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In the neo-conservative perfect world mentioned above there is no debate, no listening, no reason, no compromise, but rather simple authoritarian rule.
Sounds like you're talking about the left, not the right. I'm reminded of glass houses, stones, pots and kettles...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Badfish740
Unless the 2nd Amendment includes the right keep and bear cluster bombs, MOABs, Spectre gunships, Apache helicopters, grenades, claymores, land mines, Destroyers, littoral combat ships, and M1A1 Abrams tanks its not going to much of a fight. blah blah blah
You're wrong. I've already explained why several times in the last week or two, so I'm not going to go over it again. The bottom line is that if it came to revolution, the government wouldn't stand a chance against 100-200 MILLION armed citizens.
Unless the 2nd Amendment includes the right keep and bear cluster bombs, MOABs, Spectre gunships, Apache helicopters, grenades, claymores, land mines, Destroyers, littoral combat ships, and M1A1 Abrams tanks its not going to much of a fight. The founding fathers could never have seen this coming however, and I don't fault them for it. I don't care what the Wolverines did in Red Dawn, unfortunately the U.S. populace is no match for the U.S military no matter how many small arms we have. You could issue every U.S. citizen an M-16 and teach them how to use it, it wouldn't matter much if the military decided to use airpower.
So what is the solution? Disarm our military to make it a fair fight? Maintain a "people's army?" In any event, despite the fact that the founders could not possibly foresee the advances in weaponry over the next 200+ years, they did create a brilliant framework designed to check the power of each branch of government so that hopefully the 2nd Amendment would never really have to be put into action for its original purpose. If you want to be prepared to mount a serious assault against our military, be my guest, you're going to be very busy contacting 3rd world arms dealers and building a compound in who-knows-where, so you might want to quit posting for a while.
try reading up on the 2nd Amendment, the federalist papers and the anti federalist papers 1st before making ridiculous comments.
the founding fathers did not mean for the individual citizen to have the implements of war that a country could have, they wanted the people to have the arms that the individual soldier used and carried.
so cannons, planes, cluster bombs and the like are not what they intended for the people to keep and bear, but the M16, M4, M1, M1A, M3 greasegun, M203, M79 and the like are all what they intended to be in the hands of the people and all without any sort of laws made against by the central goverment.
I shall keep posting as long as I want, unless you socialist liberals dont like people to have differing views than what you are spoonfed by the federal goverment.
The U.S. is on the world stage with regard to Iraq and Afghanistan otherwise we'd be doing what needs to be done-carpet bombing/using tactical nuclear weapons. If it were fighting its own people these tactics would undoubtedly be used. See how effective your AR-15 is against a 20 megaton warhead.
show me which which president in the USA has ever been willing to kill millions in order to kill a few.
you statement is idiotic and just suggests that you truly do not know anything about the Constitution but what the liberals and your liberal education has taught you.
One question I don't see being adressed here would be how much of the US military would be willing to fire on it's own people? A small percentage I think. Our soldiers aren't robots that follow orders blindly and they HAVE taken an oath to defend against all enemies" foriegn and domestic" and to uphold our Constitution. Support of a wannabe dictator would cause our Military a bit of a concience problem, especially if it involved killing US citizens wholesale.
clinton asked this question during the 90's, I believe that the answer he got back was about ~20%. not enough to do the job of shooting and killing other americans.
also the question was only posed to the USMC and USN as both the Army and USAF are banned from doing any sort of combat inside the USA.
Obama will do a fine job in protecting our second ammendment rights. I also hunt small game and own my necessary sporting and protection equiptment and did not even for a moment fear voting in Obama. I will continue to own weapons as long as I live in this fine country.
Because it already happened with the Clinton regime and this time they expanded and "impoved" on it.Read for yourself and see that their definition can include just about any type they desire including antiques.But they won't tell you that.....oh no.Take a special look at (L)
CREDIT TO OZ FROM SC FOR ORIGINALLY POSTING THIS
This is HR 1022:
The term `semiautomatic assault weapon' means any of the following:
`(A) The following rifles or copies or duplicates thereof:
AK, AKM, AKS, AK-47, AK-74, ARM, MAK90, Misr, NHM 90, NHM 91, SA 85, SA 93, VEPR;
`(ii) AR-10;
`(iii) AR-15, Bushmaster XM15, Armalite M15, or Olympic Arms PCR;
`(iv) AR70;
`(v) Calico Liberty;
`(vi) Dragunov SVD Sniper Rifle or Dragunov SVU;
`(vii) Fabrique National FN/FAL, FN/LAR, or FNC;
`(viii) Hi-Point Carbine;
`(ix) HK-91, HK-93, HK-94, or HK-PSG-1;
`(x) Kel-Tec Sub Rifle;
`(xi) M1 Carbine;
`(xii) Saiga;
`(xiii) SAR-8, SAR-4800;
`(xiv) SKS with detachable magazine;
`(xv) SLG 95;
`(xvi) SLR 95 or 96;
`(xvii) Steyr AUG;
`(xviii) Sturm, Ruger Mini-14;
`(xix) Tavor;
`(xx) Thompson 1927, Thompson M1, or Thompson 1927 Commando; or
`(xxi) Uzi, Galil and Uzi Sporter, Galil Sporter, or Galil Sniper Rifle (Galatz).
`(B) The following pistols or copies or duplicates thereof:
`(i) Calico M-110;
`(ii) MAC-10, MAC-11, or MPA3;
`(iii) Olympic Arms OA;
`(iv) TEC-9, TEC-DC9, TEC-22 Scorpion, or AB-10; or
`(v) Uzi.
`(C) The following shotguns or copies or duplicates thereof:
`(i) Armscor 30 BG;
`(ii) SPAS 12 or LAW 12;
`(iii) Striker 12; or
`(iv) Streetsweeper.
`(D) A semiautomatic rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine, and that has--
`(i) a folding or telescoping stock;
`(ii) a threaded barrel;
`(iii) a pistol grip;
`(iv) a forward grip; or
`(v) a barrel shroud.
`(E)(i) Except as provided in clause (ii), a semiautomatic rifle that has a fixed magazine with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
`(ii) Clause (i) shall not apply to an attached tubular device designed to accept, and capable of operating only with, .22 caliber rimfire ammunition.
`(F) A semiautomatic pistol that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine, and has--
`(i) a second pistol grip;
`(ii) a threaded barrel;
`(iii) a barrel shroud; or
`(iv) the capacity to accept a detachable magazine at a location outside of the pistol grip.
`(G) A semiautomatic pistol with a fixed magazine that has the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
`(H) A semiautomatic shotgun that has--
`(i) a folding or telescoping stock;
`(ii) a pistol grip;
`(iii) the ability to accept a detachable magazine; or
`(iv) a fixed magazine capacity of more than 5 rounds.
`(I) A shotgun with a revolving cylinder.
`(J) A frame or receiver that is identical to, or based substantially on the frame or receiver of, a firearm described in any of subparagraphs (A) through (I) or (L).
`(K) A conversion kit.
`(L) A semiautomatic rifle or shotgun originally designed for military or law enforcement use, or a firearm based on the design of such a firearm, that is not particularly suitable for sporting purposes, as determined by the Attorney General. In making the determination, there shall be a rebuttable presumption that a firearm procured for use by the United States military or any Federal law enforcement agency is not particularly suitable for sporting purposes, and a firearm shall not be determined to be particularly suitable for sporting purposes solely because the firearm is suitable for use in a sporting event.'.
Take note of the wording IF anyone who favors 'sensible gun restrictions cares enough to read it....
If you guys are actually educated in guns. You will noticed some of the wording in there. This ban will include MANY, and I mean MANY hand guns, shotguns, and hunting rifles. It is complete BULL****! For the ones who say Obama will not take away your guns. Look at his voting record. Simple as that.
Obama will do a fine job in protecting our second ammendment rights. I also hunt small game and own my necessary sporting and protection equiptment and did not even for a moment fear voting in Obama. I will continue to own weapons as long as I live in this fine country.
please let me know when the 2nd Amendment is about hunting?
Because it already happened with the Clinton regime and this time they expanded and "impoved" on it.Read for yourself and see that their definition can include just about any type they desire including antiques.But they won't tell you that.....oh no.Take a special look at (L)
CREDIT TO OZ FROM SC FOR ORIGINALLY POSTING THIS
This is HR 1022:
The term `semiautomatic assault weapon' means any of the following:
`(A) The following rifles or copies or duplicates thereof:
AK, AKM, AKS, AK-47, AK-74, ARM, MAK90, Misr, NHM 90, NHM 91, SA 85, SA 93, VEPR;
`(ii) AR-10;
`(iii) AR-15, Bushmaster XM15, Armalite M15, or Olympic Arms PCR;
`(iv) AR70;
`(v) Calico Liberty;
`(vi) Dragunov SVD Sniper Rifle or Dragunov SVU;
`(vii) Fabrique National FN/FAL, FN/LAR, or FNC;
`(viii) Hi-Point Carbine;
`(ix) HK-91, HK-93, HK-94, or HK-PSG-1;
`(x) Kel-Tec Sub Rifle;
`(xi) M1 Carbine;
`(xii) Saiga;
`(xiii) SAR-8, SAR-4800;
`(xiv) SKS with detachable magazine;
`(xv) SLG 95;
`(xvi) SLR 95 or 96;
`(xvii) Steyr AUG;
`(xviii) Sturm, Ruger Mini-14;
`(xix) Tavor;
`(xx) Thompson 1927, Thompson M1, or Thompson 1927 Commando; or
`(xxi) Uzi, Galil and Uzi Sporter, Galil Sporter, or Galil Sniper Rifle (Galatz).
`(B) The following pistols or copies or duplicates thereof:
`(i) Calico M-110;
`(ii) MAC-10, MAC-11, or MPA3;
`(iii) Olympic Arms OA;
`(iv) TEC-9, TEC-DC9, TEC-22 Scorpion, or AB-10; or
`(v) Uzi.
`(C) The following shotguns or copies or duplicates thereof:
`(i) Armscor 30 BG;
`(ii) SPAS 12 or LAW 12;
`(iii) Striker 12; or
`(iv) Streetsweeper.
`(D) A semiautomatic rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine, and that has--
`(i) a folding or telescoping stock;
`(ii) a threaded barrel;
`(iii) a pistol grip;
`(iv) a forward grip; or
`(v) a barrel shroud.
`(E)(i) Except as provided in clause (ii), a semiautomatic rifle that has a fixed magazine with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
`(ii) Clause (i) shall not apply to an attached tubular device designed to accept, and capable of operating only with, .22 caliber rimfire ammunition.
`(F) A semiautomatic pistol that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine, and has--
`(i) a second pistol grip;
`(ii) a threaded barrel;
`(iii) a barrel shroud; or
`(iv) the capacity to accept a detachable magazine at a location outside of the pistol grip.
`(G) A semiautomatic pistol with a fixed magazine that has the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
`(H) A semiautomatic shotgun that has--
`(i) a folding or telescoping stock;
`(ii) a pistol grip;
`(iii) the ability to accept a detachable magazine; or
`(iv) a fixed magazine capacity of more than 5 rounds.
`(I) A shotgun with a revolving cylinder.
`(J) A frame or receiver that is identical to, or based substantially on the frame or receiver of, a firearm described in any of subparagraphs (A) through (I) or (L).
`(K) A conversion kit.
`(L) A semiautomatic rifle or shotgun originally designed for military or law enforcement use, or a firearm based on the design of such a firearm, that is not particularly suitable for sporting purposes, as determined by the Attorney General. In making the determination, there shall be a rebuttable presumption that a firearm procured for use by the United States military or any Federal law enforcement agency is not particularly suitable for sporting purposes, and a firearm shall not be determined to be particularly suitable for sporting purposes solely because the firearm is suitable for use in a sporting event.'.
Take note of the wording IF anyone who favors 'sensible gun restrictions cares enough to read it....
this listing here does not even count the 600+ firearms that are actually listed on the bill.
heck, even black powder rifles are now assault rifles according to liberals.
what a joke you liberals are, liberals do not even know the meaning of what a true assault rifle is, they prefer to just go on keeping people scared and uninformed.
Besides, we are much more cooperative as complacent sheep...agitating the herd only makes them harder to manage.
I am not a sheep, and the goverment could not do much about 20 million angry gun owners if the got riled up and refused to follow unconstitutional bans.
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