Iran Really DOES Have A Case For Nukes (enemies, terrorists, carry)

[Noahma]

Originally Posted by Mircea

There's no evidence Iran has a nuclear weapons program.



Iran hasn't threatened anyone.



And the US doesn't fund terrorism? It seems the US believes that Iran's funding of international terrorism is just peachy and the US even gives money to Iran to fund their terrorism by buying weapons from Iran for the Contras and others.



Oh, I'm sorry, didn't you read the Senate Intelligence Committee and the House Select Subcommittee to Investigate the United States Role in Iranian Arms Transfers to Croatia and Bosnia?




Wow, $500 Million to $800 Million in US tax payer money to the Iranian "terrorist funding government" for weapons.

And oh yes, the neo-conservative Tony Lake is one of Obama's chief foreign policy advisors and will probably be in the White House if Obama wins.

I wonder what undeclared wars and illegal military actions Obama will be taking?


Only because the US wants to do it first.



It was the neo-conservatives Gary Sick and Zbigniew Brzezinski who screwed up Iran in the first place. If they had listed to Haig and Sullivan, Iran would still be an ally.

Unless Iran develops ICBMs or SLBMs, your fantasy will never happen.



No it doesn't. I'll be happy to war game you. I'll even play Iran.

Iran Threatens To Destroy Israel and 32 U.S. Military Bases In Middle East : Homeland Security National Terror Alert - Homeland Security News



Obama Takes Heat on Pakistan - The Caucus - Politics - New York Times Blog

"During a major foreign policy speech on Wednesday Senator Barack Obama promised that as president he would consider military strikes against terrorists in Pakistan if the country refused to root them out. Those comments drew a sharp response from Pakistani officials as well as the Bush administration today."

[tinman01]

Originally Posted by rb4browns

To say that any religious or ethnic group has "undue" influence is racist. Sorry buddy, your words not mine.

With regards to the Liberty, the Wikipedia page actually has a fairly balanced presentation of viewpoints. I'll let the gentle readers of our little exchange make up their own minds on it.

Was the author of Wikipedia there? The Captain of the Liberty was. His book describes in detail what really happened. Attack on Liberty.
How is saying that anyone has undue influence racist?? Israeli false flag attack on USS Liberty
I guess someone who never served might confuse the USS Liberty for a freighter. All those antenae and such would mean little. But what about the hull number?
Janes fighting ships and auxileries list all major combatants as well as auxileries. Ships all over the med heard the distress calls. And of course that big old flag flying which Israeli helo pilots saw after they checked out the damage. I was a sailor. No US war ship sails without the flag.

[tinman01]

Originally Posted by rb4browns

The technological advancements pioneered and perfected by the IDF has indeed saved countless American lives. And in the context of a $1.2+ Trillion dollar budget, the idea that Israel's aid has taken away from the American war effort is a concept only an imbecile would entertain.

WOW you argue that the billons we have given them would not be better spent on our own troops???????????????
Screw that. Our guys are dieing not theirs.
I have been to gaza and the west bank and in the field with the IDF have you? Have you had to dodge bullets? I have.
For any secrets they have shared with us we have bought and paid for many times over. For the secrets they have stolen from us and sold often to those we call enemy alone we should abandon them.
Israel our ally indeed. Akula class attack submarine in no small part is a direct result of Israels theft and sale of secrets to the former USSR.

[saganista]

Originally Posted by rb4browns

Funny how both sides think the NY Times is on the other's side. Americans share a closer cultural, religious and political affinity with Israelis then they do with the Palestinians. That's probably my guess when it comes to the NY Times choosing whose death to report on. Or maybe it's just because the Jews control the media.

I used the NY Times as a representative of a US media that for whatever reasons has provided for decades a woefully one-sided view of the conflict...this in response to a claim that no one was trying to paint the Israelis as goody-goodies. Despite all the missiles and suicide bombings that we in the US can expect to hear about in considerable detail, the background kill-ratios actually favor Israel by factors of four and five to one. These ratios rise any time the conflict happens to "heat up". If one were to consider only the deaths of children, the ratios are considerably higher. The ratio of property destroyed is all but off the charts. This has indeed been a very one-sided confrontation, and the Palestinians et al have consistently been given the worst of it, often enough as the result of Israeli policies and operations that would have been well enough described by the word "brutal' in their design and implementation. Simply put, those who would like to see an end to this conflict have had few enough friends on either side, and far too few on the Israeli side.

The current administration essentially walked away from this situation with its leash-cutting "do what you have to do" policy shortly after taking office. Given any circumstances at all, this would have been an example of poor policy. Given the ones in actual existence at the time, this was a long way beyond poor. The next administration will have its work cut out for it. Our ability at all to represent ourselves as an honest broker has been all but destroyed. It will be some time before we can again claim any credibility or assert any meaningful influence in these matters. More lives will be lost as the result.

[saganista]

Just as a rhetorical question to those who would harp and then harp again upon widely published reports of Ahmadinejad's having called for Israel to be wiped off the map, what was your reaction to our own ultimately successful effort to wipe the USSR off the map?

[Noahma]

Originally Posted by saganista

Just as a rhetorical question to those who would harp and then harp again upon widely published reports of Ahmadinejad's having called for Israel to be wiped off the map, what was your reaction to our own ultimately successful effort to wipe the USSR off the map?

we did not physically wipe an entire country off the map. They failed economically, what Ahmadinejad is calling for is a physical destruction of Israel, pretty big difference if you ask me.

he did not only call to wipe them off the map, but to push them into the sea, to bring the sky to fire, ohh what else was in his many threats...

[NewToCA]

Originally Posted by Noahma

we did not physically wipe an entire country off the map. They failed economically, what Ahmadinejad is calling for is a physical destruction of Israel, pretty big difference if you ask me.

he did not only call to wipe them off the map, but to push them into the sea, to bring the sky to fire, ohh what else was in his many threats...

I agree, I don't see the comparison at all with the USSR, unless you want to compare Ahmadinejad's speeches with Khrushchev's "we will bury you" comment in the early 1960's.

[Fishy]

Originally Posted by Noahma

Iran Threatens To Destroy Israel and 32 U.S. Military Bases In Middle East : Homeland Security National Terror Alert - Homeland Security News

theyre responding to a THREAT of being bombed. what the hell do you expect?

[Rathagos]

Originally Posted by Fishy

theyre responding to a THREAT of being bombed. what the hell do you expect?

For the Iranians to shut the h*** up and realize their pitiful lot in the world currently. That's what we expect. A buzzing fly will get swat eventually. They live solely on the grace of those with the swatter. Period.

If they think a nuc will change their status... let them try. We'll see what is left of the great Persian empire 15 minutes after a launch is detected.

[rb4browns]

Originally Posted by tinman01

Was the author of Wikipedia there? The Captain of the Liberty was. His book describes in detail what really happened. Attack on Liberty.
How is saying that anyone has undue influence racist?? Israeli false flag attack on USS Liberty
I guess someone who never served might confuse the USS Liberty for a freighter. All those antenae and such would mean little. But what about the hull number?
Janes fighting ships and auxileries list all major combatants as well as auxileries. Ships all over the med heard the distress calls. And of course that big old flag flying which Israeli helo pilots saw after they checked out the damage. I was a sailor. No US war ship sails without the flag.

The Captain of the Liberty had no access to the communications between the Israeli planes and their commanders. How would he know what the Israelis saw or thought they saw? AMerican transcripts of the actual conversations of the Israeli pilots picked up by our spies detail how the pilots were confused as to who they attacked. But hey, lots more fun to believe it's all a Jewish/Zionist conspiracy.

The Liberty was not a war ship btw, it was a spy ship.

And if the Israelis were immune to the fog of war which afflicts every other fighting force, was the Israeli aerial attack on one of its own infantry columns part of the conspiracy too?

Damn I wish I was wearing the same tin foil hat as you. I think the black UN helicopters are reading my brain waves now.