Can John Deere replace the Confederate flag?

[jtur88]

Why not go generic, and replace it with that chrome profile of a hot babe that you see on mudflaps of 18-wheelers?

[Alt Dach]

[quote=lionking;5490180]Why do only Southern people make a big deal of their area?Notherners,Easterners,Westerners don't make THAT big of a deal where they are from.....I live in Florida by the way.

Southern first,American second?If you were in combat in a rifle squad and you had a black,Mexican,Italian,Jewish,Polish,asian,northern er,westerner,hispanic in your squad I bet you would only think of them as your lifeline and buds and as American's only who covered your 6.


being American always comes first.....your heritage second.

To you and me perhaps, but I didn't see any rich folks in my squad in
the RVN,it is possible they think of it in a different way.

[Alt Dach]

[quote=GloryB;5491097]Maybe only the south is still proud of itself.

Seriously, I grew up in Florida and I think people from other American areas seem to read more into what the flag represents than the people who actually own one. People from Puerto Rico and Mexico still fly their flags. It is something to identify with....not a slander against the rest of humanity.

Just because Bubbba is so used to his confederate rag that he gives it
little thought, does not change the fact that is a racist symbol and is
universally viewed as such by the victims of that racism.

[jtur88]

Originally Posted by Alt Dach

[


being American always comes first.....your heritage second.

.

Only if America is right---and in all the military escapades and adventures in my adult lifetime, Being American has never been being right, and therefore, to me, not First.

[lionking]

Originally Posted by jtur88

Only if America is right---and in all the military escapades and adventures in my adult lifetime, Being American has never been being right, and therefore, to me, not First.

you are confusing policy with principle.The principle of America is sound and true.That's why everybody should associate themself as part of this nation more than their personal ethnic or religious background.There is nothing wrong with identifying your personal history but by putting being American as second is divisive.


Policy,the abuse of principles by policy is where America and American's sometimes go astray and the policies that have abused principle of the Republican party for the last several years is why I no longer will be loyal to them.

Same with Democrats,who abuse principle to enact their policies.


Freedom and individual rights means what I do,what Imake,what I own is none of your business and what you have and do is none of my business until someone uses their freedom to intrude on another's.That's principle,which both main political parties are hypocrites for saying they champion freedom yet use abusive policies to trample on it when it suits them.


If we followed what I said above we wouldn't be in unclear objective wars,we wouldn't be using classism to create envy that takes from one to make it fair for another,we wouldn't have useless morality laws against drugs,food and prostitution that are unwinable "wars against".


And people would be more respectful even if they didn't agree with each other.Because to remain consistant to freedom,it means you don't try to control other's lives when you don't agree with their lifestyle,because you value your freedom and understand that even if you don't agreee with someone it is right to value their freedom also.

[jtur88]

Originally Posted by lionking

you are confusing policy with principle..

No, principle always comes first and there is no confusion. If I see an American bullying a non-American, I am not going to side with the American---I don't care if it's in a schoolyard, a brothel, or Baghdad. And furthermore, if necessary to keep a victim from harm, I will use whatever force is abailable to me to stop the bully. This is a principle, and it not to be sold out in the name of patriotixm.

[KevK]

Originally Posted by Tom Lennox 70

I'm pledging a professional fraternity and we have decorate a notebook to reflect who we are. One thing about me is that while I grew up mostly in a Washington, D.C. suburb (after 7 years in New Orleans). Part of me is that I have a lot of Southern pride and despite most of life near DC I consider myself as having Southern/heartland/small town (aka Red American) values. These include family, community, patriotism, integrity, respect, dignity, self-reliance, independence, genorosity and kindness. And also knwoing what's important in life and valuing the right things and having good morals. Even though my parents are immigrants, I was born here and I have an affinity for the South and consider myself a Southerner first before an American.

I identify with the ordinary people of the South and the heartland that the liberals look down on (such as Barack Obama the stooge of the elite Democrat establishment run by Pelosi, Kennedy and Kerry). I don't really have anything in common with the hip yuppies sipping Starbucks lattes in Boston and San Francisco or buying $500 outfits in New York. I am proud to not be arrogant or snotty and proud to be just the average guy who is content with drinking Coors, shopping at Wal-Mart, listening to country music and eating fast food. Just because I'm going to be a professional doesn't mean I have to sell my soul or betray my upbringing or the people I grew up with.

Most people DO NOT use the Confederate flag as a racist symbol though it still offends some African Americans (though I have met black people who are not offended by it.) I am not racist and have white, black, Asian and Hispanic friends. I care about who people are, their values and outlook and lifestyle, not the color of their skin. I don't like controversy in real life (the message board is a whole different story) so I'm probably not going to do the Confederate flag. I might substitte it with the John Deere symbol. John Deere also represnts small town, traditional values. It also represents a laid-back, easygoing, worry-free lifestyle that people in small towns enjoy away from the urban rat race. I know I will never be a "redneck" or a good ol' boy (you have to be born into it) but its something I fantasize about.

What do people think about John Deere as a replacement for the Confederate flag, espeically since its so often brought up that another symbol should be found to represent Southern heritage and traditional American values. And yes, the Confederate flag goes beyond the South, there are people all over with shot glasses that say "redneck" with the flag on it...to many people who fly it is represents the rural American lifestyle.

John Deere is a farm symbol more than a southern symbol. Every farmer in Kansas has 2 ball caps- one says Co-op and the other says "John Deere" on it. Although Deere makes other things such as heavy construction equipment, it is still much associated with rural things.

[lionking]

Originally Posted by jtur88

No, principle always comes first and there is no confusion. If I see an American bullying a non-American, I am not going to side with the American---I don't care if it's in a schoolyard, a brothel, or Baghdad. And furthermore, if necessary to keep a victim from harm, I will use whatever force is abailable to me to stop the bully. This is a principle, and it not to be sold out in the name of patriotixm.

well I agree with that,just because your family member is family but is doing something unjust that doesn't mean you should side with them just because.


I agree American should not stay silent against abuse of the constitution just to support the troops,Democrats started political correctness to hush opposition now Republicans have created patriot correctness to hush opposition to immoral abuse of the consitution.


But that is what the Republican's have done.They tout being the party of morals and patriotism and the hugest lovers of freedom,free markets and the constitution yet have made policy in conflict of the constitution.Some republican's tout they believe in small government and individual rights and states rights yet when it suits their morality they become hypocrites and use government in nation building,create a war on terrorism way beyond going after who attacked us,use government to force their idea of morality with marriage,sex and products of consumption.......so much for being lovers of the Bill of Rights and small government.


But Democrats do much the same.Democrats group into ethnic groups and create envy among classes,putting ethnic and sexual nametags above being a American.They want to force people to be a collective and divide people on being a individual.They want to nanny people's money and retirement and decide who has it "too good".They want to disarm American's and leave them dependant on Democratic party leaders,yet Democrats in power refuse to give up the freedoms they demand that others give up.


I read on this forum so many members who are more loyal blindly to their political party demanding others bow to there idea of America yet scream when someone threatens their freedom.There are those that want to nanny what people do with sex,what they do with their money,be in charge to decide for others how big of a house they need,Manage their retirement,decide for others what they can consume.Demand that patriotism means believing that if we don't rid the world of those evil Muslims and take over their country then they will sneak over here and get you while you sleep.


What I see is both sides are the same when it comes to the loyalist blind party followers,you aren't interested in freedom,you are interested in controling other people's freedom while retaining power to keep the freedoms you like.

I read here Republicans who bashed Clinton for nation building all of a sudden try and justify it when a Republican does it,only they use scare tactics of the "evil Islams out to conquer the world".

I read Liberal Democrats calling people greedy and racist yet practice the same greed and racism they accuse others of.


As far as I'm concerned both the liberal Democrats and Neo conservatives are the same,both are a threat to freedom for America.It is just that they are so busy slamming each other in their self righteousness thay can't see they are throwing stones in glass houses.

[Kangaroofarmer]

Originally Posted by seattlerain

I've always been under the impression that Massey Ferguson was Canadian and British.

I can't remember the details now, but one was originally founded in Canada, and one in the England.

Canadian Newcastle Machine and Foundry Manufactory

Merged with.

Canadian Massey Manufactoring Co

Who Merged with.

British A Harris, Sons & Co

Who then became.

Massey-Harris Company

Who then merged with.

Ferguson Company

Which then became.

Massey-Harris-Ferguson

Who Changed their name to.

Massey-Ferguson

Who is now owned by.

AGCO Corporation

MF also brought into Australia's H V Mckay Company ( Inventor of the "Sunshine" Stripper Harvester), Which lead to Australian MF Combine harvesters, Being emblazoned with the "Sunshine" Brand, For many years.

[Badfish740]

This is probably one of the more absurd threads I've ever read in the political forums, but I feel compelled to respond nonetheless.

Originally Posted by Tom Lennox 70

I'm pledging a professional fraternity and we have decorate a notebook to reflect who we are. One thing about me is that while I grew up mostly in a Washington, D.C. suburb (after 7 years in New Orleans). Part of me is that I have a lot of Southern pride and despite most of life near DC I consider myself as having Southern/heartland/small town (aka Red American) values.

Explain how small town values are "Red American" values. I grew up in a small rural town, I hunt and fish, drive a truck, attend church regularly, etc...in New Jersey. I just bought a home in an even smaller, more rural town-in New Jersey. I value family, community, patriotism, integrity, respect, dignity, self-reliance, independence, genorosity and kindness, but I don't consider myself someone who has Southern/heartland/small town (aka Red American) values. I also don't believe that one has to be Southern to have these values-in fact I know so.

Originally Posted by Tom Lennox 70

Even though my parents are immigrants, I was born here and I have an affinity for the South and consider myself a Southerner first before an American.

I consider myself an American before all else-that's a very important part of my value system.

Originally Posted by Tom Lennox 70

I identify with the ordinary people of the South and the heartland that the liberals look down on (such as Barack Obama the stooge of the elite Democrat establishment run by Pelosi, Kennedy and Kerry). I don't really have anything in common with the hip yuppies sipping Starbucks lattes in Boston and San Francisco or buying $500 outfits in New York.

Funny, when I was at the IBEW (International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers) Local 269 picnic last weekend there wasn't an elite liberal, latte, or $500 outfit in sight. There were a lot of hardworking blue collar Democrats though.

Originally Posted by Tom Lennox 70

I am proud to not be arrogant or snotty and proud to be just the average guy who is content with drinking Coors, shopping at Wal-Mart, listening to country music and eating fast food. Just because I'm going to be a professional doesn't mean I have to sell my soul or betray my upbringing or the people I grew up with.

I much prefer Yuengling (Oldest brewery in America-Pottsville, PA) to Coors, and I'd rather give my local mom and pop shops business than buy cheap junk from the Red Chinese at Wal-Mart, but I do love country music. Just not that garbage they play on the radio. KEITH URBAN AND BRAD PAISLEY ARE NOT COUNTRY!!! Hank (all three), Charlie Daniels, Steve Earle, and Johnny Cash are more my style. As for "selling my soul?" I went to college and I wear a suit to work, but I know damn well where I came from-farmers and factory workers.

Originally Posted by Tom Lennox 70

I might substitte it with the John Deere symbol. John Deere also represnts small town, traditional values. It also represents a laid-back, easygoing, worry-free lifestyle that people in small towns enjoy away from the urban rat race.

This is just bizarre. Deere represents one thing to me-damn good equipment. I have two John Deere 110s-one for mowing and one for pulling, plowing, etc... I also operated a lot of Deere equipment when I worked for an excavator one summer. What you are referring to is a ridiculous fashion trend started by some namby-pamby who's probably never so much as mowed a lawn let alone chugged a load through mud with a 2010. You, the self described anathema to yuppies, bought into this crap which is perpetuated in every suburb across the nation. I happen to own a weather worn John Deere ballcap which I earned after a summer of moving a lot of dirt, slogging through a lot of mud, getting up to my elbows in grease and diesel fuel, and putting in a whole mess of blood and sweat. You and the rest of suburbanites running around decked out in green from head to toe don't have a clue what that means. I wear my John Deere hat sometimes, but no more often than I wear my IH hat-after all my F-350 is powered by the same company that makes the red tractors

Originally Posted by Tom Lennox 70

I know I will never be a "redneck" or a good ol' boy (you have to be born into it) but its something I fantasize about.

Fantasizing about being a "redneck?" Well, that's a new one. I'm a Yankee and proud of it.

Originally Posted by Tom Lennox 70

And yes, the Confederate flag goes beyond the South, there are people all over with shot glasses that say "redneck" with the flag on it...to many people who fly it is represents the rural American lifestyle.

The Confederate flag does NOT represent any form of the AMERICAN lifestyle. AMERICA is the country that the CONFEDERACY tried to destroy. By the grace of God we, the union, prevailed, and had the foresight to forgive the South for it's grave transgressions for WE knew that had secession come to fruition, both nations would have withered and died within a short time. One final thought. General William Tecumseh Sherman is, and always will be, my hero.