst thing that ever happened to Americans.


Yes, you can encourage people to live within their means without crashing the economy. The difference will be that consumers will spend their own money rather than someone else's. They'll still buy unnecessary crap, don't worry. People won't suddenly become misers, but perhaps if they had a better understanding of how interest rates work they'll make wiser purchases. Nobody is going to stop spending money.
People who live on credit and pay their bill are not the issue. If you're responsible, you should be living on credit. It's free money for you.

The issue are the people going into debt to have the basics of a middle class lifestyle. If you're saying they should live within their means, you're asking them to cut back on their spending, and our entire economy is fueled by their spending. You can't ask for the former without it impacting the latter.
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Old Today, 12:10 PM
 
1,035 posts, read 217,860 times
Reputation: 1552
Quote:
Originally Posted by EddieB.Good View Post
I'm not assuming life in the past is the same as it is now. I point out that the only thing that saved baby boomers from being as bad as the current generation is that they made enough to cover their bad financial decisions. They also weren't spreading their money into as many pots bc there weren't as many pots to put money in. If most boomers were working today, they'd be making the same dumb financial moves.




People who live on credit and pay their bill are not the issue. If you're responsible, you should be living on credit. It's free money for you.

The issue are the people going into debt to have the basics of a middle class lifestyle. If you're saying they should live within their means, you're asking them to cut back on their spending, and our entire economy is fueled by their spending. You can't ask for the former without it impacting the latter.
All of that above that I bolded is your OPINION.
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Old Today, 12:14 PM
 
Location: Jacksonville, FL
7,051 posts, read 7,823,985 times
Reputation: 5739
Quote:
Originally Posted by EddieB.Good View Post
I'm not assuming life in the past is the same as it is now. I point out that the only thing that saved baby boomers from being as bad as the current generation is that they made enough to cover their bad financial decisions. They also weren't spreading their money into as many pots bc there weren't as many pots to put money in. If most boomers were working today, they'd be making the same dumb financial moves.




People who live on credit and pay their bill are not the issue. If you're responsible, you should be living on credit. It's free money for you.

The issue are the people going into debt to have the basics of a middle class lifestyle. If you're saying they should live within their means, you're asking them to cut back on their spending, and our entire economy is fueled by their spending. You can't ask for the former without it impacting the latter.
That is quite possibly the dumbest statement written about finances that I have ever seen in my life. Living on credit has nothing to do with being responsible. In fact, living on credit is the exact opposite of being responsible. Living on credit is how people end up filing bankruptcy over credit card debt when they lose their job or have a major health issue. I hope nobody turns to you for financial advice, because my 12-year-old has a better understanding of fiscal responsibility than you do. Her 6th grade class from last year could tear your argument to shreds without even cracking a reference book.
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Old Today, 12:19 PM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
6,932 posts, read 3,447,023 times
Reputation: 2937
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimRom View Post
That is quite possibly the dumbest statement written about finances that I have ever seen in my life. Living on credit has nothing to do with being responsible. In fact, living on credit is the exact opposite of being responsible. Living on credit is how people end up filing bankruptcy over credit card debt when they lose their job or have a major health issue. I hope nobody turns to you for financial advice, because my 12-year-old has a better understanding of fiscal responsibility than you do. Her 6th grade class from last year could tear your argument to shreds without even cracking a reference book.
You go ahead think that through. I'll stand by that comment. If you're responsible, you make money on credit. If you don't understand that, you don't belong in a conversation about finances or credit. Stick to using jars and envelopes to manage your money.
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Old Today, 12:24 PM
 
Location: Jacksonville, FL
7,051 posts, read 7,823,985 times
Reputation: 5739
Quote:
Originally Posted by EddieB.Good View Post
You go ahead think that through. I'll stand by that comment. If you're responsible, you make money on credit. If you don't understand that, you don't belong in a conversation about finances or credit. Stick to using jars and envelopes to manage your money.
Title of thread: Families go deep into debt to stay in the middle class
Premise of thread: Debt is bad
Your position: People should go into debt.
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Old Today, 12:27 PM
 
1,486 posts, read 616,158 times
Reputation: 1340
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimRom View Post
That is quite possibly the dumbest statement written about finances that I have ever seen in my life. Living on credit has nothing to do with being responsible. In fact, living on credit is the exact opposite of being responsible. Living on credit is how people end up filing bankruptcy over credit card debt when they lose their job or have a major health issue. I hope nobody turns to you for financial advice, because my 12-year-old has a better understanding of fiscal responsibility than you do. Her 6th grade class from last year could tear your argument to shreds without even cracking a reference book.
Leveraging debt is responsible. Failing to pay it back is irresponsible. There's nothing wrong with debt in itself. One day you'll learn to be financially savvy and understand.
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