Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 10-25-2008, 07:39 PM
 
4,250 posts, read 10,432,555 times
Reputation: 1484

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
poop   /–noun 1. a superstructure at the stern of a vessel.
LOL, a fine and fitting end to my thread, LOL!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 10-25-2008, 07:45 PM
 
19,198 posts, read 31,408,870 times
Reputation: 4013
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJon3475 View Post
Taxes are not there for punishment. Just think what you do by going on as a welfare president. The 40% that pay no taxes at all will jump on that band wagon blindly knowing they will get money. How will they get money by the taxes from people above them. They end up with a negative tax rate.
You are pretending that the federal income tax is the only tax that impacts on this bottom 40%. Both payroll taxes and federal excise taxes hit those toward the bottom at much higher rates than those toward the top. There is no group that faces a negative total federal tax burden, as even an average bottom 20% earner gives up to the feds more than 4% of what he makes. The figure is that low of course only because the welfare rolls were moved out of HHS and over to IRS. Welfare-to-work begat the EITC and that is all you're seeing. If not for the EITC, the average bottom quintiler would be paying nearly the average of what everyone pays. Then we should maybe note that state and local taxes tend to be much less progressive than the federal structure is. The lower quintiles are hit hard by those as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJon3475 View Post
Why would those people jump on the band wagon so quickly and blindly? It's not out of compassion. Then all you need to do is convince 11% of the nation above that and shabam! out comes 95% of America will not see an increase.
The numbers are the numbers, Jon. A little skepticism is a good thing. Simply denying everything out of hand is not. In truth of course, none of the actual legislation that would implement Obama's plans has been written yet. All we have are the plans for what he wants to do. But if implemented in anything like the form that's planned, something like 95% of folks would face no signifcant tax changes, while those closer to the top would have to give back some of the mega-bonuses they've been handed since Clinton left office.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-25-2008, 07:52 PM
 
Location: toronto, Canada
773 posts, read 1,213,204 times
Reputation: 283
Movin on, so you would be willing to throw your friendships away, just because they don't agree with you. In my life as a libertarian, I tell people here are my views, but I don't expect them to reciprocate anymore than when they spout interventionalist leftist claptrap at me. Hopefully your not one of those types left or right who don't respect differing opinion, because if you are maybe they are better off not talking to you. In life part of the fun of socializing is finding things in common, don't get caught up on the issues that cause arguments, save that energy for your opponents.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-25-2008, 08:07 PM
 
4,250 posts, read 10,432,555 times
Reputation: 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcmastersteve View Post
Movin on, so you would be willing to throw your friendships away, just because they don't agree with you. In my life as a libertarian, I tell people here are my views, but I don't expect them to reciprocate anymore than when they spout interventionalist leftist claptrap at me. Hopefully your not one of those types left or right who don't respect differing opinion, because if you are maybe they are better off not talking to you. In life part of the fun of socializing is finding things in common, don't get caught up on the issues that cause arguments, save that energy for your opponents.
Well, Mcmastersteve, I don't know if you know anything about the Myers Briggs, but I am an INFP. As such, I am fiercely loyal to my principles. Not necessarily people, although one would hope for that.

I really cannot hang with people who have no issue with people half a world away dying for no reason, in spite of people I might know here. I'd prefer to think of myself as a world citizen. I just am not that fond of this American culture, all in all.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-25-2008, 08:33 PM
 
19,198 posts, read 31,408,870 times
Reputation: 4013
Quote:
Originally Posted by movin'on View Post
I just am not that fond of this American culture, all in all.
It's at least a little bit challenging to be fond of what's become of it. At least a simple majority of the world's population currently finds that challenge to be insurmountable, including a great many here. Much of that could change after Nov 4, however. Should the current polls hold or improve, the US could get a very substantial international bounce all but overnight.
Sincerely,
INTP
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-25-2008, 08:38 PM
 
4,250 posts, read 10,432,555 times
Reputation: 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista View Post
It's at least a little bit challenging to be fond of what's become of it. At least a simple majority of the world's population currently finds that challenge to be insurmountable, including a great many here. Much of that could change after Nov 4, however. Should the current polls hold or improve, the US could get a very substantial international bounce all but overnight.
Sincerely,
INTP
Hi INTP, I've never been that way, and I've been tested many times. I simply cannot hang with certain things.


We will see, right? I've all but lost hope, yet I hang on to hope, which is quite the norm for an INFP...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-25-2008, 10:20 PM
 
Location: On the "Left Coast", somewhere in "the Land of Fruits & Nuts"
8,854 posts, read 10,422,059 times
Reputation: 6670
Quote:
Originally Posted by movin'on View Post
Hi INTP, I've never been that way, and I've been tested many times. I simply cannot hang with certain things.


We will see, right? I've all but lost hope, yet I hang on to hope, which is quite the norm for an INFP...
You know there, "Movin'on".... considering how things are looking lately, that Obama will likely take the Presidency, and both Houses will also be pretty solidly Democratic.... methinks your friends are going to be feeling awfully alone and forlorn very soon, and desperately in need of your engagement with them, if for no other reason than to vent their frustration...!!
-Best wishes from an "intuitive" INFJ
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-25-2008, 10:31 PM
 
4,250 posts, read 10,432,555 times
Reputation: 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by mateo45 View Post
You know there, "Movin'on".... considering how things are looking lately, that Obama will likely take the Presidency, and both Houses will also be pretty solidly Democratic.... methinks your friends are going to be feeling awfully alone and forlorn very soon, and desperately in need of your engagement with them, if for no other reason than to vent their frustration...!!
-Best wishes from an "intuitive" INFJ
Thanks! The one thing I know we can NOT do is to get cocky and self assured. I was to have made phone calls today for three hours, but I've been sick so I did not. Perhaps tomorrow I will just show up at Barack HQ here.

I just want to breathe a sigh of relief if Barack gets in for a few days, after the past eight years of HELL. And I really mean that. I just want to process HOPE. Then I will be there for those RWers who need me. Sort of just like my job. I work with troubled kids and I am there for them.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-26-2008, 12:40 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,579 posts, read 86,709,167 times
Reputation: 36643
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcmastersteve View Post
Movin on, so you would be willing to throw your friendships away, just because they don't agree with you. In my life as a libertarian, I tell people here are my views, but I don't expect them to reciprocate anymore than when they spout interventionalist leftist claptrap at me. Hopefully your not one of those types left or right who don't respect differing opinion, because if you are maybe they are better off not talking to you. In life part of the fun of socializing is finding things in common, don't get caught up on the issues that cause arguments, save that energy for your opponents.
How is it "respecting differing opinion" to call it "spouting claptrap"?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-26-2008, 02:20 AM
 
Location: At my computador
2,057 posts, read 3,405,700 times
Reputation: 510
Quote:
why are these people so afraid that someone might get something for nothing (as in universal health care) yet don't mind spending their and my tax dollars on spreading death and destruction in the world?
Regarding destruction and such around the world: Because the first duty of the government is to protect us from harm. If the Senate says it's time to go to war or the Pres believes that hitting someone is necessary, so be it. I don't like it, but that's the cost of government.

Regarding people getting away with something: Fear is a good thing. It protects us. If our parents raise us to not stick a knife in a light socket, we might not understand why we shouldn't. A child might tell you, incorrectly, that the reason for the rule is to not break the light, but that doesn't matter. What matters is that the child doesn't hurt him/herself.

The reason to fear welfare in its myriad forms is because it breeds oppression. Social Security started at 2%. Now it's over 12%. It was originally for people who lived two years beyond life expectancy. Now it's 15+ yrs before someone reaches average life expectancy. It was originally meant to be one leg of a citizen's personal retirement program... but now, when Medicare is thrown in, it's a complete retirement program. Originally, FDR made the argument that it wasn't socialism, but an insurance. Now? With BO talking about lifting the cap, it's about to turn full blown socialism.

Because of this expansion of welfare, a voting bloc exists that votes according to not what they think is best for the country, but on fears that their benefits might be effected... which means the politicians are making decisions with that as a concern.

This is why you should fear welfare (including corporate.) It isn't just some poor old person or some poor girl with a dope head for a mother getting pregnant-- It's a system that spreads on the backs of others.


Quote:
Originally Posted by movin'on View Post
And now to elaborate, just HOW are they protecting our country? Back it up.
I don't know how to back it up because it seems like common sense to me. If al Qaeda (or any other group) has 10K fighters and $1B you can consume those resources on your terms, on the battle field of your choosing, at the time of your choosing or you can wait for them to attack.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top