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I don't have an employer. I pay for my own health care. And it's high because of those employers agreeing to be middlemen (in a long line of middlemen) for the State-corporation health care conglomerate.
Sorry but that made me lol. It's high because healthcare is expensive in America. The employers aren't to blame. And the healthcare industry is a private industry - the kind you like I thought. They can set their own rates for the most part and are a beast to deal with.
I work in supply chain and have handled medical benefits as a "category" of spend where I have to work with employers to find medical, dental, and vision coverage, amongst others for their employees. Due to me knowing a lot of the ins and outs of the healthcare industry from the insurance side (both medical and pharmacy insurance/benefits plans/managers) I'd honestly prefer a universal option because of the expense that these plans place on employers. They don't want to pay them for the most part as they take up a significant amount of the budget of organizations/corporations in America and for many private sector companies, this is actually a reason that many of them open up offices in foreign nations - they don't have to pay for healthcare plans for their employees due to those companies having universal/public sector health plans that most of the citizenry of those nations participate in.
What is the average cost of your plan and what does it cover? If it is a super high deductible plan it may be cheaper and for many people (especially young, healthy people) these plans are ideal. However, for people nearing or past 40-45 years old, the age when you start developing health issues, those plans' expenses add up and most Americans cannot afford to pay $10-$15k deductibles when they are in their 40s-mid 60s when Medicare comes into play. Many of those plans cover nothing at all and you end up paying the monthly premiums and everything else up to $15k for some of them and it either keeps people from going to the doctor or it will bankrupt people who are responsible enough to look after their health with visits or well checks. Oftentimes on this forum the folks who complain the most about insurance are people who claim they are "healthy" but then admit they have some "minor" issue and in the health insurance industry, issues people think are "minor" are not minor - they paint you as a risk and you will be charged up the wazoo for coverage because of that. Also as an independent insurance buyer, you are still part of a "group" policy and the health/risk factors of that group impact your premiums.
We could eliminate taxes I suppose and have no infrastructure to support industry that employs a lot of people, like power, roads, ports. And get rid of the useless fire department and police force and prison because, hey, there are no fires or crime. And get rid of the army and security services like the CIA because there are no bad guys in the world. And get rid of public education because nobody needs to be educated. And get rid of clean water and let everyone dig his own well. All these things cost money.
If you don't like these things, you can move to a third world country. They have low taxes and no infrastructure.
So again with the absurd extremes!
So it is either OVER TAXATION or NO TAXATION? Nothing in between? You Libs kill me. Nobody is calling for the total elimination of taxes or getting rid of essential government services. Get a life. You are clueless.
The amount of taxes we pay and the vast number of taxes are out of control, as is government. Reduce them. Again, nobody is calling for no taxation.
Federal Income Tax
State Income Tax
Local (County) Income Tax
Property and Real Estate Taxes
Personal Property Tax
Sales Tax
Gasoline Tax
Other energy Taxes
Utility Taxes
Tolls and Fees
Social Security
Medicare
If many add all these up they are paying 50% or more of their income in TAXES. That's indentured servitude.
Which is why I retired at 50 and moved to Florida. I added it all up a few years back when I was making a lot of money, and I was paying 70% of my gross income in taxes. I own a business, so I had to match my own SS. I also had to pay into Federal and State unemployment even though I was ineligible to ever collect unemployment!
You forgot:
tobacco taxes
alcohol taxes
airline taxes
hotel and lodging (VRBO) taxes
rental car taxes
auto tags
ad velorum taxes that some states have
embedded taxes that are built into everything we buy
For the average US household, taxes come in third at around 12% of the budget, after housing and transportation costs. As tax burdens go, among first world nations we have it pretty easy. But the rate is lower in Mexico, so maybe you'd like to move there?
I agree with this. And FWIW I actually wouldn't mind moving to Mexico and I probably would if I spoke Spanish lol.
We really do have a rather lenient tax burden here in the USA so it is kind of funny people who complain about it, especially since most of them probably don't even pay many taxes at all.
I agree with this. And FWIW I actually wouldn't mind moving to Mexico and I probably would if I spoke Spanish lol.
We really do have a rather lenient tax burden here in the USA so it is kind of funny people who complain about it, especially since most of them probably don't even pay many taxes at all.
Good point. Here are 15 countries that pay more taxes than we do and their citizens don`t whine about it. Most of them get healthcare while we get never ending wars.
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ottomobeale
What I pay + my employer pays for health insurance alone is more than all taxes, EASILY.
I dont buy it.
On the other hand, my medical cost is just $80/month premium, and $1,800 maximum out-of pocket. Then another $400 maximum for drugs. That amounts to at the most $3,160/year. My property tax alone is $7,700/year. The federal income tax we paid last year is over $30,000, and I guarantee we didn't spend that much on food and clothing. That's still not counting sales tax, gas tax, utility taxes.
At least in other high tax countries, they enjoy universal healthcare, paid parental leave, a much stronger social safety net, etc.
Seems like Americans pay just as much, but get very little back. I don't understand how Americans just roll over and accept this. People in many other countries protest and strike for less.
If I were part of the almost 1/2 of Americans who pay NO federal income tax, I wouldn't complain. If the people calling us tax complainers made $500,000 for just 1 year, they'd be screaming from the highest hills that they are getting ripped off!
When it happens to someone else, its easy to call them complainers, not so much when it hapens to YOU. But, you'll never know because those calling people like me complainers won't ever make $500,000/yr in their lifetimes.
I paid more in taxes than EVERY other cost COMBINED for quite a few years. My total tax load was 70% of gross income. AND, my company was paying for my employees social security. Try that one on and see how it fits.
I didn't "roll over and accept this" as ^ claims. After I was 100% debt free (by age 40), had enough saved so that I'll never need to work again (by 50 yrs old), I started winding down operations...laying people off, letting sub contractors go, reducing puchasing/investments in my company by 75%, and moved what was left to Florida so Georgia want getting 6% from me anymore either.
This hurt a lot of people unfortunately, and cost the IRS a lot of future tax reveues. Now, the company operates at 1/3rd capacity on autopilot. I still make good money, but make sure to keep it below the higher tax brackets. Nearly all my income goes into 401K for my wife and I, so the taxes are deferred. We live off of Dividends.
I have almost disappeared from the IRS's view. Heck, this year we'll even quality for Roth IRA's for the 1st time in many years because our income used to be too high. We're rolling 401k monies into Roth's too at a slow and steady rate to keep taxes down.
Now, I work 10 hrs/wk when I want. The amount of taxes I pay have been slashed by 75%, and those who worked for me making Six figures, no longer make that kind of money, so the IRS is seeing less from them too.
I couldn't be happier. My total tax load now is <30% when it was >70%.
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