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Old 08-23-2019, 02:11 PM
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
31,663 posts, read 14,068,921 times
Reputation: 22702

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grlzrl View Post
Seriously? You have not been out in the world much, have you? No matter where you travel, there are always people trying to get by with doing nothing for something. It takes different forms. In Venice, they try to con you with street card games. In LA, they try to convince you they need bus money because their car broke down. There are people in this world who enjoy scamming. If they put as much work into getting a real job as they do scamming people, they would probably do alright. This has been around since time began.
Street scammers and con artists are present all over the world, it has nothing to with welfare, Most scams are perpetrated by young single males who are not eligible for any welfare benefits except medical care and 3 months of SNAP every 3 years
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Old 08-24-2019, 02:11 AM
 
Location: Texas
27,278 posts, read 11,460,543 times
Reputation: 6295
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2sleepy View Post
I never said SNAP is stopped in Arizona after 12 months. And the 60 month federal limit for TANF is the max, states can set lower limits, i.e. Arizona 12 months, Connecticut 21 months, California 48 months, Texas 60 months.
All you did was cherry pick one form of welfare and applied it to only a few states.
"Plus states may use federal TANF funds to support up to 20 percent of the caseload beyond 60 months."

Time limits. While states can set their own time limit policies, they cannot provide cash assistance from federal TANF funds for longer than 60 months to a family that includes an adult recipient; however, states can exceed the 60-month limit for up to 20 percent of their caseload based on hardship. Federal law does not impose a time limit on “child-only families” (those with no adult receiving benefits) or on families receiving assistance funded entirely with state MOE funds. Most states have set time limits of five years on TANF- and MOE-funded assistance, though time limits in 21 states are shorter. States generally provide exceptions and exemptions for some groups of families who meet specific criteria, allowing them to receive assistance beyond the time limit. A few states continue benefits to the children in a family even after the parent reaches the time limit.

https://www.cbpp.org/research/family...uction-to-tanf

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2sleepy View Post
My point in this is to illustrate that Welfare does not provide a sustainable existence unless you are fortunate enough to get subsidized housing or can live rent free with friends or family.
By what measure? We are not a 3rd world country where people are impoverished.

"The government’s own data show that the actual living conditions of the more than 45 million people deemed “poor” by the Census Bureau differ greatly from popular conceptions of poverty.Consider these facts taken from various government reports:
Eighty percent of poor households have air conditioning. By contrast, at the beginning of the War on Poverty, only about 12 percent of the entire U.S. population enjoyed air conditioning.
Nearly three-quarters have a car or truck; 31 percent have two or more cars or trucks.[9]
Nearly two-thirds have cable or satellite television.
Two-thirds have at least one DVD player, and a quarter have two or more.
Half have a personal computer; one in seven has two or more computers.
More than half of poor families with children have a video game system such as an Xbox or PlayStation.
Forty-three percent have Internet access.
Forty percent have a wide-screen plasma or LCD TV.
A quarter have a digital video recorder system such as a TIVO.
Ninety-two percent of poor households have a microwave.

Ninety-six percent of poor parents stated that their children were never hungry at any time during the year because they could not afford food.
Some 83 percent of poor families reported that they had enough food to eat.
Some 82 percent of poor adults reported that they were never hungry at any time in the prior year due to lack of money to buy food.
As a group, America’s poor are far from being chronically undernourished. The average consumption of protein, vitamins, and minerals is virtually the same for poor and middle-class children and in most cases is well above recommended norms. Poor children actually consume more meat than do higher-income children and have average protein intakes 100 percent above recommended levels.
Most poor children today are, in fact, supernourished and grow up to be, on average, one inch taller and 10 pounds heavier than the GIs who stormed the beaches of Normandy in World War II."


https://www.heritage.org/poverty-and...after-50-years

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2sleepy View Post
I can't think of any reason why a person would choose a life on welfare over a job.
Then why do they do it?
How about this scenario? A couple with 2 children who makes 20k gets aid up to 35k. A couple who makes 37k wont get aid. Where's the incentive?
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Old 08-24-2019, 03:37 AM
 
4,431 posts, read 4,675,013 times
Reputation: 3885
Expanded school lunches is a reason I consider Obama the second worst President in U.S history behind LBJ. I hate programs like this. If you can't feed don't breed.
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Old 08-24-2019, 05:36 AM
 
6,707 posts, read 3,705,098 times
Reputation: 7596
The school district in Florida where I worked gave free hot breakfasts to ALL students, including on breaks and Summers. They could be children of millionaires and still get fed.

Were their complaints from the rich about this? Nope.

Edit: When schools were closed they had to hire extra part time help to cook. It was not only the costs of the food.
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Old 08-24-2019, 05:46 AM
 
4,310 posts, read 1,852,070 times
Reputation: 8772
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jo48 View Post
The school district in Florida where I worked gave free hot breakfasts to ALL students, including on breaks and Summers. They could be children of millionaires and still get fed.

Were their complaints from the rich about this? Nope.

Edit: When schools were closed they had to hire extra part time help to cook. It was not only the costs of the food.
That is because children were often coming in without eating breakfast. They would perform very poorly until lunchtime because they hadn’t had a meal in over 12 hours. They found it was cheaper to provide breakfast than to provide classroom and other interventions for all of these kids who really didn’t need any academic support.
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Old 08-24-2019, 05:52 AM
 
11,974 posts, read 8,640,633 times
Reputation: 7300
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jo48 View Post
The school district in Florida where I worked gave free hot breakfasts to ALL students, including on breaks and Summers. They could be children of millionaires and still get fed.

Were their complaints from the rich about this? Nope.

Edit: When schools were closed they had to hire extra part time help to cook. It was not only the costs of the food.
I'd rather the district pick up the cost of feeding breakfast than my school teacher daughter. She provided breakfast in her claasroom to kids she knew had none.
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Old 08-24-2019, 05:57 AM
 
30,486 posts, read 16,768,182 times
Reputation: 14134
I lost count of all the lost classmates that perished from not eating breakfast and skipping lunch. So painful to watch too, distended bellies, swarming flies..
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Old 08-24-2019, 09:01 AM
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
31,663 posts, read 14,068,921 times
Reputation: 22702
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loveshiscountry View Post
All you did was cherry pick one form of welfare and applied it to only a few states. "Plus states may use federal TANF funds to support up to 20 percent of the caseload beyond 60 months."
You seem to think that all people who are categorized as being "poor" are on "welfare" which is just plain absurd. In 2017 only 23% of people living in poverty received TANF
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loveshiscountry View Post
[i]"The government’s own data show that the actual living conditions of the more than 45 million people deemed “poor” by the Census Bureau differ greatly from popular conceptions of poverty.Consider these facts taken from various government reports:
Eighty percent of poor households have air conditioning. By contrast, at the beginning of the War on Poverty, only about 12 percent of the entire U.S. population enjoyed air conditioning. Nearly three-quarters have a car or truck; 31 percent have two or more cars or trucks.[9] Nearly two-thirds have cable or satellite television. Ninety-six percent of poor parents stated that their children were never hungry at any time during the year because they could not afford food. Some 83 percent of poor families reported that they had enough food to eat. Some 82 percent of poor adults reported that they were never hungry at any time in the prior year due to lack of money to buy food.
The list was originally compiled by Robert Rector in the 90's and he didn't source it even then. Heritage still uses the data by carefully taking out "DVD player"
But here's the thing you ignore: Most of the working age poor have jobs, so I'm not sure why you would think it odd that a person who has a job would have cable TV?
Quote:
The “working poor” are people who spend 27 weeks or more in a year in the labor force either working or looking for work but whose incomes fall below the poverty level. According to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, about 9.5 million of people who spent at least 27 weeks in the labor force were poor. That year, the working poor comprised 6.3 percent of all individuals in the labor force.

The majority of the people who live below the poverty level do not work, but this includes children, the elderly and the disabled poor. Among the poor between ages 18 and 64 who are not disabled or in school in 2014, 51.8 percent worked for part of the previous year. However, only 25.2 percent of these “able-bodied” poor worked more than 50 weeks.

In 2014, the working poor as a fraction of all people in the labor force for 27 weeks or more were:

11.7% Black, 11.7% Hispanic/Latino, 5.5% White, 4.3% Asian
7.2% women, 5.5% men
18.3% with less than a high school diploma
8.3% high school graduates with no college education
2% with a bachelor’s degree or higher
https://poverty.ucdavis.edu/faq/who-...overty%20level.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loveshiscountry View Post
Then why do they do it?
How about this scenario? A couple with 2 children who makes 20k gets aid up to 35k. A couple who makes 37k wont get aid. Where's the incentive?
Source please because that makes no sense at all.

Bottom line is you failed to refute my claim that welfare benefits do not provide a disincentive to work.
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Old 08-24-2019, 10:13 AM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
34,180 posts, read 42,758,751 times
Reputation: 43766
I think what a lot of you, and most everyone, miss is that there are literally millions of totally dysfunctional adults out there. I'm not talking the working poor or those, through no fault of their own, have hit rough times but totally and completely dysfunctional. Meaning can't even organize themselves enough to pour a bowl of cereal. That's because most people don't come into contact with them.

Alcohol and drugs play a part but so does a subculture of multi generational dependency. It goes across demographics and location but you do see more in urban areas just due to population density.

Temporary programs become permanent and are passed down.

It's easy to say "don't breed 'em if you can't feed 'em" but that's unrealistic unless you want to go down the eugenics road.

I was 30 when I started teaching. Early on I had a parent conference with a 28 year old mother who came to arrange take home work for her pregnant 14 year old daughter, the oldest of five kids (I had her and her year younger brother). Does anyone think those kids learned how to function?

At the middle/upper middle class high school I went to a few years later I had one girl whose family kicked her out in 10th grade. She apparently was getting "snotty" (Mom's description) because she hadn't dropped out in 9th grade, as everyone else in the family had done as far back as you cared to go, and wouldn't get pregnant to "help the family" with bills. She did end up pregnant as a Senior.

That's who you're dealing with.
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Old 08-24-2019, 10:16 AM
 
24,192 posts, read 12,682,390 times
Reputation: 7764
ANd let's remember who is in charge at the federal level. Oh Republicans.

But somehow it will be blame don those dam Democrats.

Look -- conservatives have a problem...their claims for fiscal responsibility are proven to be just rants and dreams and rainbows. This administration has done nothing to show they are interested in a fiscally responsible government.

All they want -- to get back at those dam liberals.

That's not responsible financial management.
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