Iran Really DOES Have A Case For Nukes ( rant , Hugo Chavez, Iraq)

[tinman01]

Originally Posted by Yeledaf

LOL. Yeah, Israel's "neighbors" have never attacked her or threatened her existence on a daily basis or housed terrorist murderers in squalid camps. You need to read a little history. Look up 1948, 1967, and 1973.



Both major party Presidential candidates disagree strongly with you. But heck -- someone who agrees with you should feel free to enter the race. I could see them getting a lot of pro-Hezbollah and neo-Nazi votes.

The fact that the jewish lobby greases the pockets of both parties to the extreme would have nothing to do with the political support?
Tell me what has Israel really really done for us to warrent such generosity? The USS Liberty doesn't mean anything to you but it does to this sailor. The Akula class attack submarine in large part is the result of Israels spying.
Our woes in the middle east have firm roots in our very biased approach to Israel and their misdeeds.
Yes Israels neighbors have attacked them. And Israel has attacked their neighbors as well. Israel does a great job of provoking a fight and then crying foul. Its easy when you have the USA as a sugar daddy.
I trained with the Israeli defence forces. I have a powerful respect for their skills and abilities. I also got to see and hear first hand how they treat arabs. No not those who actually did anything wrong but the first ones they can catch after something happens. I would be all for putting the boots to a captured terrorist that just blew up a school. These guys just don't bother to wait. Imagine if you watched your father who has done no wrong get beatings, jailed and prevented to go to work. Your family suffers. No apologies, no compensation, just accept it.
Next they bulldoze your home without warning. All your posessions still inside.
Oh we signed a peace treaty and will return the lands we took from you. But instead build settlements on them instead.
No I guess this wouldn't cause some strong hard feelings.
Watch some news other than CNN or US based media. No not arab news because they sling it the other way.
I say let Israel stand on its own. They are wealthy and don't need our money. They leach and use us. Let them answer up for what they do without us to shield them. They will learn to play nice. Even Israeli citizens are becoming fed up with their gov constant abuse of their neighbors.

[bily4]

Time to drop the fairy tales. Israelis have become the bullies of the schoolyard because they know the big bad USA will back them up.

They have caused enough mischief. Let them back their own belligerence up for a change. See how they handle it.

[Rathagos]

Originally Posted by bily4

Time to drop the fairy tales. Israelis have become the bullies of the schoolyard because they know the big bad USA will back them up.

They have caused enough mischief. Let them back their own belligerence up for a change. See how they handle it.

You're kidding, right? Please tell me you're kidding. May 14, 1948, President Truman, in support of the UN and Israel, officially recognized the de facto Jewish government of Israel. Until other legislation is passed, why should they be treated any differently in terms of expected support than any other government(s) we have pledged to support?

As far as bullying goes, it appears that the only thing the Palestinians understand is fighting. Every time Israel signs or agrees to some sort of peace or armistice, who's the one that breaks it? The vast majority of the time it's the Palestinians (or one of Iran's proxy militias Hamas or Hizballah). Israel has even conceded the two areas (Gaza and the West Bank) as statehood to the Palestinians, and it's still not enough. It is like the Native Americans still physically taking up arms against us in the U.S. or any indigenous group continuing an armed rebellion against another nation (aboriginals against Australians, etc.).

I think the Israelis have shown remarkable restraint in the powder keg they could set off by just totally pushing the Palestinians off their land by full force.

I think everyone can empathize with what the Palestinians are going through. But even after being given areas for statehood, they still resort to violence. It's the way out there. Been going on for thousands of years... and I don't see it ending soon.

[Noahma]

Originally Posted by Rathagos

You're kidding, right? Please tell me you're kidding. May 14, 1948, President Truman, in support of the UN and Israel, officially recognized the de facto Jewish government of Israel. Until other legislation is passed, why should they be treated any differently in terms of expected support than any other government(s) we have pledged to support?

As far as bullying goes, it appears that the only thing the Palestinians understand is fighting. Every time Israel signs or agrees to some sort of peace or armistice, who's the one that breaks it? The vast majority of the time it's the Palestinians (or one of Iran's proxy militias Hamas or Hizballah). Israel has even conceded the two areas (Gaza and the West Bank) as statehood to the Palestinians, and it's still not enough. It is like the Native Americans still physically taking up arms against us in the U.S. or any indigenous group continuing an armed rebellion against another nation (aboriginals against Australians, etc.).

I think the Israelis have shown remarkable restraint in the powder keg they could set off by just totally pushing the Palestinians off their land by full force.

I think everyone can empathize with what the Palestinians are going through. But even after being given areas for statehood, they still resort to violence. It's the way out there. Been going on for thousands of years... and I don't see it ending soon.

the Israelis are also indigenous to the area as well.

[bily4]

Originally Posted by Rathagos

You're kidding, right? Please tell me you're kidding. May 14, 1948, President Truman, in support of the UN and Israel, officially recognized the de facto Jewish government of Israel. Until other legislation is passed, why should they be treated any differently in terms of expected support than any other government(s) we have pledged to support?

As far as bullying goes, it appears that the only thing the Palestinians understand is fighting. Every time Israel signs or agrees to some sort of peace or armistice, who's the one that breaks it? The vast majority of the time it's the Palestinians (or one of Iran's proxy militias Hamas or Hizballah). Israel has even conceded the two areas (Gaza and the West Bank) as statehood to the Palestinians, and it's still not enough. It is like the Native Americans still physically taking up arms against us in the U.S. or any indigenous group continuing an armed rebellion against another nation (aboriginals against Australians, etc.).

I think the Israelis have shown remarkable restraint in the powder keg they could set off by just totally pushing the Palestinians off their land by full force.

I think everyone can empathize with what the Palestinians are going through. But even after being given areas for statehood, they still resort to violence. It's the way out there. Been going on for thousands of years... and I don't see it ending soon.

Honestly. I could care less about Gaza or the West Bank. Like you said, it ain't ending anytime soon. They will be fighting over that miserable peice of land until the end of time. Nothing to do with the USA.

You want to send diplomats over there to try to help with negotiaitions, I am ok with that. Stop the $3 Billion in annual military aid though.

[Fishy]

Originally Posted by pstratt

If they quit threatening to blow Israel off of the face of the earth it wouldn't be an issue.

actually they said to remove the zionist regime, not to physically remove israel off the face of the earth

[fp1978]

Originally Posted by KevK

The more I read and hear, the more I am coming around to Iran's point of view on several levels:

1. The EU and the USA, while being all bent out of shape about Iran's program never said a peep about Israel's secret program nor did they "harshly" punish India and Pakistan for theirs. In fact we cancelled the few sanctions we had in place against both nations. If you wish to ban nukes, be consistant about it!

Israel, India, and Pakistan's leaders never publicly stated that they we put onto the Earth by Allah for the purpose of destroying another nation.

2. Iran want to become a first world nation and has the absolute right to do so. The biggest thing that separates first world from third world nations is the development and enrichment of nukes.

I can see where this is going. The whole "they just want the nukes for peaceful purposes; for energy reasons". BS! First of all, they are literally swimming in oil so energy isn't a problem. Secondly, if liberals/pacifists don't have a problem with Iran developing and building nuclear power plants to supply energy then why, pray tell, is it considered blasphemy whenever someone suggests building more here in the US?

3. Iran has no history of aggression against other countries. In fact they have been victimized by other nations attacking them or causing them trouble- including the UK and USA.

Oh, where to begin. I guess you either don't know, or don't care (which is what I'd be willing to bet), that Iran has already committed a universally recognized act of war against the United States when our embassy, sovereign United States soil, was attacked and overrun and it's occupants held hostage. It is also a widely known fact throughout the world that Iran sponsors groups such as Hamas and Hezbollah, two of the worlds worst terrorist organizations that routinely target and murder innocent people (although you may refer to them as "freedom fighters", which wouldn't be surprising). And then there is the little fact that Iran is run by a madman who has claimed that he was chosen by Allah to pave the way for the Mahdi, and that his mission is wipe Israel off of the face of the Earth.
But no, no history of aggression there

[fp1978]

Originally Posted by Fishy

actually they said to remove the zionist regime, not to physically remove israel off the face of the earth

You are absolutely WRONG.

CNN.com - Iranian leader: Wipe out Israel - Oct 27, 2005


TEHRAN, Iran (CNN) -- Iran's new president has repeated a remark from a former ayatollah that Israel should be "wiped out from the map," insisting that a new series of attacks will destroy the Jewish state, and lashing out at Muslim countries and leaders that acknowledge Israel.

................................................

Ahmadinejad quoted a remark from Iran's Ayatollah Khomeini, the founder of Iran's Islamic revolution, who said that Israel "must be wiped out from the map of the world."

[Yeledaf]

Originally Posted by tinman01

The fact that the jewish lobby greases the pockets of both parties to the extreme would have nothing to do with the political support?
Tell me what has Israel really really done for us to warrent such generosity? The USS Liberty doesn't mean anything to you but it does to this sailor. The Akula class attack submarine in large part is the result of Israels spying.
Our woes in the middle east have firm roots in our very biased approach to Israel and their misdeeds.
Yes Israels neighbors have attacked them. And Israel has attacked their neighbors as well. Israel does a great job of provoking a fight and then crying foul. Its easy when you have the USA as a sugar daddy.
I trained with the Israeli defence forces. I have a powerful respect for their skills and abilities. I also got to see and hear first hand how they treat arabs. No not those who actually did anything wrong but the first ones they can catch after something happens. I would be all for putting the boots to a captured terrorist that just blew up a school. These guys just don't bother to wait. Imagine if you watched your father who has done no wrong get beatings, jailed and prevented to go to work. Your family suffers. No apologies, no compensation, just accept it.
Next they bulldoze your home without warning. All your posessions still inside.
Oh we signed a peace treaty and will return the lands we took from you. But instead build settlements on them instead.
No I guess this wouldn't cause some strong hard feelings.
Watch some news other than CNN or US based media. No not arab news because they sling it the other way.
I say let Israel stand on its own. They are wealthy and don't need our money. They leach and use us. Let them answer up for what they do without us to shield them. They will learn to play nice. Even Israeli citizens are becoming fed up with their gov constant abuse of their neighbors.

I'll see your USS LIberty and raise you a Cole, a Khobar Towers, and the World trade Center. The Arabs have earned every bit of enmity they engender.

The choices for the Arabs are be peaceful or be bullied.

The choices for Israel are be a bully or be annihilated.

Even a person brought to the brink of blindness by hatred can see that.

[Fishy]

Originally Posted by fp1978

You are absolutely WRONG.

CNN.com - Iranian leader: Wipe out Israel - Oct 27, 2005


TEHRAN, Iran (CNN) -- Iran's new president has repeated a remark from a former ayatollah that Israel should be "wiped out from the map," insisting that a new series of attacks will destroy the Jewish state, and lashing out at Muslim countries and leaders that acknowledge Israel.

................................................

Ahmadinejad quoted a remark from Iran's Ayatollah Khomeini, the founder of Iran's Islamic revolution, who said that Israel "must be wiped out from the map of the world."

it was a bad translation

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Israel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Ahmadinejad's phrase was " بايد از صفحه روزگار محو شود " according to the text published on the President's Office's website.[10]
The translation presented by IRIB has been challenged by Mr. Arash Norouzi, who proposes that the statement "wiped off the map" was never made and that Ahmadinejad did not refer to the nation or land mass of Israel, but to the "regime occupying Jerusalem".