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Old Yesterday, 07:48 AM
 
5,839 posts, read 1,573,470 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
I'm sure there are individual stories, but the generalization is true of the moonshiners and the hate for any system of organization/government and even religion. Religion is more of a latecomer...often takes hold after the hopelessness and poverty as a way to band together and survive.
Some of this is also evident in E. TN. also.

I guess it depends on exactly where we are talking about. The NC western area differs greatly from WV and the coal areas of KY and the very SW part of VA.

What we call scots-irish, of which my family now includes some, were in WV and OH. and VA. and a bit of back and forth. And, yes, their ancestors did fight in the revolution, so you definitely are correct about some of that.

But you...and those who are now my in-laws...they got out? I was talking to my in-laws and it turned out his family was from Richwood, WV - the exact town my wife and I first lived outside of when we went there. They went to OH for work (Detroit and OH factories were largely populated by people fleeing from poverty).
I asked him "do you ever go back and visit?" thinking maybe he had kin or friends of the family or nostalgia....

He looked at me like I was plum crazy....neither he nor his dad nor anyone else ever went back....even for a visit. That hit me strangely....but, then again, I think it speak to the bad experience they must have had there.

The question was/is not whether they were from UK...I think scots-irish are. It was more a matter of many of them being somewhat as the author in Night Comes to the Cumberlands describes....without great literacy, trades, money and such (compared to the Germans and higher-up Brits, etc.).

So I think it was a class thing...which the UK was all about...forever!

I agree about the topography - but the real killers were the robber barons. They may have had poor land, but if they weren't conned out of the resources they would have likely had a LOT more choices earlier and therefore built up more by now (and not had to migrate to Detroit, OH, Pittsburgh, etc.).

This really gets me thinking about how we have extended the same corporate and class system of our Mother Country here...given a blank slate, we still did things in much the same way...
What you fail to realize, when you and other criticize Appalachain people, is that they have not adopted mainstream American ways, just as inner-city populations have not. Both groups are disadvantaged as a result. Adapting mainstream ways is the key to success.
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Old Yesterday, 08:26 AM
 
Location: Barrington
46,816 posts, read 34,436,076 times
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There are 51 separate educational systems in the US and thousands of districts within.

It is probably more beneficial to compare and contract, say PISA high, low and average scores within the US instead of internationally.
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Old Yesterday, 09:16 AM
 
Location: Texas
35,519 posts, read 19,502,510 times
Reputation: 21132
Lightbulb Denmark VS. KY/WV - Why is one poor and one rich?

One's full of goobers.

One's full of vikings.

I report. You decide.

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Old Yesterday, 09:18 AM
 
1,866 posts, read 1,016,764 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Then there is no excuse for you not knowing that a gallon of milk in Denmark cost $5, a happy meal cost $11, a gallon of gas is north of $6 and a pair of jeans cost $115.

Moderator cut: link removed, competitor site
Let's see, the milk I buy here (Texas) costs $3 half a gallon, I don't eat happy meals (or equivalent). Yes, gas is expensive in Europe, but public transportation is very good.

Now, let's compare the cost of college education, child care, paid leaves, retirement, etc.

Last edited by Yac; Today at 01:50 AM..
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Old Yesterday, 09:55 AM
 
Location: Barrington
46,816 posts, read 34,436,076 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EastwardBound View Post
Yes, Appalachia is in many ways as disadvantaged as inner-city black communities. In both cases, you have people who are outside mainstream American culture and who do not subscribe to mainstream norms or mores. There are certain cultural norms and behaviors which lead to success and the people in these areas I mentioned have never adopted them.
Employment in the mines peaked nearly 100 years ago. Despite these jobs, the standard of living in Appalachia has trended historically dismal.

People from the rural south ( mostly black) and Appalachia ( mostly white) were recruited and migrated north to fill factory jobs during the extended Great Migration. Recruitment and migration was substantial after WW2.

White economic migrants were marginalized but fared better than their black counterparts in terms of unions, jobs, pay, opportunity and especially housing.

References to the Hillbilly Highways from rural Ky, Tn and WVA to Ohio and parts of Pennsylvania date back decades. Union negotiated pay and benefits associated with assembly of cars and major appliances were major influences that led to offshore assembly. Then part manufacturers followed.

In the meantime, LBJ sought to lift the standard of living in Appalachia and poured massive funding into these states/ communities. Anyone with a pulse could qualify for a no/ low interest loan and grants for the entire price were made available in some communities. Welcome to indoor plumbing.

Funding temporarily boosted many local economies through construction. What it did not do was create a sustainable economic model. Beneficiaries often were unable to afford to repair/ replace stuff as it became necessary to do so.

Disability attorneys and their cherry- picked MDs enabled substantial numbers of people to qualify for SDI and SSDI as well as all the other welfare benefits and trend of dependency and a sense of entitlement among portions of the population. The majority of recipients are not former mine workers.

Nothing much separates the populations of some rural Appellation communities from inner city ghettos, other than population density and ethnicity. Gangs tend to proliferate in densely populated areas.
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Old Yesterday, 12:36 PM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
30,666 posts, read 20,257,108 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serger View Post
Let's see, the milk I buy here (Texas) costs $3 half a gallon, I don't eat happy meals (or equivalent). Yes, gas is expensive in Europe, but public transportation is very good.

Now, let's compare the cost of college education, child care, paid leaves, retirement, etc.
Public transportation may be better, but it is also far more expensive (according to my link) and owning a car is a really expensive alternative.

Tuition at a Danish state school is about 13,500 (per year) which is about $14,977 (usd).

https://www.mastersportal.com/articl...ing-costs.html


It's $12,360 at the University of Kentucky.

2019-20 Tuition and Mandatory Fees | University of Kentucky Registrar
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Old Yesterday, 01:14 PM
Status: "but it depends on what the definition of "is" is." (set 18 days ago)
 
Location: Clyde Hill, WA
3,723 posts, read 661,783 times
Reputation: 1184
Quote:
Originally Posted by travis t View Post
I note nobody responded to this post, instead preferring to go on wild goose chases, so I post it again. I'd like to know in particular what OP's explanation for it is....


https://marginalrevolution.com/margi...han-danes.html

Quote:
Of the Nordic groups, Danish-Americans have the highest per capita income, clocking in at $70,925.
Danish Americans have a $23,000 higher per capita income than Danes in Denmark. Why?
I'm giving OP a third chance to respond to this question, which IMO is critical to his/her thread. He/she never responded, but it's possible that it just got lost in the shuffle.
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Old Yesterday, 04:19 PM
 
1,866 posts, read 1,016,764 times
Reputation: 902
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Public transportation may be better, but it is also far more expensive (according to my link) and owning a car is a really expensive alternative.

Tuition at a Danish state school is about 13,500 (per year) which is about $14,977 (usd).

https://www.mastersportal.com/articl...ing-costs.html


It's $12,360 at the University of Kentucky.

2019-20 Tuition and Mandatory Fees | University of Kentucky Registrar
Nice try. Higher education is free to all Danish citizens or permanent residents, and to all EU citizens, and some other categories. I think there is also a stipend.
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Old Yesterday, 04:28 PM
 
Location: Washington State
19,074 posts, read 9,832,201 times
Reputation: 16243
Quote:
Originally Posted by travis t View Post
I'm giving OP a third chance to respond to this question, which IMO is critical to his/her thread. He/she never responded, but it's possible that it just got lost in the shuffle.
Not only are Danes in the US making much more than Danes in Denmark, the US is also much less expensive overall after factoring in our higher health care and college tuition.
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Old Yesterday, 04:32 PM
 
32,898 posts, read 16,840,502 times
Reputation: 17757
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Tuition at a Danish state school is about 13,500 (per year) which is about $14,977 (usd).
That's for foreign students. Danes with the necessary qualifications can study for free and receive an admittedly modest stipend for living expenses for the scheduled study length. Government-backed study loans, too.

It's even set up so that in order to keep students focused on their studies, there's a limit for how much they're allowed to earn on the side. (Technically, they can earn as much as they want, but everything after the cut-off point is deducted from the stipend.)

Of course, there's a limited number of seats, so slots are assigned on an academic merit basis.

And - as is a given for all systems - this too has its problems. There's a joke out there that "student life would be great, if not for all that damn studying". No lack of people who get themselves into a less-sought-after major (easy to get into with mediocre grades) and then postpone adult life for 5 years.
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