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Old 04-02-2022, 09:35 AM
 
Location: Southeast US
8,609 posts, read 2,307,737 times
Reputation: 2114

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atsushi View Post
As usual, this came in my twitter feed:

https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-...bill-rcna22570


While some of you have a problem with the source, it really doesn't matter because the subject is an easily verifiable thing:

https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-...ouse-bill/6833

I personally can't think of any good reason to oppose this, but why did majority of GOP vote No on this?
"30 million Americans who live with diabetes. Insulin, a lifesaving drug that is typically taken daily, has grown increasingly expensive in recent years, and many diabetes patients ration their medicines or discontinue them because of the cost. About one in five Americans who take insulin would save money under the proposal, according to a recent analysis from the Kaiser Family Foundation."

So, about 1 in 10 Americans "live with diabetes" (not sure if they all take insulin or not).
And 1 in 5 of the 1 in 10 - so 2% - would save money.

Do you think maybe the other 4 out of 5 will now be paying more money?

I mean, when you fix a price, you fix a price. Everybody pays it. Yes?

And, since I've paid little attention to the issue ... how was $35 arrived at as the magic figure?
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Old 04-02-2022, 10:28 AM
 
Location: Southeast US
8,609 posts, read 2,307,737 times
Reputation: 2114
Quote:
Originally Posted by sholomar View Post
There's been more and more price gouging and collusion by corporations these days despite laws against collusion. After doing 10 minutes of research I can't see a reason to oppose this bill either.

https://www.vox.com/2019/4/3/1829395...n-so-expensive

https://www.businessinsider.com/insu...ndustry-2019-1

The person who discovered insulin never even wanted to profit off it. It looks like it's so expensive for the same reason baby formula is... baby formula gets subsidized by government welfare, and insulin gets subsidized by insurance companies covering the costs, and a person with diabetes can't just go without it... it's a must have. The makers of insulin have been conveniently raising the prices are nearly the same rate, far above the rate of inflation. I would support this legislation. The free market doesn't always work smoothly as theorized by some.

I suppose more makers of insulin could begin production to compete, but I'd expect there's hurdles of bureaucracy and red tape to get through for that to even happen. Admittedly my 10 minutes of research probably isn't enough to go and wave my flag in staunch support assuming i know everything about the situation though. Still there's obvious price fixing going on.

https://www.t1international.com/blog...-so-expensive/
from the Vox article:

...“Older insulins have been successively replaced with newer, incrementally improved products covered by numerous additional patents.” The result is that more than 90 percent of privately insured patients with Type 2 diabetes in America are prescribed the latest and costliest versions of insulin.

... For Type 1 diabetes, newer formulations appear to be more effective at controlling blood sugar than older formulations. “For Type 2 diabetes, it’s less clear — the benefits are not as strong.”

So, Lipska asked, “Are [the new insulins] 20 times better? I’m not sure.”

...
“The list price of these products are already out of reach for most Americans living with diabetes — in some cases, over $300 a vial,” he said. “It is also strange to see Humulin still priced at over $150 a vial considering this product was first sold in the US in 1982.”

Instead of just using the angle of "pharmacy company price-gouging" - which is supply-side, we should also be looking at the demand side.

What's the justification for 90% of patients using the newer, much more costly, but often not "better" insulin? It's demand. Whether that be from Docs who just fall into the habit of prescribing the latest or the patient finding out about it and essentially "demanding" the Doc prescribe them the latest and greatest ... there's a disconnect.


Clearly, for those patients who see significant benefit from newer, patent-protected formulations - especially for whom it's effective in regulating their needs where "old insulin" wasn't - they need to be prescribed it. But is that # 20% of patients, and how many of those are insured?
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Old 04-02-2022, 10:33 AM
 
Location: Free State of Florida
25,729 posts, read 12,800,389 times
Reputation: 19290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taggerung View Post
Price controls do not work. They always lead to shortages. When will these foolish government parasites ever learn?
Nailed it! The only question is, how long until the shortages occur, & how will they be remedied?
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Old 04-02-2022, 10:46 AM
 
9,877 posts, read 7,207,036 times
Reputation: 11467
Quote:
Originally Posted by Take a History Class View Post
Or rather than taking insulin, people could just follow this doctor's advice.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=da1vvigy5tQ


Big pharma is often not your friend. If Covid didn't show people that, I don't know what will.
Except those with Type 1 don't have a choice to simply lose weight, change their diet, exercise more. It's an incurable disease for them.
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Old 04-02-2022, 12:17 PM
 
Location: Port Charlotte, FL - Dallas, PA
5,172 posts, read 4,942,570 times
Reputation: 5086
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eyebee Teepee View Post
....
I mean, when you fix a price, you fix a price. Everybody pays it. Yes?
The correct answer is, "NO". The price would only be fixed for people with health insurance. If you don't have health insurance you pay full price.
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Old 04-02-2022, 12:23 PM
 
Location: Edmonds, WA
8,975 posts, read 10,208,043 times
Reputation: 14252
Wow. Lots of wannabe pharma bros on this thread
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Old 04-02-2022, 12:39 PM
 
Location: West Coast U.S.A.
2,911 posts, read 1,359,119 times
Reputation: 3979
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluefox View Post
Wow. Lots of wannabe pharma bros on this thread
More like, lots of willing dupes on this thread defending their rights to be ripped off by pharma bros.

Last edited by Angry-Koala; 04-02-2022 at 01:24 PM..
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Old 04-02-2022, 05:25 PM
 
46,276 posts, read 27,088,282 times
Reputation: 11126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Take a History Class View Post
Or rather than taking insulin, people could just follow this doctor's advice.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=da1vvigy5tQ


Big pharma is often not your friend. If Covid didn't show people that, I don't know what will.

What about type 1?

Someone needs a history class.
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Old 04-04-2022, 08:09 AM
 
6,393 posts, read 4,113,787 times
Reputation: 8252
Quote:
Originally Posted by chucksnee View Post
What about type 1?

Someone needs a history class.
All conservatives hate science. This is why they don't understand the difference between type 1 and type 2 diabetes.
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Old 04-04-2022, 08:19 AM
 
26,694 posts, read 14,561,042 times
Reputation: 8094
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikMal View Post
Not sure I agree with this. I don't think that the government has a place in setting prices for products. As they say, the devil is in the details. This only applies to insured individuals. If you're unable to afford insurance, you're still stuck paying full cost.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ider-bill.html
"The bill would not help the uninsured".
Price is like gravity. You can't pass a law to ban or modify gravity or price.

If the government forces everybody at gunpoint to accept a price of their choosing, the real price will manifest itself in other forms, such as in this case, more dead patients or availability of the medicine.

But this is a minor point. The real point is that us peons must do what the masters tell us to do.
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