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Old Yesterday, 11:01 AM
 
13,255 posts, read 4,051,909 times
Reputation: 3959

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Quote:
Originally Posted by tamajane View Post
Yes, but They will need someone to chase down after the demise (much of it self-inflicted) of white people.. I believe They are already going after Asians for their numbers in universities. They will go after Chinese/Japanese before Indians, for racist reasons.
I agree that is true but for the most part liberals are chewing up whites for now anyway. As the Hispanic and Asian population keeps growing with open borders, there's going to be more collision with Asians no doubt.
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Old Yesterday, 11:09 AM
 
223 posts, read 46,407 times
Reputation: 292
Disparities are more economic rather than racial with the gaps between races decreasing. Gifted classes or not, I'm sure the smart ones that work hard will continue to excel. Asians as a group get the best grades and test scores compared to whites and excel regardless.
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Old Yesterday, 11:12 AM
 
Location: Bran's tree
11,245 posts, read 4,973,592 times
Reputation: 12558
Quote:
Originally Posted by elan View Post
It sounds ridiculous to me that a city the size of New York City doesn't have a sizeable gifted black and Hispanic population. Surely they do.
Although I'm multiracial, I primarily identified as Hispanic, and this proposal horrifies me. I was in gifted programs all throughout school since grade 2, and even they often weren't as mentally stimulating as I'd have liked.

If the curriculum is too easy, it's impossible to be engaged. Day after day, sitting through classes that are way too easy feels like Chinese water torture.

All this to avoid the prospect of offending people who probably didn't even have a clue that such programs existed?
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Old Yesterday, 11:16 AM
 
Location: Pine Grove,AL
23,630 posts, read 11,702,950 times
Reputation: 4378
Quote:
Originally Posted by MPowering1 View Post
Ah, thanks for the clarification.



You're talking about two different things. I know a few families who paid for tutors or online classes to help them study before taking the ACT or SAT test - but that has NOTHING to do with getting into gifted programs.
It does in New York, at least that is what the article said, If you disagree, your problem is with the source info in the article, not me, and im guessing they are right and not you.

Quote:
Nobody in my kids high school had to test for accelerated classes. They were recommended by teachers who saw they were sailing through the material and not challenged. And they went to one of the highest ranked high schools in the state, and is ranked 155 in the nation.
Again, your personal experience doesnt matter here, the article specifically states there is an exam the students take to be admitted. This isnt hard to understand.
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Old Yesterday, 12:03 PM
 
Location: Central NJ and PA
2,568 posts, read 856,639 times
Reputation: 1771
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsjj251 View Post
Im not sure if you are joking or if you just seriously dont understand the context to which you are responding to.


Yes, tutors help people who are failing classes, but tutors also help people who are higher up who still want to improve on their grade or do better on a specific test. If you genuinly never heard of that, then your community was either less wealthy than you claim, or you were just naive to it. My community is on the lower end and even I knew of smart kids who hired tutors to help them get higher grades on standardized tests, ACT, SAT, ARMT, Grad exams, and so on.


And in the case of New York, yes, passing a standardized test is exactly how you get into the gifted program there, at least according to the article.
Yes, passing a standardized test is how you get in. There was no amount of extra help that was going to get my son into a gifted class, though. It can be a minor help, but many of the questions are patterns, where the child needs to be able to recognize that pattern and determine what comes next. There's only so much you can do to teach that. All of the G&T schools that I knew of allowed for kids to retake the test up until 2nd grade.

As for what constitutes "gifted", it's doubtful Manhattan has 40% of all children being truly gifted, but there was a study done that showed people who moved into city centers (urban areas were a separate category, so think Manhattan/outer boroughs) had higher intelligence than others who didn't move or who moved to different locations. It varies depending on who was moving where. In any case, it certainly is possible for there to be a greater-than-normal number of kids in gifted programs as an overall percentage of the population.

I think a case could be easily made for expanding both the definition of gifted and the program itself. Most of the G&T classes were (are?) in areas of the city with a higher percentage of whites and Asians. I knew of at least two black families who didn't bother with the test because there was no school close enough. Similarly, we ruled out Brooklyn Tech for my daughter because it would take her too long to get there. We did consider Bronx Science, but when she got into LaGuardia that's where we sent her because it was so much closer to home.

I know there's a big struggle with the idea of segregation, but honestly, if the schools with a larger percentage of minority students were performing at nearly identical levels, I don't think most people would have an issue with how many kids of whatever color went there. Look at historically black colleges as an example.

If I got to run the city schools (lol) I'd put MORE gifted classes in more schools, keeping test-based admissions. There's some argument that if white and/or wealthy families earned most of the spots that it wouldn't help, but very, very few parents are going to have their kid going to a school that takes over an hour to get to. I think DeBlasio means well, but is going about this from the wrong direction. Completely wrong.
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Old Yesterday, 12:08 PM
 
Location: Central NJ and PA
2,568 posts, read 856,639 times
Reputation: 1771
Quick funny thing about NJ schools. They "cheat"; at least our district does. They've learned to take advantage of parental involvement in an epic way.

We got a letter stating that one son had been identified as a child who would benefit from an accelerated math program. Great! Not so fast, though. Reading further, the class was not going to be faster paced. He is going to be skipping 6th grade math, and is individually responsible for teaching himself the missing material. Well-played, BOE, well-played.
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Old Yesterday, 02:56 PM
 
Location: New York
542 posts, read 483,793 times
Reputation: 564
My post was deleted for simply pointing out that there is an evolutionary component to race and that just moving minorities into white/Asian classes will never change anything. Poor whites still outscore rich blacks for example.

The 1984 mod style of CD is sad.
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Old Yesterday, 03:22 PM
 
30,536 posts, read 15,792,727 times
Reputation: 20444
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dark Enlightenment View Post
Students qualify for gifted programs because they are gifted, not because they are rich or white.
A large number of white liberals don't believe blacks are equal in intelligence, drive or talent; therefore, blacks require a helping hand.
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Old Yesterday, 03:56 PM
 
Location: Suburb of Chicago
21,450 posts, read 10,342,613 times
Reputation: 20597
Quote:
Originally Posted by swilliamsny View Post
Yes, passing a standardized test is how you get in. There was no amount of extra help that was going to get my son into a gifted class, though. It can be a minor help, but many of the questions are patterns, where the child needs to be able to recognize that pattern and determine what comes next. There's only so much you can do to teach that. All of the G&T schools that I knew of allowed for kids to retake the test up until 2nd grade.

As for what constitutes "gifted", it's doubtful Manhattan has 40% of all children being truly gifted, but there was a study done that showed people who moved into city centers (urban areas were a separate category, so think Manhattan/outer boroughs) had higher intelligence than others who didn't move or who moved to different locations. It varies depending on who was moving where. In any case, it certainly is possible for there to be a greater-than-normal number of kids in gifted programs as an overall percentage of the population.

I think a case could be easily made for expanding both the definition of gifted and the program itself. Most of the G&T classes were (are?) in areas of the city with a higher percentage of whites and Asians. I knew of at least two black families who didn't bother with the test because there was no school close enough. Similarly, we ruled out Brooklyn Tech for my daughter because it would take her too long to get there. We did consider Bronx Science, but when she got into LaGuardia that's where we sent her because it was so much closer to home.

I know there's a big struggle with the idea of segregation, but honestly, if the schools with a larger percentage of minority students were performing at nearly identical levels, I don't think most people would have an issue with how many kids of whatever color went there. Look at historically black colleges as an example.

If I got to run the city schools (lol) I'd put MORE gifted classes in more schools, keeping test-based admissions. There's some argument that if white and/or wealthy families earned most of the spots that it wouldn't help, but very, very few parents are going to have their kid going to a school that takes over an hour to get to. I think DeBlasio means well, but is going about this from the wrong direction. Completely wrong.
Acknowledging that dsjj is correct and a test is required per the article and your experience, let me ask if you were aware if any students had tutors, even though yours didn't have additional help.
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Old Yesterday, 04:50 PM
 
Location: Central NJ and PA
2,568 posts, read 856,639 times
Reputation: 1771
Quote:
Originally Posted by MPowering1 View Post
Acknowledging that dsjj is correct and a test is required per the article and your experience, let me ask if you were aware if any students had tutors, even though yours didn't have additional help.
No tutors that I was aware of, though if you do an online search you will find tutors advertised. I do know of several families that bought practice tests. The practice tests can range from about $25 to $100, depending on how many tests are included and which company you purchase from. You can find a number of free sample test questions online, and iirc, NYC DOE will also give you a shorter sample test.
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