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Old 05-02-2008, 10:07 PM
 
Location: Omaha Ne
70 posts, read 110,304 times
Reputation: 18

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Quote:
Originally Posted by decafdave View Post
out of burning coal and nuclear power, nuclear power is the lesser of the two evils. I assume you promote green power but its just not effective enough to power a nation the size of the U.S. So what do you want to do, regress society to the middle ages? all in the name of a clean earth?

Springing a leak? I think they use containment stong enough not to do this.
There are alternatives to storing waste underground. It is possible to shoot it to outer space. Instead of worrying about dumping our problems to earth we really shoot use space as giant trash can. We should shoot all of our waste in the direction of the sun. Hell, the entire Earth could fall into the sun without effecting it.

I don't blame you really, you're only the victim of anti-nuclear propaganda.

I know its off-topic, but instead of regressing the progress of humanity into less powerful green power and vastly reducing power consumption, we should turn to space. Obviously it would take a while to get started (and at great cost) but the solar system is filled with deposits of fuel useful to humanity

That's one reason I don't like the green movement. It's turning inward and cutting back instead of expanding outward. Too much money and scientists are spent for green purposes when all our environmental problems would be solved if we actually went into space.
I agree the ideal way to get rid of the nuclear waste is to throw it into the sun, I just have a problem with burying the waste in the ground. And the material that is most often used to contain radiation is lead. Last time I checked that's not real good either.

I just don't think the space option is necessary or practical. How could getting resources from outer space be more cost effective than what we have now or what we could do by switching to green power. Should we put windmills on Neptune where the wind blows 2000mph all the time and then run a extension cord?

What is wrong with reducing power consumption? And you are right if we do we will instantly transported back to the middle ages. Because there is no middle ground there at all. Why do people need SUV's that get 10mpg? People don't. Yet you see tons of them on the road. My point is that Americans use too much unnecessarily.
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Old 05-02-2008, 10:10 PM
 
Location: southern california
61,288 posts, read 87,391,501 times
Reputation: 55562
i'd rather pay texans and alaskans double than make our enemies rich.
(not to mention war cost, the real actual cost of mideastern oil = OPEC cost per barrel + cost of wars)
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Old 05-02-2008, 10:14 PM
 
Location: Omaha Ne
70 posts, read 110,304 times
Reputation: 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huckleberry3911948 View Post
i'd rather pay texans and alaskans double than make our enemies rich.
(not to mention war cost, the real actual cost of mideastern oil = OPEC cost per barrel + cost of wars)
We only get 20% of our oil from the Middle East. But I agree I don't want to give them a dime either.
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Old 05-02-2008, 10:14 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,100 posts, read 39,249,485 times
Reputation: 4937
Quote:
Originally Posted by timechilipot View Post
IWhy do people need SUV's that get 10mpg? People don't. Yet you see tons of them on the road.
The worst on the road is the Hummer. And, it gets more than 10mpg

Hummer H3 4WD 5 cyl, 3.7 L, Automatic 4-spd, Regular
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/***/photos/2008_Hummer_H3.jpg (broken link) [CENTER]12.2[/CENTER]
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/***/emissions/sm06b.gif (broken link)
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/***/emissions/sm07b.gif (broken link)
14
[SIZE=1]city[/SIZE]18
[SIZE=1]hwy[/SIZE][CENTER]$3512[/CENTER]


Hummer H3 4WD 5 cyl, 3.7 L, Manual 5-spd, Regular
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/***/photos/2008_Hummer_H3.jpg (broken link) [CENTER]12.2[/CENTER]
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/***/emissions/sm06b.gif (broken link)
13
[SIZE=1]city[/SIZE]18
[SIZE=1]hwy[/SIZE][CENTER]$3512[/CENTER]


Hummer H3 4WD 8 cyl, 5.3 L, Automatic 4-spd, Regular
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/***/photos/2008_Hummer_H3.jpg (broken link)

The Chev Surburban gets 14+ mpg

All SUVs get better than what you represent
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Old 05-02-2008, 10:25 PM
 
Location: Omaha Ne
70 posts, read 110,304 times
Reputation: 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greatday View Post
The worst on the road is the Hummer. And, it gets more than 10mpg

Hummer H3 4WD 5 cyl, 3.7 L, Automatic 4-spd, Regular
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/***/photos/2008_Hummer_H3.jpg (broken link) [CENTER]12.2[/CENTER]
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/***/emissions/sm06b.gif (broken link)
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/***/emissions/sm07b.gif (broken link)
14
[SIZE=1]city[/SIZE]18
[SIZE=1]hwy[/SIZE][CENTER]$3512[/CENTER]


Hummer H3 4WD 5 cyl, 3.7 L, Manual 5-spd, Regular
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/***/photos/2008_Hummer_H3.jpg (broken link) [CENTER]12.2[/CENTER]
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/***/emissions/sm06b.gif (broken link)
13
[SIZE=1]city[/SIZE]18
[SIZE=1]hwy[/SIZE][CENTER]$3512[/CENTER]


Hummer H3 4WD 8 cyl, 5.3 L, Automatic 4-spd, Regular
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/***/photos/2008_Hummer_H3.jpg (broken link)

The Chev Surburban gets 14+ mpg

All SUVs get better than what you represent
Ok I will reiterate then. Why do people need Hummers that get 14mpg? I also see those all over town, never being driven offroad which is what they were intended for. Another thing those govt stats are based on ideal conditions, you know like in a vacuum.
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Old 05-03-2008, 12:59 AM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,568 posts, read 16,228,825 times
Reputation: 1573
I think it was a bad idea to privatise the energy market, because some people will do anything to cut corners and make a bigger profit.
Now imagine this $$$$ grabbing mentality when it involves nuclear power plants.
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Old 05-03-2008, 05:15 AM
 
19,198 posts, read 31,467,877 times
Reputation: 4013
Quote:
Originally Posted by timechilipot View Post
I agree the ideal way to get rid of the nuclear waste is to throw it into the sun...
You may want to consider some cost factors...

The US, with a relatively small nuclear power industry, is currently sitting on better than 50,000 metric tons of nuclear waste. In its entire history (i.e., since 1981), the Space Shuttle program has carried about 700 metric tons worth of payload into orbit. Shooting material into the sun is much more expensive than merely putting it into orbit.

In its history, the Space Shuttle program has experienced two catastrophic accidents, wherein the vehicle and everything on it were destroyed in flight, resulting in material raining back onto the earth's surface in debris fields that were hundreds of miles long. What would the effects of having had say two metric tons of nuclear waste on board one of those particular vehicles have been?
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Old 05-03-2008, 05:28 AM
 
Location: Washington DC
5,922 posts, read 8,063,439 times
Reputation: 954
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista View Post
You may want to consider some cost factors...

The US, with a relatively small nuclear power industry, is currently sitting on better than 50,000 metric tons of nuclear waste. In its entire history (i.e., since 1981), the Space Shuttle program has carried about 700 metric tons worth of payload into orbit. Shooting material into the sun is much more expensive than merely putting it into orbit.

In its history, the Space Shuttle program has experienced two catastrophic accidents, wherein the vehicle and everything on it were destroyed in flight, resulting in material raining back onto the earth's surface in debris fields that were hundreds of miles long. What would the effects of having had say two metric tons of nuclear waste on board one of those particular vehicles have been?
Sending radioactive waste into space isn't a serious consideration for exactly the reasons stated about. Putting the waste out in NV is moving forward and will eventually happen. It really won't impact anybody's life. NV has their nose out of joint, but all it really takes is more money to the state and they will discover that their environmental concerns have been satisfied.
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Old 05-03-2008, 05:44 AM
 
19,198 posts, read 31,467,877 times
Reputation: 4013
Yucca Flats is how many miles from Las Vegas? How many government buildings where people were studying the seismic stability of the site have been damaged or destroyed by earthquakes? Yucca Flats is a bad place to put nuclear waste. There were better choices on the final list. But those better choices had more powerful representation in Congress than did the Nevada desert...
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Old 05-03-2008, 07:05 AM
 
Location: Washington DC
5,922 posts, read 8,063,439 times
Reputation: 954
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista View Post
Yucca Flats is how many miles from Las Vegas? How many government buildings where people were studying the seismic stability of the site have been damaged or destroyed by earthquakes? Yucca Flats is a bad place to put nuclear waste. There were better choices on the final list. But those better choices had more powerful representation in Congress than did the Nevada desert...
The seismology of that area of the country has been studied better than any other place on the face of the earth. The area is not particularly unstable and all of the potential seismic events that could happen have been analyzed. The hold up right now is -- drum roll, showing protection from the 10,000 to 1,000,000 years after the site has been abandoned. No unanswered safety questions exist for the first 10,000 years of the site's existence. To me as an engineer, with a substantial nuclear background, that sounds safe enough to proceed.
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