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Old 09-06-2019, 04:52 AM
 
763 posts, read 217,823 times
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The website is interesting, but the article details how the use of the wrong statistics makes the US look pretty bad when it's pretty awesome.


https://fee.org/articles/the-poorest...ons-of-europe/
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Old 09-06-2019, 05:33 AM
 
Location: Washington State
19,545 posts, read 10,135,223 times
Reputation: 16657
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGoodTheBadTheUgly View Post
The website is interesting, but the article details how the use of the wrong statistics makes the US look pretty bad when it's pretty awesome.


https://fee.org/articles/the-poorest...ons-of-europe/
The people developing most of these Quality of Life and other stats specifically set them up to try to downgrade the USA and lift the poorer European countries over us for their political purposes.
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Old 09-06-2019, 05:36 AM
 
Location: Great Britain
12,650 posts, read 4,367,488 times
Reputation: 7843
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGoodTheBadTheUgly View Post
The website is interesting, but the article details how the use of the wrong statistics makes the US look pretty bad when it's pretty awesome.


https://fee.org/articles/the-poorest...ons-of-europe/
The fact that food stamps, charity and medicare is not included does not make the US awesome.

As fpr consumption, the US accounts for a high percentage of global consumption, and 20% as the bottom figure covers around 60 to 70 million Americans, and would be a very high poverty rate and what defines a poverty rate is usually controversial and subject to scrutiny, as different studies often take different things in to account. Although I should imagine that the US poverty rate however it is defined is a lot lower than 20%, as that would put it on a par with Romania and Bulgaria in Europe.

Last edited by Brave New World; 09-06-2019 at 05:46 AM..
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Old 09-06-2019, 06:08 AM
 
38,389 posts, read 16,666,185 times
Reputation: 8742
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBMorgan View Post
Someone only 4-5 yrs ago said something about carnage and the need to MAGA ---but the honest truth is our country has been great, we've done some of the greatest feats in human history. Don't let him make you think otherwise.

And how great your country might be is measured by how you take care of the folks on the lowest economic end - the folks who are homeless, who don't know where their next meal will come from, who have to work 2-3 jobs to pay bills, who aren't assured health care when they need it. The folks the DEMS look after -
"And how great your country might be is measured by how you take care of the folks on the lowest economic end - the folks who are homeless,"


Emphasis on "MIGHT BE", which is purely YOUR opinion and NOT based on any part of the Constitution.
"
“When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.”
-Benjamin Franklin
“To take from one, because it is thought his own industry and that of his fathers has acquired too much, in order to spare to others, who, or whose fathers, have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, the guarantee to everyone the free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it.”
-Thomas Jefferson, letter to Joseph Milligan, April 6, 1816
“A wise and frugal government … shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government.”
-Thomas Jefferson, First Inaugural Address, March 4, 1801
“Congress has not unlimited powers to provide for the general welfare, but only those specifically enumerated.”
-Thomas Jefferson
“When all government, domestic and foreign, in little as in great things, shall be drawn to Washington as the center of all power, it will render powerless the checks provided of one government on another and will become as venal and oppressive as the government from which we separated.”
-Thomas Jefferson to Charles Hammond, 1821. The Writings of Thomas Jefferson, (Memorial Edition) Lipscomb and Bergh, editors, ME 15:332
“The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground.”
-Thomas Jefferson, letter to E. Carrington, May 27, 1788
“The moment the idea is admitted into society that property is not as sacred as the laws of God, and that there is not a force of law and public justice to protect it, anarchy and tyranny commence. If ‘Thou shalt not covet’ and ‘Thou shalt not steal’ were not commandments of Heaven, they must be made inviolable precepts in every society before it can be civilized or made free.”
-John Adams, A Defense of the Constitutions of Government of the United States of America, 1787
James Madison, the Father of the Constitution, elab ated upon this limitation in a letter to James Robertson:
“With respect to the two words ‘general welfare,’ I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them. To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators.” In 1794, when Congress appropriated $15,000 for relief of French refugees who fled from insurrection in San Domingo to Baltimore and Philadelphia, James Madison stood on the floor of the House to object saying, “I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents.”
-James Madison, 4 Annals of congress 179 (1794)
“…[T]he government of the United States is a definite government, confined to specified objects. It is not like the state governments, whose powers are more general. Charity is no part of the legislative duty of the government.”
-James Madison
“If Congress can do whatever in their discretion can be done by money, and will promote the general welfare, the government is no longer a limited one possessing enumerated powers, but an indefinite one subject to particular exceptions.” James Madison, “Letter to Edmund Pendleton,”
-James Madison, January 21, 1792, in The Papers of James Madison, vol. 14, Robert A Rutland et. al., ed (Charlottesvile: University Press of Virginia,1984).
“An elective despotism was not the government we fought for; but one in which the powers of government should be so divided and balanced among the several bodies of magistracy as that no one could transcend their legal limits without being effectually checked and restrained by the others.”

"James Madison, the Father of the Constitution, elaborated upon this limitation in a letter to James Robertson:
“With respect to the two words ‘general welfare,’ I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them. To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators.”


"In 1794, when Congress appropriated $15,000 for relief of French refugees who fled from insurrection in San Domingo to Baltimore and Philadelphia, James Madison stood on the floor of the House to object saying, “I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents.”
-James Madison, 4 Annals of congress 179 (1794)"


https://conservativecolloquium.wordp...-federal-govt/
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Old 09-06-2019, 02:47 PM
 
Location: Texas
27,524 posts, read 11,592,673 times
Reputation: 6389
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
The fact that food stamps, charity and medicare is not included does not make the US awesome.

As fpr consumption, the US accounts for a high percentage of global consumption, and 20% as the bottom figure covers around 60 to 70 million Americans, and would be a very high poverty rate and what defines a poverty rate is usually controversial and subject to scrutiny, as different studies often take different things in to account. Although I should imagine that the US poverty rate however it is defined is a lot lower than 20%, as that would put it on a par with Romania and Bulgaria in Europe.
Since 1970 the US poverty rate has hovered around 13% +/- 2.

Poor in America are unlike poor in other countries.
from 2014

Eighty percent of poor households have air conditioning. By contrast, at the beginning of the War on Poverty, only about 12 percent of the entire U.S. population enjoyed air conditioning.

Ninety-six percent of poor parents stated that their children were never hungry at any time during the year because they could not afford food.

Some 83 percent of poor families reported that they had enough food to eat.

Some 82 percent of poor adults reported that they were never hungry at any time in the prior year due to lack of money to buy food.

Nearly three-quarters have a car or truck; 31 percent have two or more cars or trucks.

Over the course of a year, only 4 percent of poor persons become temporarily homeless. At a single point in time, one in 70 poor persons is homeless.


https://www.heritage.org/poverty-and...after-50-years
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Old 09-06-2019, 02:59 PM
 
3,631 posts, read 2,622,187 times
Reputation: 7086
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBMorgan View Post
Someone only 4-5 yrs ago said something about carnage and the need to MAGA ---but the honest truth is our country has been great, we've done some of the greatest feats in human history. Don't let him make you think otherwise.

And how great your country might be is measured by how you take care of the folks on the lowest economic end - the folks who are homeless, who don't know where their next meal will come from, who have to work 2-3 jobs to pay bills, who aren't assured health care when they need it. The folks the DEMS look after -
Except that the Dems DON'T much look after these people, but do actively work against the people in general. You need look no further than Obamacare for example. Hypothetically, 20-30 million more people have access to healthcare. In reality, far FEWER do, because those who used to have good insurance now have to choose between going to a doctor visit and putting food on the table, due to skyrocketing premiums and deductibles, created by giving people a "benefit" without creating supply.

Homeless? Do you not understand that our good, hard-working folks in inner cities are stepping on ****, heroine needles, and sometimes being directly assaulted by these junkies and criminals that you think are the most needy and vulnerable? In any just society, they would be removed.

It is a all a scam. Let me inform you of the purpose, since you are uneducated. In an left-run society, the elites have access to the best of things, and, because the conditions for self-improvement are not there, no one else can displace them. Democrats don't give a rat's ass about you. They want to prevent you from taking Nancy Pelosi's spot on the food chain.

As for European countries, they are managing it a little better than Venuzuela, Zimbabwe and Cuba, because they were rebuilt after the war with American money, and rely on America for their defense spending. They are still on the last legs of their ponzi schemes. They are a seventh of the world's population, 25% of its GDP, and 50% of its social spending. The writing is on the wall, and they know it. Another dirty little secret I can help you with--that's why they hate Donald Trump. He's making them pony up for their own defense spending.
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Old 09-06-2019, 03:23 PM
 
Location: Croatia and Worldwideweb
650 posts, read 200,784 times
Reputation: 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGoodTheBadTheUgly View Post
The website is interesting, but the article details how the use of the wrong statistics makes the US look pretty bad when it's pretty awesome.


https://fee.org/articles/the-poorest...ons-of-europe/
Where to start. Ok, let's start from the title itself. I won't be a grammar nazi here, so let's just focus on one word - socialist.

1. There are no socialist nations in Europe - only ex-socialist ie communist countries.
If you think about countries with a strong social safety net, they are still not socialist. They are capitalist countries with strong social-democratic tendencies.
Definition to help you
Quote:
Socialism is an economic and political system where the ways of making a living (factories, offices, etc.) are owned by the workers who run them and the people who depend on them.
2. In countries like Hungary, Poland and others - my country Croatia is somewhere in this bracket - any amount of money has the buying power about 3 times higher than in US. So, if you are talking about 10000 dollars in Hungary, that is equivalent to 30 thousand dollars in US.

Not for all items, but for the most important, yes.

Example: in my town 15000 people and the neighbouring town of 40000 ppl, you can rent a comfortable 2 bedroom apartment for anywhere between 100 and 200 dollars. In the capital, Zagreb, close to 1M inhabitants, you can have that for anywhere between 500-800 dollars, if more, it's a luxurious place.

In a cafe on the corner, 30 yards from my place, Coca Cola is equivalent to 2 dollars, cup of cofee 1.5 dollar. Loaf of bread in the shop opposite the cafe is 1 dollar. Most expensive loaf of bread is not more than 2. Little Coca Cola in the shop, around 1 dollar.

Where prices are more equal is tech stuff. Some computers and similar stuff may be even a bit cheaper in US, bcs taxes. But things we spend on every day are way way cheaper than in US, if I'm not mistaken.

Last edited by switchtoecig; 09-06-2019 at 03:59 PM.. Reason: grammar
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Old 09-06-2019, 03:51 PM
 
Location: Florida
23,023 posts, read 9,872,385 times
Reputation: 18948
Quote:
Originally Posted by switchtoecig View Post
Where to start. Ok, let's start from the title itself. I won't be a grammar nazi here, so let's just focus on one word - socialist.

1. There are no socialist nations in Europe - only ex-socialist ie communist countries.
If you think about countries with a strong social safety net, they are still not socialist. They are capitalist countries with strong social-democratic tendencies.
Definition to help you

2. In countries like Hungary, Poland and others - my country Croatia is somewhere in this bracket - any amount of money has the buying power about 3 times higher than in US. So, if you are talking about 10000 dollars in Hungary, that is equivalent to 30 thousand dollars in US.

Not for all items, but for the most important, yes.

Example: in my town 15000 people and the neighbouring town of 40000 ppl, you can rent a comfortable 2 bedroom apartment for anywhere between 100 and 200 dollars. In the capital, Zagreb, close to 1M inhabitants, you can have that for anywhere between 500-800 dollars, if more, it's a luxurious place.

In a cafe on the corner, 30 yards from my place, Coca Cola is equivalent to 2 dollars, cup of cofee 1.5 dollar. Loaf of bread in the shop opposite the cafe is 1 dollar. Most expensive loaf of bread is not more than 2. Little Coca Cola in the shop, around 1 dollar.

Where prices are more equal is tech stuff. Some computers and similar stuff may be even a bit cheaper in US, bcs taxes. But things we spend on every day is way way cheaper than in US, if I'm not mistaken.
And this is why many Americans are choosing to retire in Europe. The COL (not everywhere in Europe, but in general) is less than the US. Your dollars go a whole lot further even though the Euro is worth more. We have a chart that was published which shows how long your money will last in various European country if you retire. Super-affordable.

France, Spain, Portugal, Italy, Croatia and other countries were listed. You can live there for a lot longer on less money, plus have the benefits of what I consider to be a better lifestyle. I was floored at how low the cost of property and the cost of living is.
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Old 09-06-2019, 04:17 PM
 
Location: Croatia and Worldwideweb
650 posts, read 200,784 times
Reputation: 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by Enigma777 View Post
And this is why many Americans are choosing to retire in Europe. The COL (not everywhere in Europe, but in general) is less than the US. Your dollars go a whole lot further even though the Euro is worth more. We have a chart that was published which shows how long your money will last in various European country if you retire. Super-affordable.

France, Spain, Portugal, Italy, Croatia and other countries were listed. You can live there for a lot longer on less money, plus have the benefits of what I consider to be a better lifestyle. I was floored at how low the cost of property and the cost of living is.
Yup. Croatia is advertised like - Small country for a great vacation. And what you said is true. Also, walkability, safety, and last but not least - solid and safe public transportation. I don't need a car, and that is great, nobody wants me on the road. Everybody around me drives anyway. Healthcare, once the best part of ex-Yugoslavia, has been crumbling for decades, but is still better for average Joe than in US, from what I hear.

Digression: However, may God help anyone who wants to start a business here. Or even a little, humble, sole proprietorship. Taxes will leave you shirtless. Been there and still recovering. Plus since Croatia became an EU member, many of our young folks left searching for a job. We are losing the most valuable capital of all - the human capital. And the idiots in the government don't realize how fatal it is for our future. Maybe the only way out will be inviting American boomers to come and live here.

So, each coin has two sides.

I just wanted to show OP that he didn't take everything into consideration.
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Old 09-06-2019, 06:20 PM
 
16 posts, read 2,641 times
Reputation: 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGoodTheBadTheUgly View Post
The website is interesting, but the article details how the use of the wrong statistics makes the US look pretty bad when it's pretty awesome.


[URL="https://fee.org/articles/the-poorest-20-of-americans-are-richer-than-most-nations-of-europe/"]https://fee.org/articles/the-poorest-20-of-americans-are-richer-than-most-nations-of-europe/[/URL]
That may be true, but there is so much potential with the United States. there seems to be a severe political speed bump at the moment. and its going to hold us back from being the greatest we can be.
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