Russia threatens military response to US (Bush, Iran, Iraq, middle east)

[Yeledaf]

Maybe it's payback for the missiles in Cuba in 1962.

Let's see if Vlad has a pair.

[rbryant]

Originally Posted by StoneOne

While I think it's utterly stupid that we're spending money on missile defense in Europe, this is nothing to be worried about for the simple reason that Russia has too much to lose from overreacting. As the post above states, the worst they'll do is move some missiles into Belarus and do a few fly-by incursions into Polish airspace. I doubt it will even come to that.

Russia's economy is simply growing too rapidly and there's just too much to be lost by a senseless confrontation. They have their pride, but they're not stupid.

I think you make a good point, the Russian economy is doing well right now. The Russians are selling plenty of oil and gas to Europe, no sense in ending the good times now. I worry, however, about Russia's perception that they are being encircled by NATO/US interests. I think it behooves us not to make the Russians any more nervous or paranoid about foreign invasion. Also, let's keep in mind that Russia still has plenty of ICBMs and a launch on warning policy. I'm not trying to infer that this whole thing will escalate into a nuclear strike by either side, but wars have started on suspicions,fears and paranoia.

[StoneOne]

Originally Posted by rbryant

I think you make a good point, the Russian economy is doing well right now. The Russians are selling plenty of oil and gas to Europe, no sense in ending the good times now. I worry, however, about Russia's perception that they are being encircled by NATO/US interests. I think it behooves us not to make the Russians any more nervous or paranoid about foreign invasion. Also, let's keep in mind that Russia still has plenty of ICBMs and a launch on warning policy. I'm not trying to infer that this whole thing will escalate into a nuclear strike by either side, but wars have started on suspicions,fears and paranoia.

Agree completely. This is just stupid on the part of the U.S., for a number of reasons.

1) It's a waste of money.
2) It's not clear who the threat is (Iran is a joke, the vague concept of terrorism just doesn't cut it)
3) It's not clear why existing facilities in Germany wouldn't work.
4) It upsets the Russians, who, aside from offering stable oil and gas supplies (they're actively building pipelines around problem countries like Belarus and Ukraine that are known for stealing oil and gas and disrupting transport), could be very good partners in real anti-terrorism programs.

[rbryant]

Originally Posted by StoneOne

Agree completely. This is just stupid on the part of the U.S., for a number of reasons.

1) It's a waste of money.
2) It's not clear who the threat is (Iran is a joke, the vague concept of terrorism just doesn't cut it)
3) It's not clear why existing facilities in Germany wouldn't work.
4) It upsets the Russians, who, aside from offering stable oil and gas supplies (they're actively building pipelines around problem countries like Belarus and Ukraine that are known for stealing oil and gas and disrupting transport), could be very good partners in real anti-terrorism programs.

The idea that this is a defensive measure against a potential Iranian strike is a farce. Besides, Russia offered the US a partnership that would entail using old bases in its former Southern Asian regions (Uzbekistan,Kazahakstan).
Although I'm a Conservative, this is more of a reason to dislike the Neo-Cons in Washington. I think that pursuing a policy of reshaping the geopolitical boundaries in Europe and Middle east is pretty reckless and stupid. If Washington and NATO think that Moscow will be intimated by American shock and awe military strikes, they will be in for a rude awakening. Finally, I think the American policy to Russia is akin to poking a 1,000 pound Grizzly bear with a stick..eventually something is going to happen.

[Habsburg]

Originally Posted by rbryant

The idea that this is a defensive measure against a potential Iranian strike is a farce. Besides, Russia offered the US a partnership that would entail using old bases in its former Southern Asian regions (Uzbekistan,Kazahakstan).
Although I'm a Conservative, this is more of a reason to dislike the Neo-Cons in Washington. I think that pursuing a policy of reshaping the geopolitical boundaries in Europe and Middle east is pretty reckless and stupid. If Washington and NATO think that Moscow will be intimated by American shock and awe military strikes, they will be in for a rude awakening. Finally, I think the American policy to Russia is akin to poking a 1,000 pound Grizzly bear with a stick..eventually something is going to happen.

Admiral Yamamoto says hi.

[bily4]

Kind of like Saddam was "penis waving" to Iran when he played coy about WMDs.

Bet he would like to have kept it in his pants that time, if he had a mullkigan.

[rbryant]

Originally Posted by Habsburg

Admiral Yamamoto says hi.

So, in other words, you have no problem with pursing a Cold War type of relationship with a country that has several hundred ICBM's and a similar amount of SLBM's? I'm not saying we lay down for Russia and play appeasers, but let's not create an enemy here. I hope all you hardcore Neo-Cons have stocked up the ole' fallout shelter.

[Huckleberry3911948]

Originally Posted by yayoi

Why must we go out and try to "protect" everyone? Let Europe take care of itself.

not entirely crazy concept. bad guys tend to be more bold when there is not somebody standing over them. the trick is to maintain presence without breaking the bank.
israel does a good job of this.
poised surgical defense behavior.
another example - when you leave malaysian pirates alone they don't get better.

[Habsburg]

Originally Posted by rbryant

So, in other words, you have no problem with pursing a Cold War type of relationship with a country that has several hundred ICBM's and a similar amount of SLBM's? I'm not saying we lay down for Russia and play appeasers, but let's not create an enemy here. I hope all you hardcore Neo-Cons have stocked up the ole' fallout shelter.

Ummm I'm pretty sure we're saying the same thing. Last time I checked the Japanese regretted opening the Pacific theater. Kind of like how we would regret re-doing the Cold War with these new missile bays.

[tinman01]

Originally Posted by StoneOne

Agree completely. This is just stupid on the part of the U.S., for a number of reasons.

1) It's a waste of money.
2) It's not clear who the threat is (Iran is a joke, the vague concept of terrorism just doesn't cut it)
3) It's not clear why existing facilities in Germany wouldn't work.
4) It upsets the Russians, who, aside from offering stable oil and gas supplies (they're actively building pipelines around problem countries like Belarus and Ukraine that are known for stealing oil and gas and disrupting transport), could be very good partners in real anti-terrorism programs.

I can go with #1 partially #2 .
#3 Germany has proven to be less than reliable over the last 20 years. Not to mention they have been part of the problem. Oil for food scam???
The sale of banned weapons and technology to known terrorists etc.
Russia as a partner? We had a partnership with them in WWII. Our planes if damaged could use their air fields. They stole the planes.
WE buy their nukes and they destroy them. They have lost more a bunch of nukes. Or sold them. Part of that deal was to not help certain nations develope nues of their own. Hmmmmmm