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Old 08-17-2019, 02:47 PM
 
Location: Washington State
19,066 posts, read 9,826,809 times
Reputation: 16227

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Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Then there is no excuse for you not knowing that a gallon of milk in Denmark cost $5, a happy meal cost $11, a gallon of gas is north of $6 and a pair of jeans cost $115.

Moderator cut: link removed, competitor site
Yeah, I like your source too. I like Denmark but not enough to take a huge pay cut to live there....if you want to live in a white nationalist country like Denmark, move there.

Last edited by Yac; Today at 01:50 AM..
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Old 08-17-2019, 03:22 PM
Status: "but it depends on what the definition of "is" is." (set 18 days ago)
 
Location: Clyde Hill, WA
3,722 posts, read 656,401 times
Reputation: 1184
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tall Traveler View Post
Yeah, I like your source too. I like Denmark but not enough to take a huge pay cut to live there....if you want to live in a white nationalist country like Denmark, move there.
There used to be a 'Made in Denmark' store at our local mall in Bellevue, WA. I went there once, thinking I'd like to buy something that was made in Denmark. This was years ago, and I can't recall what all they had, but I just remember garden-variety-looking blue jeans that were well over 3 figures.

As far as I can find out, the store is now closed.
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Old 08-17-2019, 03:31 PM
 
Location: Kansas City, MISSOURI
9,257 posts, read 2,828,777 times
Reputation: 7064
Quote:
Originally Posted by travis t View Post
For about the third time, and from YOUR link, Sanders does not use the term 'social democracy.' He uses the term 'democratic socialism.' These are two entirely different things. For a good tutorial, see Social Democratic America by Lane Kenworthy. The author is a proponent of social democracy, which is what they have in Denmark.

Once and for all, "DEMOCRATIC SOCIALISM<>SOCIAL DEMOCRACY." The correct use of the terminology is in your own link! Those who can define the terms they use, literally don't know what they're talking about.
And for the third time, from the actual video, Bernie Sanders SAYS he looks to Denmark and other Scandinavian countries as his role model. You're quibbling over semantics and definitions in a failed attempt to distract from the fact that Sanders is NOT calling for state ownership of the means of production.

Once again, if you think Denmark is capitalist, then you HAVE to agree that Sanders is a capitalist, because that's what he said he wants.
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Old 08-17-2019, 04:09 PM
Status: "but it depends on what the definition of "is" is." (set 18 days ago)
 
Location: Clyde Hill, WA
3,722 posts, read 656,401 times
Reputation: 1184
Quote:
Originally Posted by James Bond 007 View Post
And for the third time, from the actual video, Bernie Sanders SAYS he looks to Denmark and other Scandinavian countries as his role model. You're quibbling over semantics and definitions in a failed attempt to distract from the fact that Sanders is NOT calling for state ownership of the means of production.

Once again, if you think Denmark is capitalist, then you HAVE to agree that Sanders is a capitalist, because that's what he said he wants.
Again, according to the Danish PM, Sanders does not understand the Danish model. So it's like someone who speaks neither German nor Russian saying "I prefer the Russian language over the German."

I can't believe you're still flogging this dead horse after your own link had Sanders calling himself a "democratic socialist," which you mistakenly labeled as 'social democrat.' These are two different things. It's not semantics; it's two different political philosophies. Go to your library, get a copy of the Kenworthy book I recommended, and READ IT.
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Old 08-17-2019, 04:11 PM
Status: "but it depends on what the definition of "is" is." (set 18 days ago)
 
Location: Clyde Hill, WA
3,722 posts, read 656,401 times
Reputation: 1184
Quote:
Originally Posted by James Bond 007 View Post
And for the third time, from the actual video, Bernie Sanders SAYS he looks to Denmark and other Scandinavian countries as his role model. You're quibbling over semantics and definitions in a failed attempt to distract from the fact that Sanders is NOT calling for state ownership of the means of production.

Once again, if you think Denmark is capitalist, then you HAVE to agree that Sanders is a capitalist, because that's what he said he wants.
Again, according to the Danish PM, Sanders does not understand the Danish model. So it's like someone who speaks neither German nor Russian saying "I prefer the Russian language over the German."

I can't believe you're still flogging this dead horse after your own link had Sanders calling himself a "democratic socialist," which you mistakenly labeled as 'social democrat.' If I made a mistake that blatant, I would retract and apologize, or at least get off the thread in embarrassment.

These are two different things. It's not semantics; it's two different political philosophies. Go to your library, get a copy of the Kenworthy book I recommended, and READ IT.
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Old 08-17-2019, 05:30 PM
 
12,823 posts, read 3,990,443 times
Reputation: 3868
Quote:
Originally Posted by censusdata View Post
The 'vast majority of Appalachians being poor Scots Irish' is not true. The average White Southern Appalachian has a mixed heritage both rich and poor, from all over Britain and also Palatinate German, Dutch, among others. Many had previously lived in NYC and Philadelphia Philadelphia before moving south. One of my ancestors was Dutch and founded Manhattan and other NYC boroughs.

The topography in E KY and WV other than E panhandle is very rugged. It lacks the broad level valleys between mountains for towns, farms and transportation. I think the people that ended up there with land grants in a region with far less economic potential than where they came from. The brief coal boom overpopulated region (more kids from huge families could stay) poverty has since been major problem.
Yeah I know it to be true that persons with deep ancestry from that area will show ancestry from all over the British Isles, but also some Dutch, Scandinavian and nearby countries.
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Old 08-17-2019, 05:48 PM
 
Location: 130 Miles E of Sacramento
5,527 posts, read 3,345,068 times
Reputation: 3692
If the south is so poor and lacks opportunity, why would people from the Northeast move there?
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Old 08-17-2019, 06:56 PM
 
16,074 posts, read 4,248,953 times
Reputation: 11427
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevroqs View Post
If the south is so poor and lacks opportunity, why would people from the Northeast move there?
To sit in Northern Designed (Carrier) air conditioned Systems, of course! Or to ride in NY designed Elevators (Otis).....or maybe to hang out in Northern Developed Miami Beach of other towns (Flagler/Fischer)......

Why did the Roman Empire span all the way to the UK?

Based on this, you probably think the Bahamas are the world's leading country....or the DR these days!

We would definitely not winter or vacation there without the Northern Designed and California developed Internet, tho.
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Old 08-17-2019, 07:10 PM
 
16,074 posts, read 4,248,953 times
Reputation: 11427
Quote:
Originally Posted by censusdata View Post
The 'vast majority of Appalachians being poor Scots Irish' is not true. The average White Southern Appalachian has a mixed heritage both rich and poor, from all over Britain and also Palatinate German, Dutch, among others. Many had previously lived in NYC and Philadelphia Philadelphia before moving south. One of my ancestors was Dutch and founded Manhattan and other NYC boroughs.

The topography in E KY and WV other than E panhandle is very rugged. It lacks the broad level valleys between mountains for towns, farms and transportation. I think the people that ended up there with land grants in a region with far less economic potential than where they came from. The brief coal boom overpopulated region (more kids from huge families could stay) poverty has since been major problem.
I'm sure there are individual stories, but the generalization is true of the moonshiners and the hate for any system of organization/government and even religion. Religion is more of a latecomer...often takes hold after the hopelessness and poverty as a way to band together and survive.
Some of this is also evident in E. TN. also.

I guess it depends on exactly where we are talking about. The NC western area differs greatly from WV and the coal areas of KY and the very SW part of VA.

What we call scots-irish, of which my family now includes some, were in WV and OH. and VA. and a bit of back and forth. And, yes, their ancestors did fight in the revolution, so you definitely are correct about some of that.

But you...and those who are now my in-laws...they got out? I was talking to my in-laws and it turned out his family was from Richwood, WV - the exact town my wife and I first lived outside of when we went there. They went to OH for work (Detroit and OH factories were largely populated by people fleeing from poverty).
I asked him "do you ever go back and visit?" thinking maybe he had kin or friends of the family or nostalgia....

He looked at me like I was plum crazy....neither he nor his dad nor anyone else ever went back....even for a visit. That hit me strangely....but, then again, I think it speak to the bad experience they must have had there.

The question was/is not whether they were from UK...I think scots-irish are. It was more a matter of many of them being somewhat as the author in Night Comes to the Cumberlands describes....without great literacy, trades, money and such (compared to the Germans and higher-up Brits, etc.).

So I think it was a class thing...which the UK was all about...forever!

I agree about the topography - but the real killers were the robber barons. They may have had poor land, but if they weren't conned out of the resources they would have likely had a LOT more choices earlier and therefore built up more by now (and not had to migrate to Detroit, OH, Pittsburgh, etc.).

This really gets me thinking about how we have extended the same corporate and class system of our Mother Country here...given a blank slate, we still did things in much the same way...
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Old Yesterday, 07:46 AM
 
5,605 posts, read 7,042,630 times
Reputation: 2849
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
.

Denmark is stark, small and have relatively little in resources
KY/WV was blessed with massive amounts of resources and land area
KY/WV are fighting a war on coal, so those states cannot fully utilize their resources.
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