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Old 09-11-2019, 08:04 AM
 
10,135 posts, read 2,496,936 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RageX View Post
My only disagreement is how can Israel annex a place that was originally theirs?
It was never theirs. Israel as a state has existed since the late 1940's. It in no way resembles the Hebrew/Canaanite nations of the Old Testament and has no connection to them other than a claim to be a homeland for the modern Jewish people, it is a modern creation.

Furthermore, the non-Jewish Palestinians are descended from the original Hebrew population living there, from both the Judean and the Israelite communities. They are the actual inheritors, father to son for generation after generation, of the land which they occupy.

The Jews of Europe and elsewhere had mostly migrated out of the Palestinian region during the Hellenistic period (after Alexander the Great) and the Roman period. By the time of Philo, there were more Jews living outside of Palestine than within it (India, north Africa, and southern Europe). The Septuagint/Greek language bible (the basis for the Catholic and Orthodox Christian Old Testaments) was translated in Alexandria, Egypt for synagogues outside of Palestine in the west which more often than not didn't understand the original Hebrew but lived and worked in greek.

In addition, it is no magic that Jews around the world come to physically resemble their neighbors. The Jewish diaspora in every direction mixed with the local populations they lived among, at times accepting converts. The Jewish community of Europe is mostly descended from these economic migrants and their occasional mixed marriages. Their cousins, the Jews who remained in Palestine, were the ancestors of the Palestinian people of today.
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Old 09-11-2019, 08:19 AM
 
19,707 posts, read 17,745,571 times
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Sounds like a reasonable course of action. If they can force a compromise and do an exchange to have it not happen, that also sounds like a reasonable course of action. What can the Palestinians offer in return on the bargaining table?
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Old 09-11-2019, 08:29 AM
 
13,694 posts, read 4,154,334 times
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I wouldn't normally care how Israel decided to deal with the Palestinian and muslim menace who took over so much Christian land in the middle east. But Jews have to play by the same rules they foist on others, accordingly Israel needs to become more diverse and majority minority.
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Old 09-11-2019, 08:42 AM
Status: "Hard work is never easy" (set 7 days ago)
 
Location: Florida/Tennessee
3,152 posts, read 4,464,855 times
Reputation: 1841
Quote:
Originally Posted by kanonka View Post
Imagine some aliens (no matter the country/planet/whatever) invade and settle NY, kicking out every American from there, proclaiming that NY is now alien-only country based on that they lived there .. a million years ago. You for sure would love them, don't you?

Now continue your statement.
The mirror is a great invention, is it?
My statement is true, measurable and provable... yours is make believe and science fiction.
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Old 09-11-2019, 08:48 AM
 
32,576 posts, read 33,450,529 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave_n_Tenn View Post
No I'm not and if you believe this started in 1948 then you have little understanding of human history.
To add to this, there was a constant Jewish population in Hebron (in the West Bank) until 1929 when the local Arabs rioted and killed several Jews. So there is a good reason to consider the Jews now living there as ones who returned to the their land and one would understand why Israel would want to annex Hebron (& the surrounding area).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1929_Hebron_massacre
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Old 09-11-2019, 08:49 AM
 
9,689 posts, read 4,960,748 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RainMusic View Post
Why have these "Jews" forgotten Hitler's cruelty and talk of a 'Final Solution'? Sigh...
These "Jews" are really bad at exterminating the Palestinians. There are how many, 5-6 million ? of them in the West Bank and Gaza. You'd think Israel would at least round-up Palestinian 1st born daughters to assure there would be fewer of them in the future.
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Old 09-11-2019, 09:44 AM
 
3,206 posts, read 867,776 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave_n_Tenn View Post
Christian and Arab Israeli citizens have the same rights as Jews. There is no such thing as palestinian people and never was a nation or state. They are a "created" people. Gaza is equivalent to a neighborhood, a really bad lawless neighborhood and reminds me of the movie "Escape from New York". Completely surrounded by a wall from Israel and Egypt.

Saying the palestinians are entitled to a nation state is like saying people of Appalachia are entitled to their own state. They're just a bunch of hillbillies.
The problem with the annexation proposals is they create more Gaza's. The issue is not necessarily to annex or not, but how the West Bank is governed. How populations living in encircled enclaves fare. Corrupt as the Palestinian National Authority may be, in Gaza you've got Hamas.

Netanyahu claimed in a recent speech that he would not be “annexing even one Palestinian.” In the current annexation proposal, he carved out Jericho and nearby Palestinian villages instead encircling them with much larger newly taken Israeli land.

Proposals like this may get Netanyahu the coalition he needs to remain in power. Throwing Netanyahu all sorts of goodies may help Trump with votes from the U.S. Christian right. But these political machinations come with a real price. The more annexation is discussed and the more it is proposed the more likely it will come about - and not in some form of a western-style West Bank.
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Old 09-11-2019, 10:01 AM
 
3,206 posts, read 867,776 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave_n_Tenn View Post
Imagine a country the size of NJ in an area greater in size than the United States, surrounded by nations and people who OPENLY admit they would commit genocide against the Jews, in a world that openly hates and constantly condemns them in the UN for proactively wanting to stay alive, where the rule of law prevails and all faiths have the right to worship, where women are equal, who are constantly attacked by cowards firing missiles indiscriminately at her citizens Christian, Jews and Muslims.... and yet so many see israel as the bad guy in all of this.

God Bless Israel
Not at all. It's a complex, multi-faceted problem. There's division within Israel itself. Per my last comment, the current issues stem from various political needs. The continued expansion of the settlements since 1967 create a situation that is very difficult to undo. Israel for many decades was not a wealthy nation and struggled economically to absorb incoming Jewish populations. Now that it might well be a position to promote an economically viable West Bank, Labor is out of power and the West Bank is riddled with the settlements.

There are two parts to the Kushner Peace plan - the economic proposals and the political segment. Israel's getting along pretty well these days with the surrounding nation states (with the notable exception of Iran). Some are willing to throw money at the West Bank. The Palestinians aren't fools. While politically, the leadership may not be able to say certain words "No Right of Return," the average Palestinian may well be content to live in an Israeli territory without citizenship in the next-door Israeli state. What would be preferable? Syria? Jordan doesn't want them for more Palestinians in Jordan upsets that political balance every bit as much as more non-Jews in Israel would upset its demographic balance.

BUT, a right-wing Israeli government continues to pour Jews into the West Bank. And the United States now cheers them on. Whatever the political portion of the Kushner Peace Plan may be - it's almost certainly a non-starter. With - per this thread - Netanyahu now chanting "annexation." THAT's the problem.
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Old 09-11-2019, 10:12 AM
 
334 posts, read 61,894 times
Reputation: 346
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave_n_Tenn View Post
My statement is true, measurable and provable... yours is make believe and science fiction.
Nope, it's just tables rotated, showing all the absurd of your reasoning.

When someone invades your home, you not gonna be happy, and would want to kick out the invader. Who is the bad guy in the situation? By your logic it's you. You should have thankfully gifted your home to the invader - according to your statement.
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Old 09-11-2019, 10:16 AM
Status: "Hard work is never easy" (set 7 days ago)
 
Location: Florida/Tennessee
3,152 posts, read 4,464,855 times
Reputation: 1841
The problem is hate. Always has been, always will be. It can not be defeated, or negotiated with, nor can you turn your back on hate. Hate is a powerful motivator and Golda Meir said it best... Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us.

This will not be solved by people.
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