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Old 01-29-2007, 06:58 PM
 
Location: Atlanta
699 posts, read 2,303,181 times
Reputation: 288

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When they start quoting the bible with selective passages that are obviously outdated and different thousands of years later, no logic or reason can penetrate that fortress of a mind. Many many things in the bible are not applicable to life in 2007 (Let's sacrifice some lambs, or maybe go smite our neighbors, or stone some hookers). Religious fanatics love to use the bible to support their prejudices and conveniently overlook other parts of it. They are a lost cause...
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Old 01-29-2007, 07:02 PM
 
Location: 78218
1,151 posts, read 3,061,577 times
Reputation: 642
Quote:
Originally Posted by sprtsluvr8 View Post
When they start quoting the bible with selective passages that are obviously outdated and different thousands of years later, no logic or reason can penetrate that fortress of a mind. Many many things in the bible are not applicable to life in 2007 (Let's sacrifice some lambs, or maybe go smite our neighbors, or stone some hookers). Religious fanatics love to use the bible to support their prejudices and conveniently overlook other parts of it. They are a lost cause...
Amen to that.
....
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Old 01-29-2007, 07:44 PM
 
Location: Small patch of terra firma
1,275 posts, read 2,124,589 times
Reputation: 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by wildberries61 View Post
It's funny how you like references of were people get their information on other debates but, feel you can pull verses from the Bible knowing there's a correct way to interpret, that only a preacher or scholar can teach. Most of these submissions were for women to be obedient to their husbands not, intended to be in bondage to men.
You’re right, I have the nasty habit of asking people where they get their information when they try to provide a “story” or statistic and present it as fact. So if someone says “95% of all teenage girls like to use cocaine instead of going to church” I should just accept it as fact instead of questioning it. Is that what you do? Just take a statement as fact instead or questioning the resource?

Only a preacher or scholar can teach it? Well what happens when they disagree. Oh wait, there is no disagreement between preachers and religious scholars on bible interpretation. They all agree on every single message and follow the same rules. Right?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wildberries61 View Post
I hate to say it "women gossip" and so, do men but,I believe that is what God meant by woman remaining silent and listening. Don't worry he gave us plenty other gifts and knowledge.
You believe that is what god meant? Are you a preacher or scholar to know? The bible thumpers who quote from Leviticus don’t state “what it meant”, they are very clear, and so are a lot of religious people, that the bible means what is states. There is no “what this mean is …”. So I’m taking their strict interpretationist style. It suits them so it suits me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wildberries61 View Post
If a person is not familiar or taught these verses they can be misinterpreted.
A biblical verse can be misinterpreted? Really, I hope that isn’t true because then that false information gets passed along by people who don’t question it. Oh wait, people are not supposed to question it.
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Old 01-29-2007, 08:14 PM
 
Location: Small patch of terra firma
1,275 posts, read 2,124,589 times
Reputation: 536
wildberries, care to comment on Marks post? Is he right? He seems to have your same views. He posted directly from the bible and he appears to be faithful from reading his other posts.

However his post reference from 2 Peter of God delivering "just Lot" from Sodom and Gomorrha is not entirely right. Lotís daughters were also spared and so they shared a cave with daddy to get pregnant by daddy.

Genesis 19:32 Come, let us make our father drink wine, and we will lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father. 19:33 And they made their father drink wine that night: and the firstborn went in, and lay with her father; and he perceived not when she lay down, nor when she arose. 19:34 And it came to pass on the morrow, that the firstborn said unto the younger, Behold, I lay yesternight with my father: let us make him drink wine this night also; and go thou in, and lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father.

Care to interpret this line for us too? Tell us what this means? Is there some meaning of Lotís daughters getting him drunk so they can get pregnant by him? Wow, can you believe this stuff is in the bible. Do parents know this stuff is out there for children to read? Please be aware of how you provide this forum the interpretation, just as 2 Peter warns:

1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. 1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost. 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
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Old 01-29-2007, 08:30 PM
 
Location: Earth
17,449 posts, read 22,970,647 times
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Default What about Ezekiel 23?

I'd like to see some bible thumpers try to explain that particularly Ezekiel 23:19-20 and its talk about "she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals as big as those of donkeys and whose sperm was as potent as that of horses".

Maybe Mel Gibson should have filmed THAT Bible story....)
:
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Old 01-29-2007, 08:35 PM
 
Location: Earth
17,449 posts, read 22,970,647 times
Reputation: 7246
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marks View Post
This is yet another attempt from those that struggle to "be accepted" in their sin, and another attempt to push the evil agenda into the mainstream.

What is required is not simpathy, acceptance, or understanding but REPENTANCE! What's right is right.

"If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them." (Leviticus 20:13)

It is wrong!

Reason #1 Ė God says so.

"If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them." (Leviticus 20:13)


Cont. below.
You realize that, in the book of Leviticus, eating pork is considered just as grave of an abomination (offence against religion) as male homosexuality?
(Lesbianism, oddly enough, is not mentioned in the Bible nor in the Koran, probably because the status of women was so low anyways that women who preferred women were not thought to be a threat.)

Also, the prohibitions against homosexuality in Leviticus are only binding for Jews ; non-Jews are considered exempt from these rules.
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Old 01-29-2007, 09:01 PM
 
Location: Comunistafornia, and working to get out ASAP!
1,959 posts, read 4,642,856 times
Reputation: 919
Look, more than likely someone will come along and say, "Let's not get into the 'religious' debate on this." Which is always the case when the other side is loosing.

The fact is, those of us that know homosexuality is condemned by God are not going to be persuaded otherwise plain and simple. We know there are those that don't think anything is wrong with it, and in fact support it openly. Whatever As I said before we shall all see in the end who is right

However, my job is to warn-- "...instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth." (2 Timothy 2:25)

Our Lord Jesus said, "I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish." (Luke 13:3)

And also it is said, "For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God." (1 Corinthians 1:18)

And also, "Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness." (2 Thessalonians 2:9-12)

And finally, "But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned." (1 Corinthians 2:14)

REPENT AMERICA!
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Old 01-29-2007, 09:06 PM
 
Location: Earth
17,449 posts, read 22,970,647 times
Reputation: 7246
You forget that the US is an officially secular country not a confessional state (despite the best efforts of the Bush administration to try to change this) and that a sizeable part of the US population are not Christians, also a huge part of the Americans who are Christians are only nominally so.

Religious arguments should not creep into politics. They don't have a place in a non-confessional state.
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Old 01-29-2007, 11:48 PM
 
Location: Bay Area, CA
28,191 posts, read 43,477,322 times
Reputation: 18621
Quote:
Originally Posted by sprtsluvr8 View Post
When they start quoting the bible with selective passages that are obviously outdated and different thousands of years later, no logic or reason can penetrate that fortress of a mind. Many many things in the bible are not applicable to life in 2007 (Let's sacrifice some lambs, or maybe go smite our neighbors, or stone some hookers). Religious fanatics love to use the bible to support their prejudices and conveniently overlook other parts of it. They are a lost cause...
I will also give that a big A-MEN!! I'm certainly not "anti-religion", considering I am a practicing Jew, but the Bible/Torah doesn't dictate my actions & beliefs. And when people use it as a debating tool, like you said, there's really no point... we can literally find a Bible passage to support or oppose ANY subject, so it's hardly an accurate source. Let's just say that as a librarian, I'd never use it to answer a reference question. Not to mention, a human should be able to make their own decisions, without relying on a book to decide things for them.
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Old 01-29-2007, 11:53 PM
 
Location: Small patch of terra firma
1,275 posts, read 2,124,589 times
Reputation: 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marks View Post
The fact is, those of us that know homosexuality is condemned by God are not going to be persuaded otherwise plain and simple. We know there are those that don't think anything is wrong with it, and in fact support it openly. Whatever As I said before we shall all see in the end who is right
And who are you to judge? Youíre post are borderline condemnation, I donít think it was your place to do the condeming.
Luke 6:35 But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil. 6:36 Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful. 6:37 Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall beforgiven:

Itís a good thing that we do live in a free society where our government is not Christian based and so it should remain free from making decisions on personal freedoms that are religiously based.

In case you didnít know marks and wildberries, as was communicated to the US Senate and recorded on the on the Senate record, May 26, 1797, the Treaty of Tripoli:

ďAs the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religionĒ

The Senate approved the treaty and John Adams signed it. So those fellaís know a lot more about what this nation is founded on since it was back in their days. It was not founded on your bible nor your religion. So letís follow their lead an keep government out of legislating your bible based bigotry.
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