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Old 09-07-2019, 11:56 PM
 
82 posts, read 12,876 times
Reputation: 54

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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtl1 View Post
Not when non-CA vehicles are manufactured to CARB standards and not Federal standards. If California or a local government appropriates a federal commerce duty affecting the emissions standards of my vehicle then it's violating the constitution and my civil rights.
California never required vehicles not sold in CA to be manufactured to CARB standards. There's no regulation or law that dictates that at either the federal level or at the CA level. Also, what part of the constitution, specifically, was violated?
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Old 09-07-2019, 11:59 PM
 
82 posts, read 12,876 times
Reputation: 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spottednikes View Post
I'd like the car manufacturers to huild cars to federal standards. Maybe when califorbians can't buy new cars, they will start electing normal people.
You may want to write to the car manufacturers... it's up to them where they choose to sell their cars...
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Old 09-08-2019, 12:00 AM
 
13,685 posts, read 4,205,352 times
Reputation: 4093
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBot View Post
What part of the constitution did CARB violate?
The Commerce Clause by not allowing the importation and sale of Federal standards vehicles.

CA was I think given permission to establish CARB regulations and it might've made some sense up till the late 70s and early 80s, but it doesn't make sense now. California is abusing it and CARB should be done away with.
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Old 09-08-2019, 12:02 AM
 
82 posts, read 12,876 times
Reputation: 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtl1 View Post
You can't have states with different automotive emissions, fuel mileage or safety standards because it would affect interstate commerce.
CARB requirements don't create barriers to interstate commerce since CARB emissions requirements meet the requirements in all states. In this particular case, the Federal government has no constitutional power to do anything since there's no limitation of interstate commerce at play.
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Old 09-08-2019, 12:05 AM
 
82 posts, read 12,876 times
Reputation: 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtl1 View Post
The Commerce Clause by not allowing the importation and sale of Federal standards vehicles.

CA was I think given permission to establish CARB regulations and it might've made some sense up till the late 70s and early 80s, but it doesn't make sense now. California is abusing it and CARB should be done away with.
Manufacturers are already conforming to CARB standards and have agreed to continue doing so. It's really a non-issue at this point.

And it's not your rights that would have been violated. It's the car manufacturers. It's up to them how they want to deal with it.
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Old 09-08-2019, 12:11 AM
 
13,685 posts, read 4,205,352 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subaru5555 View Post
Direct injection has been around for decades, as has power steering, and they both pre-date Obama.....so I have no idea what you’re on about other than whining about Obama.


Any you know what, “car guy[s]” don’t even represent 1% of the market, so don’t delude yourself into thinking that you have *any idea* what the average consumer wants.
Gas direct injection is not a new concept. It's been around for many decades, just almost never used in a production road car for good reason until recently. Diesel are direct injection of course. But gas direct injection is not a good idea for affordable and reliable consumer automobiles. And I said electric power steering, not just power steering, which has poor feedback and road feel compared to hydraulic assist. These technologies are being used to get a small increase in fuel efficiency and lowered emissions but at a cost that is not worth it.

I realize most car owners are far from car guys, but we have government and non-car guys designing flawed cars.
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Old 09-08-2019, 12:15 AM
 
82 posts, read 12,876 times
Reputation: 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtl1 View Post
That one standard should be the federal standard. CA shouldn't decide the standard to which vehicles will be built for the entire country. That is affecting interstate commerce-making cars more expensive, less reliable and less desirable.
CA isn't deciding what is built for the entire country. Car manufacturers are. Also, the federal regulations are "minimum standards". In fact, when terms like "exceeds" and "below" are used, it implies the federal government wants these to be the minimum and beyond minimum is a reasonable expectation.
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Old 09-08-2019, 12:15 AM
 
13,685 posts, read 4,205,352 times
Reputation: 4093
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBot View Post
Manufacturers are already conforming to CARB standards and have agreed to continue doing so. It's really a non-issue at this point.

And it's not your rights that would have been violated. It's the car manufacturers. It's up to them how they want to deal with it.
That's the issue . CARB is effectively setting the standards instead of Federal. There should be no CARB only Federal standards.
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Old 09-08-2019, 12:28 AM
 
82 posts, read 12,876 times
Reputation: 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtl1 View Post
That's the issue . CARB is effectively setting the standards instead of Federal. There should be no CARB only Federal standards.
CARB is setting the standard for California. Not for the US.

As a conservative, I'd argue the opposite. Federal powers should be limited. But you liberals want big central governments -- and this is a demonstration of wanting the Federal government to be heavy handed... Fortunately, we aren't a communist country.
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Old 09-08-2019, 12:32 AM
 
13,685 posts, read 4,205,352 times
Reputation: 4093
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBot View Post
CARB is setting the standard for California. Not for the US.

As a conservative, I'd argue the opposite. Federal powers should be limited. But you liberals want big central governments -- and this is a demonstration of wanting the Federal government to be heavy handed... Fortunately, we aren't a communist country.
You are talking in circles. I'm the conservative here wanting to go back before CARB was created. I want CARB to go away and there to be one Federal standards for emissions and safety and I want those standards to be relaxed. The Commerce Clause of the constitution certainly fits when it comes to vehicle standards if it applies to anything. I'm all for states becoming sovereign nations even but until then there should be one Federal standards for vehicles. The Federal government is suppose to set standards and regulations related to or effecting interstate and international commerce, not the individual states.
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