Iran Really DOES Have A Case For Nukes (legal, suspected, independence)

[Mircea]

Originally Posted by rb4browns

Ridiculous to anyone who does not dwell in sophmoric political psychobabble. The Arab residents of Palestine adopted their identity as "Palestinians" only in response to Zionism and the state of Israel. You don't get to retroactively say it was "their" land when that "their" did not even exist, no matter how you want to spin it. Arabs in that region historically identified themselves by family/clan first and foremost. Some may have aspired to see themselves as "Ottoman citizens" but nobody thought of themselves as "Palestinians" the way the term is understood today.

That's a fallacy called "equivocation." You're equivocating "Arabs" with Arabs.

Arabs are an ethnic group presently organized as tribes and clans who originated on the Arabian Peninsula.

"Arabs" is also a term used to describe all speakers of the Arabic language. Thus, a Tunisian is referred to as an Arab, even though Tunisians are not necessarily descended or related to ethnic Arabs. The same is true for Egypt, where people speak Arabic, but are not Arabs, since the vast majority are descended of Turkic tribes, specifically Circassian Turks and other Turkic or Turco-Mongolian groups from the region north of the Black Sea. For that reason it's almost impossible to distinguish between an Egyptian and a Turkish national, since both are descended of Turkic/Turco-Mongol groups, and have nearly identical physiological features. Ethnic Turks and ethnic Arabs have readily distinguishable facial features.

The fact that Palestinians speak Arabic doesn't make them ethic Arabs any more than the fact that Ottoman Turkish groups spoke Arabic until the Turkish alphabet and language were re-introduced in 1917 made them ethnic Arabs.

[Yeledaf]

Originally Posted by Mircea

That's a fallacy called "equivocation." You're equivocating "Arabs" with Arabs.

Arabs are an ethnic group presently organized as tribes and clans who originated on the Arabian Peninsula.

"Arabs" is also a term used to describe all speakers of the Arabic language. Thus, a Tunisian is referred to as an Arab, even though Tunisians are not necessarily descended or related to ethnic Arabs. The same is true for Egypt, where people speak Arabic, but are not Arabs, since the vast majority are descended of Turkic tribes, specifically Circassian Turks and other Turkic or Turco-Mongolian groups from the region north of the Black Sea. For that reason it's almost impossible to distinguish between an Egyptian and a Turkish national, since both are descended of Turkic/Turco-Mongol groups, and have nearly identical physiological features. Ethnic Turks and ethnic Arabs have readily distinguishable facial features.

The fact that Palestinians speak Arabic doesn't make them ethic Arabs any more than the fact that Ottoman Turkish groups spoke Arabic until the Turkish alphabet and language were re-introduced in 1917 made them ethnic Arabs.

Speaking of equivocation -- what, then, are Palestinians if not Arabs (or "Arabs" )?

Venusians?

Here's one Arab's viewpoint....

An unconventional Arab viewpoint

[rb4browns]

Originally Posted by Mircea

Palestinians are the same as Philistines. Etymologically Philistine --> Filistine --> Falistine --> Palistine --> Palastine --> Palestine

Nationalism was not a concept in Europe or elsewhere until the 17th Century. Consequently, in the Ottoman Empire, everyone was an Ottoman. There was no such thing as Romanian-Ottoman, Greek-Ottoman, Bugarian-Ottoman, Serbian-Ottoman, Albanian-Ottoman, Iraqi-Ottoman, Syrian-Ottoman, Egyptian-Ottoman and so on.

Nationalistic sentiments did not develop until the 18th Century in the Ottoman Empire.

Indeed it did not, thus the falacy that a "Palestinian People" existed as a nation in the way which we understand it today. Your "Etymology" is interesting except that it is false. But facts don't seem to be real important here.

Originally Posted by Mircea

Um, except the Hebrew word Pelesheth, "the land of the Philistines," recorded in the Pentateuch before the existence of the first Hebrew, Abrahm (aka Abraham) disproves that.

Um, no it does not. The Romans chose the name as a direct dig and insult to the defeated Jews by renaming the Judea/Samaria region to "Syria Palestina." Where did they get that name? From the Aegian people commonly understoon as the Philistines from the Bible.

Originally Posted by Mircea

Again, the history of the Hebrews disproves that. Perhaps you aren't familiar with the story of David slaying a Palestinian named Goliath.

Again, no it does not. Perhaps you aren't familiar with history beyond your silly assertions.

[rb4browns]

Originally Posted by Mircea

That's a fallacy called "equivocation." You're equivocating "Arabs" with Arabs.

Arabs are an ethnic group presently organized as tribes and clans who originated on the Arabian Peninsula.

"Arabs" is also a term used to describe all speakers of the Arabic language. Thus, a Tunisian is referred to as an Arab, even though Tunisians are not necessarily descended or related to ethnic Arabs. The same is true for Egypt, where people speak Arabic, but are not Arabs, since the vast majority are descended of Turkic tribes, specifically Circassian Turks and other Turkic or Turco-Mongolian groups from the region north of the Black Sea. For that reason it's almost impossible to distinguish between an Egyptian and a Turkish national, since both are descended of Turkic/Turco-Mongol groups, and have nearly identical physiological features. Ethnic Turks and ethnic Arabs have readily distinguishable facial features.

The fact that Palestinians speak Arabic doesn't make them ethic Arabs any more than the fact that Ottoman Turkish groups spoke Arabic until the Turkish alphabet and language were re-introduced in 1917 made them ethnic Arabs.

LOL, tell that one to the Arab League. Clearly you know more about them than do they about themselves.

[norcalmom101]

Originally Posted by rb4browns

I'm Jewish, from California, support Israel, and at least I can spell the words "Israel" and "Israeli" correctly.

Great. Then you can probably spell Zionist Scum too.

[rb4browns]

Originally Posted by norcalmom101

Great. Then you can probably spell Zionist Scum too.

I think you and I have probably met before, I was the kid on Sproul Plaza at Cal waving my Israeli flag while laughing at you with your "Women In Black/Code Pink" gals. You were the one with the mustache.

[norcalmom101]

Originally Posted by rb4browns

I think you and I have probably met before, I was the kid on Sproul Plaza at Cal waving my Israeli flag while laughing at you with your "Women In Black/Code Pink" gals. You were the one with the mustache.

Sorry, I don't fraternize with Zionists, ever.

[tinman01]

Some tend to mistake Israeli citizens for their government just as many in the world assume all US Citizens agree with everything our Gov does.
The Israeli's that I met earned my respect for the most part. I do not agree with their gov however.
They have hardliners just like we do. The old our way or the highway. You either agree completely or you are a bad citizen.
Iran is much the same. Not all citizen like or agree with their govs hardliners.

[rb4browns]

Originally Posted by norcalmom101

Sorry, I don't fraternize with Zionists, ever.

Apology accepted.

[rb4browns]

Originally Posted by tinman01

Some tend to mistake Israeli citizens for their government just as many in the world assume all US Citizens agree with everything our Gov does.
The Israeli's that I met earned my respect for the most part. I do not agree with their gov however.
They have hardliners just like we do. The old our way or the highway. You either agree completely or you are a bad citizen.
Iran is much the same. Not all citizen like or agree with their govs hardliners.

There is a very big difference between disagreeing with a given country's governmental policies and disagreeing with the existence of a country, as many of the as*clowns here seem to believe.

I don't sit here trying to say Iran has no right to exist, but they do not have a right to advocate for the destruction of another country. Again, the as*clown brigade can try and pretend that Ahmandinajad really wants friendship and brotherhood with the Jews of Israel, but those of us living in reality know he does not. When Iran stops threatening its neighbors with annihalation, stops funding and arming terrorist groups such as Hizballah and recognizes the rights of all its neighbros to live in peace and security then come back and talk to me about needing nukes.