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Old Today, 09:11 AM
Status: "This is the best of all possible plutocracies." (set 7 days ago)
 
Location: Old Hippie Heaven
18,572 posts, read 8,362,436 times
Reputation: 10825

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_N_1962 View Post
Wait, I thought the robots were coming and we all need UBI?
They are. Fewer workers is a HUGE incentive to mechanize basic production.
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Old Today, 09:12 AM
 
5,650 posts, read 2,080,584 times
Reputation: 7160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_N_1962 View Post
Wait, I thought the robots were coming and we all need UBI?

Automation Could Eliminate 73 Million Jobs by 2030
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Old Today, 09:12 AM
 
Location: East Lansing, MI
9,067 posts, read 8,040,924 times
Reputation: 3866
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMSRetired View Post
Illegals don't complain about working conditions.
Illegals won't try to band together and form unions.
Illegals won't go to the authorities if they get shafted on their pay.


All true.
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Old Today, 09:15 AM
 
Location: Cumberland Co., TN
22,113 posts, read 21,867,166 times
Reputation: 21614
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharks With Lasers View Post
The real problem is that there's a shortage of a permanent class of low-skilled workers in the U.S.

Around the turn of the 20th century, immigrants from poorer places in Europe were filling that void. But their children assimilated, and no longer were part of a permanent low-skilled worker class by the 1950s or so. Due to racism and segregation, black people (and Hispanic and Asian people to a certain extent, although there were less of them present) could also fill the void of a permanent underclass, but that fortunately doesn't happen anymore. Poor white people from areas such as Appalachia could also fill that void.

So the only people who can be part of a permanent underclass are those who don't have any other options. That pretty much leaves felons and undocumented immigrants. Low-skilled workers of other sorts can improve their positions from working in a chicken processing plant if they so choose.
What about poor white people from areas not such as Appalachia.
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Old Today, 09:18 AM
 
Location: North Carolina
3,411 posts, read 2,361,177 times
Reputation: 4525
Quote:
Originally Posted by jacqueg View Post
They are. Fewer workers is a HUGE incentive to mechanize basic production.

When healthcare is a major cost, not to mention their salary. Eliminate the employee. Thats going to increase.
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Old Today, 09:22 AM
 
Location: Atlanta, GA
258 posts, read 118,267 times
Reputation: 593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elliott_CA View Post
There is no labor shortage -- the labor utilization rate is 63%, which means 37% of adults are not looking for work. What we have is a shortage of companies willing to pay good wages. If wages were higher it would motivate some of those idle workers back into the workforce.


It's been suggested that the high cost of daycare contributes to the low labor utilization rate. If you're a blue collar parent what's the point of going to work if all of your take home goes to daycare? All you get out of it is a higher tax bracket.
^^^

This. This so-called "labor shortage" is 100% self-induced by the employers of this country. The number of people who could work but chose not to number in the tens of millions.

Why aren't these people working? For one thing, low wages. Who wants to work a stressful retail or food service job for paltry wages? Not to mention the lack of a solid schedule and number of hours worked per week.

How about skilled labor? Personally, I think employers should have to pay for training rather than relying on publicly-funded education to meet "their" needs. If a company needs machinists because the three they have are nearing retirement, well, perhaps they need to bring on an apprentice or two. With 3.7 million potential workers expected to graduate high school next year, they've got a deep pool to choose from.

Problem is, they don't want to. They don't want to have to pay for training and then pay a fair wage so that the employee wouldn't dream of jumping ship. It's easier to just whine "there's a labor shortage!"

Lower birth rates, and reduced immigration levels in the years to come? There just might be a day when the workers of this country finally have the upper hand over their employers.
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Old Today, 09:30 AM
 
Location: Cumberland Co., TN
22,113 posts, read 21,867,166 times
Reputation: 21614
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobdreamz View Post
Let's be honest here at how many Americans would willfully want to work at a chicken processing plant?
There is a reason why illegals are hired for those jobs.
Lots, before illegals depressed the wages. Some of the plants wont even hire locals (except for higher skilled maintenance jobs). And yes there was a discrimination class action suite brought against the plant in my town because they were hiring 95% immigrants.
I also live in a rural area with a chicken processing plant. In the beginning it employed locals from the surrounding area. Not many jobs so locals were happy to work there. The pay was decent for the area and they had benefits. Slowly they began hiring illegals. Wages stagnated, working conditions deteriorated.
What makes you think a person without a college education would not want to work in a factory within a 5 min. drive from home for 10-14$/hr. (where the average yearly income is $25,000), health insurance and 401K? You think all Americans walk out of HS graduation into a $100K/yr job? Or go straight to College all expenses paid?
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Old Today, 09:40 AM
 
Location: Cumberland Co., TN
22,113 posts, read 21,867,166 times
Reputation: 21614
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ponderosa View Post
I was in the midwest this summer. Fast food places are closing at 9 pm where they used to be open till the wee hours. Reason -- they can't find enough people to staff them. The shortage is real. The population is aging and retiring and outside of immigration there is an inadequate source of new labor entrants. Trump is working on it though. If he continues, his tariffs will soon bring a recession and plenty of people looking for any job.
Do you have some link supporting your statement the restaurants are closing early due to lack of workers?
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Old Today, 10:25 AM
 
23,667 posts, read 12,485,549 times
Reputation: 7531
Quote:
Originally Posted by warhorse78 View Post
Not only does it depress wages, but it also cheats out the tax system. They nor their employer is paying their fair share of payroll taxes, social security, medicaid and medicare, but yet they will be expected to be able to send their kids to public schools, get free lunch and supplies for their kids and be able to sign up for welfare like WIC, without ever really paying into it. This is a system that cannon last. It's basic economics 101.
you don't know that.

You don't know if they are being paid under the table or if they were on payroll.

The IRS has often reported on the number of tax returns that are submitted that use inaccurate social security numbers.

What they do -- rather than refuse the tax money, they assign a Tax Payer ID number and that is the number used to submit taxes for the wages earned.

You don't know what the system for payout was at these plants.
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Old Today, 10:42 AM
Status: "This is the best of all possible plutocracies." (set 7 days ago)
 
Location: Old Hippie Heaven
18,572 posts, read 8,362,436 times
Reputation: 10825
Quote:
Originally Posted by RcHydro View Post
When healthcare is a major cost, not to mention their salary. Eliminate the employee. Thats going to increase.
Yup. Many reasons to replace humans as laborers. Doesn't matter where they come from or the state of their citizenship documents.

Humans are a PITA to deal with, as anyone who's ever worked anywhere knows. Of course, so are mechanical things, but in a more predictable, less challenging way.
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