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Old 08-13-2019, 03:03 PM
 
Location: San Diego
35,735 posts, read 32,480,195 times
Reputation: 20148

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TBMorgan View Post
I have relatives staunch anti-Obama racists from Iowa who voted for Trump and I ask them how the Soy farmers are liking what's going on and these folks are highly educated Iowans and mums the word --- no matter how much Trump screws Iowans over with the trade war - they hated Obama with a passion and will never admit to the mistake of supporting Trump.
Then they would be wise to plant wheat next year instead.
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Old 08-13-2019, 03:10 PM
 
9,981 posts, read 4,703,025 times
Reputation: 5584
A Missouri Republican rep (Vicki Hartzler) railed against subsidies to get elected. After elected it came out that her families' farms were getting tens of thousands in yearly subsidies. Can't trust them.
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Old 08-13-2019, 03:13 PM
 
Location: Bellingham, WA
950 posts, read 1,137,002 times
Reputation: 1084
We are paying $7-$14 a pound for steak over here on the coast. I like to marinate my steak in soy sauce in the rare event that I have one, so farmers, get some cows in those soy bean fields and cash in!

"Whole, raw soybeans make an excellent feed for beef cows as they have a high level of Crude Protein (40%) and Fat (20%)."

I have to agree that farmers became dependent, and I'm sure many became very profitable in crops for export to China, but the current state of increasing our trade deficit half-a-trillion $$$$ each year simply can't continue. Many other countries exist to export to, and there are domestic markets that could certainly use more supply...I'm serious about the beef, for example. It's all about the transition to supply for other markets.
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Old 08-13-2019, 03:28 PM
 
1,591 posts, read 354,413 times
Reputation: 1605
Quote:
Originally Posted by Floorist View Post
A Missouri Republican rep (Vicki Hartzler) railed against subsidies to get elected. After elected it came out that her families' farms were getting tens of thousands in yearly subsidies. Can't trust them.
sounds like that space cadet Bachmann from Minnesota - https://www.politico.com/blogs/on-co...bsidies-023679
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Old 08-13-2019, 03:30 PM
 
1,591 posts, read 354,413 times
Reputation: 1605
Quote:
Originally Posted by rkcarguy View Post
We are paying $7-$14 a pound for steak over here on the coast. I like to marinate my steak in soy sauce in the rare event that I have one, so farmers, get some cows in those soy bean fields and cash in!

"Whole, raw soybeans make an excellent feed for beef cows as they have a high level of Crude Protein (40%) and Fat (20%)."

I have to agree that farmers became dependent, and I'm sure many became very profitable in crops for export to China, but the current state of increasing our trade deficit half-a-trillion $$$$ each year simply can't continue. Many other countries exist to export to, and there are domestic markets that could certainly use more supply...I'm serious about the beef, for example. It's all about the transition to supply for other markets.
when you say "farmers" ----you might be surprised to know many of these "farmers" are really Farm Corps....my grandfather and his neighbors sold their farms years ago to Corporations who now produced the food we eat - as well as ship product to China and other overseas countries ----and who are being paid off by the taxpayers because of the trade wars.....

thanks Trump
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Old 08-13-2019, 03:57 PM
Status: "but it depends on what the definition of "is" is." (set 14 days ago)
 
Location: Clyde Hill, WA
3,626 posts, read 646,178 times
Reputation: 1143
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoBromhal View Post
not even close.

otherwise, you clearly know even less about farm economics than me. I wouldn't even claim to be more than a novice, but I understand that the original over-arching reason for "farm subsidies" was to even out the wide variances in crop production because of weather fluctuation, and the wide variation in market prices that cannot be perfectly anticipated months ahead when the crops are planned and planted.
It's true that historically food prices were volatile, as the economists say, due to price inelasticity. But the real reason that farm subsidies were put in place was that farmers were well organized, and so got them passed.

Compare the agriculture price supports to the minimum wage. They are identical problems--people not making as much from their labors as they would like. The farmers got something that actually benefited them, whereas the low-wage/low-skilled workers got a fraudulent political sop that actually hurts most of them.
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Old 08-13-2019, 04:02 PM
Status: "but it depends on what the definition of "is" is." (set 14 days ago)
 
Location: Clyde Hill, WA
3,626 posts, read 646,178 times
Reputation: 1143
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBMorgan View Post
sounds like that space cadet Bachmann from Minnesota - https://www.politico.com/blogs/on-co...bsidies-023679
We had a wheat farmer named Clint Didier (ex football player) who ran for Senate a few years back. He was conservative, and advocated against farm subsidies, but of course he himself was collecting them.

He got lots of flack about that of course, but a Seattle Times columnist pointed out that he should get credit for sticking to his principles even though it was against his own self interest.

As Tim Carney puts it, don't hate the player--hate the game.
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Old 08-13-2019, 04:05 PM
Status: "but it depends on what the definition of "is" is." (set 14 days ago)
 
Location: Clyde Hill, WA
3,626 posts, read 646,178 times
Reputation: 1143
I had a relative who grew up during the depression. He got sprayed by a skunk while wearing his main sweater. They tried everything but could not totally get the stink out of it. He had to keep wearing it, because they could not afford to replace it. That's how poor they were.

He became a farmer in the Midwest and retired a multi-millionaire.
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Old 08-13-2019, 04:09 PM
 
24,585 posts, read 12,138,020 times
Reputation: 10472
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterfall8324 View Post
They own large scale farms, specialize in a few crops to sell to large buyers and corporate supply chains, and rake in a lot of cash: https://money.cnn.com/2012/11/27/new...ing/index.html


They love their money, and spend hard on 700 thousand dollar tractors and other fancy equipment, and take advantage of cheap migrant labor.

While free trade has destroyed their rural brothers in industrial small towns, free trade has made them even more rich with foriegn markets and subsidies to keep them afloat in low season.

Why then are they not willing to give up anything? In china if the government tells its people not to buy socks because they are in a trade war with the largest sock producing country, they would do it.

So would Koreans, Germans, Japanese, Russians, etc. Why? Because they feel like they are part of something bigger, a country they are willing to stand up for. American farmers only care about themselves. I don't care if you don't like Trump's trade war (I do) but its relevant and important.

China has very little leverage over us except for some agricultural products, so they put a little pain on them. Now there is a lot they can do, stop selling to china, diversify their crop field, find local buyers, form cooperatives, etc.

But they are so greedy they don't want to hear about it. They want a trade deal NOW to return to business as normal. Its all about yourself and your family, their is no greater meaning in life. In China people will happily take the hit and live simpler lives. communities would get together to help each-other and they'd be happy knowing they are helping their country.

American farmers whine as if they've become 15th century French Peasants and they've let globalists like the koch brothers and centrist liberals like third way use them as props to get the government to go back to supporting corporate supply chains in china which have infused our country with cheap goods (hurting us socially) and deprived millions of people of decent jobs, destroyed small businesses, and empowered corporate America.

I'm not a farmer but why do they have to be like this?
I live in farm/ranch area. They are nothing you describe. They grow what the land yields. Wheat, alfalfa, rye, soy. One farmer I know owns thousands of acres but only farms 50% of it. If prices are good, he will plant more acreage.

He uses combines for harvesting since hand harvesting is too labor intensive and not cost effective. He hauls his grain to the elevators in town. I have helped him and other neighbors in their harvest.

Another neighbor is 78 years old and still going strong.

As I said, you are way off base.
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Old 08-13-2019, 04:23 PM
 
52,338 posts, read 42,100,175 times
Reputation: 32657
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoBromhal View Post
not even close.

otherwise, you clearly know even less about farm economics than me. I wouldn't even claim to be more than a novice, but I understand that the original over-arching reason for "farm subsidies" was to even out the wide variances in crop production because of weather fluctuation, and the wide variation in market prices that cannot be perfectly anticipated months ahead when the crops are planned and planted.
Yeah, essentially what the OP is arguing for but is too dumb to realize it is to have much larger corporate farms that can better withstand major downturns in crop production etc.

They probably couldn't tell you if a field was full of corn or soybeans while driving past in July.
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