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This is an interesting thread. I would say that yes, I do think diversity is overrated. Our nation is a great testing ground for this experiment. I'm scared that people are NOT being encouraged to assimilate and the liberals are brainwashing people and teaching them to hate whitey as some sort of moral outrage.
I see the balkanization of our country as people refuse to assimilate, insisting on signage in their native languages. If the **** hits the fan and our economy heads south I foresee racial tension giving way to race riots.
This is an interesting thread. I would say that yes, I do think diversity is overrated. Our nation is a great testing ground for this experiment. I'm scared that people are NOT being encouraged to assimilate and the liberals are brainwashing people and teaching them to hate whitey as some sort of moral outrage.
I see the balkanization of our country as people refuse to assimilate, insisting on signage in their native languages. If the **** hits the fan and our economy heads south I foresee racial tension giving way to race riots.
One thing I am discovering as more and more ethnic groups flock to Los Angeles: English is the common language though it's often easier to learn Spanish (because Spanish is an easier language to learn). Chinese has almost no chance of becoming the common language as it's harder to learn than English.
By the way, I think it is conservatives, not the liberals, that are responsible for what we have now.
UB, It's the liberals brainwashing our young people in today's public schools with endless tirades about how Christopher Columbus deliberately killed indigenous people...how white people are responsible for all the evil in the world today...how blacks were all kings and queens back in their motherland living in peaceful, advanced civilizations...that all cultures are equal and that giving up your native tongue to learn English and become American is "selling out."
Baloney. You've been listening to Ann Coulter and Rush Limbaugh a little bit too much.
It's conservatives who come up with these stupid ideas and then try to blame it on the liberals. If the conservatives didn't invent these stories, their readership/listeners would decline down to nothing and they wouldn't be able to make their mortgage payments. They have to keep up the lies to keep the money flowing in.
Baloney. You've been listening to Ann Coulter and Rush Limbaugh a little bit too much.
It's conservatives who come up with these stupid ideas and then try to blame it on the liberals. If the conservatives didn't invent these stories, their readership/listeners would decline down to nothing and they wouldn't be able to make their mortgage payments. They have to keep up the lies to keep the money flowing in.
They must be made-up stories... I've been working in the educational field for years, and know nothing of these evil liberal plots! Spent 2 days working (outreach) at a public school just this week, and I didn't hear anyone chanting "Kill Whitey!", LOL. And this was a school that happens to be around 90% non-White, and in an extremely liberal city - so if anyone's following this doctrine, they would be among them.
To; TravelingDude. For some reason my computer will not let me cut and past so sorry about that but I must say, -El Paso Texas was NEVER anywhere NEAR 30% black!! Other wise what you say about places not staying diverse is often true, but you are overgeneralizing. San Francisco has been diverse for a long time, and I would have to say it is a lot less segregated than New York.
To TNlove. Only a little over half of immigrants to the U.S. in recent decades, legal and illegal, have been from Latin America, -not all of them "Hispanic". More then 40% of U.S. born "Hispanics" speak ONLY English, and almost 90% are fluent in English, as are more than a third of foreign born Latinos. The reason they are less likely than other immigrants to learn English is for three reasons. #1 More than half are illegal. Illegal "immigrants" mostly do not have the OPORTUNATY to become fluent in English, though they often still need to speak it some at work.
#2 Low socioeconomic status. Poorer and less educated immigrants of ANY group, not just "Hispanics" are a lot slower to learn English then their middle class counterparts.
#3 The formation of ethnic enclaves, which makes use of English less necessary, or often not at all. Spanish is by far the largest "foreign" language in the U.S., so that makes sense.
Contrary to popular belief, most European immigrants in the early 20th century did NOT become fluent in English in the first generation, but their children did. The same is true for "Hispanics" today.
The difference today is both that our immigration laws are now a lot more restrictive in terms of who qualifies (aside from anti-Asian legislation in the past), in that most illegal immigrants today would NOT qualify for legal entry, and also our whole economy and position in the world are quite different now, plus the politics of "multiculturalism" are now in play.
By the way, we have always had multiculturalism in the U.S., which is fine, -we have always been a cultural tapestry, and have been far from uniform. But at the same time most people here shared much of the same culture in common.
But the politics of multiculturalism is another story.
In the past, compared to today, assimilation over time (usually NOT in the first generation, however) was much more more expected than now. Acculturation is still very much the norm, but actual assimilation is not, though it is still widespread.
Most U.S. born Asians AND (yes) Hispanics are actually a lot closer to the Anglo majority in terms of cultural practises and beliefs than they are to those of their ancestral homeland. However, because of both their own choosing (and sometimes racism against whites) and becuase of racism and lack of acceptance from the majority (which the politics of "multiculturalism" often makes worse, by being anti assimilation) actual assimilation (intermarriage, single U.S. loyalty etc.) is not the norm, though it is still VARY common. It IS a lot harder for things to work out when most immigrants are not white and don't look like us, -becuase unfortunately, humans (not just "whites") have a strong tendency towards bigotry.
Last edited by bigtallredhead; 05-12-2007 at 04:23 PM..
I also think that immigration from MEXICO (not Latin America as a whole) is unique becuase of the strong historically based antagonism between the U.S.A. and Mexico, related in large part to the theft of a large part of Mexico's land base in the U.S./Mexico war, and just the fact that we are neighbors who are different in culture. Sure the U.S. "bought" the land, -after a military invasion. Not like Mexico had much choice in the mater.
Also the U.S. DID NOT fulfill its obligations under the treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, -as the existing Mexican landowners in the U.S. southwest DID NOT have there property right respected, and instead lost most of their land to "Anglo" squatters. Most people in Mexico are at least part, and often fully "Indian", and many of their families historically migrated across what is now the U.S. Mexico border on a regular bases. Most of the indigenous people of what is now Mexico were NOT Aztec, and some tribes lived on both sides of what is now the border, so their "mestizo" descendants see it as their land.
Unfortunately for the U.S., the majority in Mexico (57 % according to a Pew Hispanic center poll) truly do not see the U.S. as having any rights as a sovereign country, nor respect our borders. Opinions are a LOT more mixed, however, when it come to Mexican Americans, who are on the whole a cultural hybrid. I am afraid that this disagreement may well eventually lead to both civil war in the U.S. and armed civilian conflict between the U.S. and Mexico, -which would end up destroying the economy and government of both countries.
The first big wave of Mexican immigrants to the U.S. at least two million purple, began in 1910 with the revolution in Mexico and ended with the beginning of the great depression.
During the 1930s about one out forth of the Mexican population in the U.S. was deported, -including many U.S. citizens targeted solely becuase of there ethnic background and becuase they were not "white".
Until the 1980 census almost all Hispanics were classified as white and there was no "Hispanic" category in the census. Mexicans were identified (only those of immigrant stock, however) in the 1930 and 1940 censuses, and "Spanish language or surname" people were identified in 1970 in a one out of five sample, which had serious problems of accuracy, -both under and over counting "Hispanics" in different parts of the country.
To; TravelingDude. For some reason my computer will not let me cut and past so sorry about that but I must say, -El Paso Texas was NEVER anywhere NEAR 30% black!! Other wise what you say about places not staying diverse is often true, but you are overgeneralizing. San Francisco has been diverse for a long time, and I would have to say it is a lot less segregated than New York.
I would have to agree with you, as somebody who's lived in San Francisco (and surrounding area) for most of my life. This city was basically founded on diversity, since the first permanent settlers were a wide variety of races - including a huge number of Asian immigrants, who came to assist with the railroad, boat docks and gold-rush. I'm no historian, but I'm sure you all know stories about that! Anyway, it's true that we are less segregated than most big cities, which could explain my slightly jaded view on this issue... sure, there are neighborhoods that are mostly one race, but they "blend" just fine with nearby towns & neighbors. It's extremely rare to hear of "race wars" or even hate crimes around here, which is a great thing in my opinion - and hopefully other cities will eventually catch up with us.
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They must be made-up stories... I've been working in the educational field for years, and know nothing of these evil liberal plots! Spent 2 days working (outreach) at a public school just this week, and I didn't hear anyone chanting "Kill Whitey!", LOL. And this was a school that happens to be around 90% non-White, and in an extremely liberal city - so if anyone's following this doctrine, they would be among them. 
This city was basically founded on diversity, since the first permanent settlers were a wide variety of races - including a huge number of Asian immigrants, who came to assist with the railroad, boat docks and gold-rush. I'm no historian, but I'm sure you all know stories about that! Anyway, it's true that we are less segregated than most big cities, which could explain my slightly jaded view on this issue... sure, there are neighborhoods that are mostly one race, but they "blend" just fine with nearby towns & neighbors. It's extremely rare to hear of "race wars" or even hate crimes around here, which is a great thing in my opinion - and hopefully other cities will eventually catch up with us. 
