Once Again We Are Messing Up Cuba! (world)

[jmarquise]

who or what is a president obama?

[my54ford]

Originally Posted by jmarquise

who or what is a president obama?

Didn't you hear They elected him some time ago. The next few months are just a show for us dumb rednecks

[Luiso]

Originally Posted by Mircea

That is a complete falsehood.

There was no need to normalize relations, since it was the US who overthrew Batista and installed Castro.

Castro was with a group that fire-bombed an army barracks and was arrested. The US State Department pressured Batista to grant clemency to the rebels and Castro and others were released from prison.

The US State Department then invited Castro to the US Embassy Mission Mexico City and recruited him to overthrow Batista.

CIA agent Frank Sturgis was assigned as Castro's personal bodyguard and intelligence advisor, and coordinated the air drops of US supplies for Castro's rebel forces.

It's all there in black and white in the congressional hearings held between 1976 and 1978.

After Castro was installed, the US immediately brought him to the states and toured him through major US cities touting him as the "new hope." That's well documented, with film footage not only from the US government, but from all three news networks as well (yes, there were only 3 back then).

At the time, US corporations had not paid taxes in Cuba. When Castro insisted that US corporations pay taxes and that National Sugar and United Fruit pay unskilled sugar cane workers the same wages they paid unskilled sugar cane workers in Honduras, Guatemala and Nicaragua, which was $0.90 per day (a day being 10 to 12 working hours with no overtime pay), they balked (they were already paying skilled workers at the sugar mills $4/per day just like they did in the other countries). Then Castro insisted they pay back-taxes, and when the US corporations refused, he expropriated their assets (ie he nationalized all US corporate holdings).

The reason Castro did that was because the Mexican government had sued US oil companies for back taxes and Mexican oil workers had sued US oil companies to be paid comparable wages. These were salaried workers with engineering degrees mostly from European universities (we're talking about the white Mexicans -- the ones of European descent). The Mexican Supreme Court ordered the US oil companies to pay back taxes and comparable wages. Seven years later, US oil companies had thumbed their noses at the Mexican government and still hadn't paid the back taxes, weren't paying current taxes, and weren't paying workers comparable wages. President Cardenas then issued an order that the US oil companies must pay the taxes within 90 days and show evidence of wage increases for the salaried employees. Five months later, they US oil companies still had not complied with the Mexican Supreme Court's orders, or President Cardenas' orders, so in March 1938, President Cardenas seized all US oil companies, their equipment and bank accounts, and kicked them out of Mexico.

The US planned to go to war with Mexico and overthrow the government, but FDR wisely deferred, since WW II was looming large and the US needed the oil and needed to use the troops elsewhere. A few years later (I think 1942), the Mexican government gave the US $24 Million for seizing US oil company assets (about 3 times the stated value the oil companies claimed in their books).

Castro figured he could pay the US for the assets seized, but he should have known better, since the US had previously murdered several heads of state or overthrown the government for nationalizing US corporate assets in Honduras, Nicaragua, El Salvador, Guatemala, Brazil, Venezuela and a few other countries.

To Cubans, Castro is a hero. One day you're working 10 to 12 hours a day for a whopping $0.30/day and the next you're getting $2.40/day and you're only working 8 hours. The communications workers at IT&T (International Telephone & Telegraph) also got pay raises, and so did the casino and hotel employees and most everyone else.

If Kennedy had half a brain, he would have accepted payment from Cuba and let it be, instead of trying to murder Castro.

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"To Cubans, Castro is a hero"

He was . My grandfather supported him he used to climb telephone poles with a few other's and throw heavy chains over electric lines to shut off electricity in Batistas military barracks (keep in mind lines werent like they are now).
They hated Batista . Few yrs after Castro took over he was as bad infact worse (depends who you ask).

After Castro took over he became a piece of worthless trash like the VAST majority of politician's all over Latin America .

I do think the Castro brother's are on borrowed time as Raul is an inept drunk and incapable of holding power not nearly as clever as Fidel .

It would be nice to see embargo lifted and things begin to change as they would . Raul Castro seem's to want change .
It's worth a try.

[Luiso]

Originally Posted by jtur88

You are absolutely right, Kev. Al we would have had to do in '59 was say to Castro "Welcome to the Americas. We wish you well in your effort to improve the welfare of the Cuban people. If you have any trouble, let us know. We stand ready to help." If we had done that, the cold war would have been over ten or twenty years sooner, and the Cuban people would today be living in one of the most prosperous counteis in Latin America. Who are the real victims of US policy? The people of Cuba whose lives could only have been better if we had embraced them in our community of nations.

Why would Castro put Soviet missiles in a place where they could harm his cooperative American friends?

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The whole thing was comlicated you can say Castro did that because of all the assasination attempts we tried and attempts to overthrow him.

He hated ,feared USA . Kennedy handled it well as I would have launched missles .
I do agree with friend's like Castro who need's enemies but again you can debate who pushed first. It's old history now as he is more dead than alive.

Be it Cuba or vast Majority of "Latin American" politicians I can't think of many worth a damn . If any at all.

Cuba just happens to be close as is Mexico with that other pile of sewage waste Calderon .

[Luiso]

Originally Posted by rlchurch

What a silly thing to not have relations with Cuba. We have relations with Vietnam. Whom does it hurt besides the United States? What are we worried about? What bad things could happen if American tourists went to Cuba?

I agree it's time to atleast try some changes .

Most people won't see a penny of it much like Martinique with great hotel's unreal beaches and dire dire poverty outside of those area's same as Mexico tourist area's but it's a start.

[Frank_Carbonni]

When the Beard kicks the bucket I will celebrate.

One less piece of trash, the world will feel lighter.

[StillwaterTownie]

Originally Posted by rlchurch

What a silly thing to not have relations with Cuba. We have relations with Vietnam. Whom does it hurt besides the United States? What are we worried about? What bad things could happen if American tourists went to Cuba?

It's all political. Former Cubans in Florida and elsewhere in America don't want America to recognize Cuba until it rejects communism. Former Cubans are gonna pass this feeling from generation and generation and politicians are too fearful to counter it.

[Luiso]

Originally Posted by StillwaterTownie

It's all political. Former Cubans in Florida and elsewhere in America don't want America to recognize Cuba until it rejects communism. Former Cubans are gonna pass this feeling from generation and generation and politicians are too fearful to counter it.

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There is a political comic strip here in South Florida that I saw while back. It was great as so TRUE.

An elderly Cuban couple is standing by the beach in Miami looking at Cuba .

A South Florida politician is standing behind them with his hand in the man's wallet and the woman's purse stealing money while screaming "Keep looking at Cuba no need to pay attention to what is going on here" .

That cartoon represents vast majority of elderly Cuban's here just focused on Cuba.

[tinman01]

uhmmmm what makes cuba's problems ours? What cuba does with its citizens really is none of our business. But speaking of business. I have no issue with opening trade with cuba. Business trade. No helping hand outs etc. We are cash strapped and can't afford any more handouts of any kind.

[Luiso]

Originally Posted by tinman01

uhmmmm what makes cuba's problems ours? What cuba does with its citizens really is none of our business. But speaking of business. I have no issue with opening trade with cuba. Business trade. No helping hand outs etc. We are cash strapped and can't afford any more handouts of any kind.

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I agree Cuba nor ANY country should be our problem our responcibility