No Marriage for everyone! (McCain, accuse, suspect, death)

[Bass&Catfish2008]

JMHO,

Arizona Sunset dominated this thread with thoughtful argumentation, which was by far the most objective and leaned least towards hate/malicious speech. Well done Arizona Sunset.

I am mystified why the Mods have not already moved this thread to the political and/or the philosophy & religion board....but there ya go.

[arizona sunset]

Originally Posted by Andy16

What difference does it make if its two people of the same sex or a man and woman. I think that this whole issue has been blown way out of proportion. People have been gay since the dawn of time, get the f$#@ over it. quite frankly, people who write this s$@# make me sick. You tarnish the word America and all its conjugations. You need to get over yourself and grow up. America is free and people can really do whatever they want. If they break the law, they will be punnished. Further more, why do you care, does it affect your life?

Well, it is obvious that you didn't find it relevant to indulge yourself in the rest of the discussion. You simply read one post that you didn't agree with, infered many things about the poster (me), and totally dismissed everything else. Maybe if you had continued reading beyond one of the first posts on page one, you would find that I am indeed "over myself", and that I am "grown up". For someone that obviously doesn't want anyone making generalizations about the topic at hand, you sure felt it more than ok to do the same to me. Pathetic.

Like I have said in previous posts, on this thread and others, personally, although I do not understand homosexuality and my religous views stronlgy discourage it, I have little to no problem with gay marriage. Why? Because, unlike what you believe, I do love and care deeply for America. Because I love this country so much, I am able to look past preferences that I find distastful, in order to see that the constitution and our Founding Fathers would have wanted. My gosh, I grew up in LA! Homosexuality was being accepted there, long before Middle America, or even the East Coast, really started seeing higher homo popluations. I've been "asked out" several time by gay men. Although it was fairly shocking, and more than a ltitle uncomfortable, I was polite, and simply said that I was "straight" and wasn't interested. I have many life long friends that are gay, and several extended family members that are as well. So, yes, homosexuality has been "affecting" my life since childhood. Thanks for asking though in a nice tone.

I believe in gay marriage because I love America. But I also believe in equality for all! It is not "blowing it out of proportion" to believe that people that wish to practice polygamy are in the wrong either. It is not also to hard to believe that there are lots of people that want, and justify incest legally, under the same reasoning that homosexuals are now. What about all of them? With people like Anthony Romera in the world that are now defending known child rapists and murderers, the legalization of gay marriage would change things in all spectrums of society. I only ask, do we really want to leave that world for our children? But if you had actually educated youself on this topic, and read more than a few sentences, you might already be enlightened to that fact!

[StuckPA]

I don't think people should get married,but for other reasons

[gv0928]

That's pretty noble of you.

[moonshadow]

Originally Posted by StuckPA

I don't think people should get married,but for other reasons

Yeah, I'm pretty happy to oblige the OP and not get married myself.

Actually if there's anyone out there, GLBT that would like my personal right to get married, I'd gladly donate it to you.

[danco]

Have the first Gay divorces started rolling in yet ?

Yeah I agree everyone should have the right... to be sexed
by a lawyer.

Can a gay mormon be married to more than two cousins ?

[arizona sunset]

Originally Posted by danco

Have the first Gay divorces started rolling in yet ?

Yeah I agree everyone should have the right... to be sexed
by a lawyer.

Can a gay mormon be married to more than two cousins ?

I don't know. But I would imagine that for the governing bodies that allowed for it in the first place, homosexuals would also have the right to divorce. If we are going to define them under the same legal terms as a "straight" couple, why couldn't they? I think they have fought for it, for so long, that we probably won't be seeing actual widespread gay divorces for some time to come.

In regards to the last part of your post the answer is simply no. Legally you can be gay (but not married), you can be Mormon, but you cannot be married to more than one person, and you cannot be married to a relative as close as a first cousin. (Although some states have com very close to the latter.) However, like homosexuality, while it cannot be found within the bonds of a legal marriage, polygamy can exist. The "world" would just see it as a glorified affair where the first wife/husband, was open to the idea of it. In fact, the studies that I have seen, actually show that most people that practice polygamy, do it outside of a religious construct.

In a religious sense though, the answer is still no. First off, from what I understand about the LDS church, they are strongly against gay marriage. Now does that mean that you are excommunicated for being "gay"? No. In fact, (and this is just my understanding) the LDS church actually sees homosexuals as essentially, more elite spirits, since they came to this Earth, with a temptation that goes against the very foundation of what Mormons believe is the only true church. In others words, "being gay" is not a sin in their eyes. However, acting on those desires is, and breaks, on several levels, what they call the Law of Chasity. This can mean big-time consequences not only in this life, but in the world to come. That is why Mormons consider homosexuals as "elite". Not only are they allowed to be tempted to a higher degree than practicing hetersexuals are, but they are also asked to put aside those feelings in order to obtain exaltation. In my understanding, Mormon's do not believe that a man or a woman can enter into the Celestial Kingdom without being legally married, AND being sealed as an eternal family within the confines of the temple. In other words, they see putting aside ones sexuality as far more worth it in the end. (I hope I got that all right?) As I stated before, the LDS church also has swift retribtution for those that engage in incest or polygamy. I am not totally sure on the offical content of the FLDS teachings in regards to this though.

So no; being a gay (nonpracticing) Mormon, is neither legally against the law, and has no affect on church membership.

[ScranBarre]

Originally Posted by miamiman

Gay marriage is not a right.

Neither is heterosexual marriage.

[sto1986]

Gay marriage would not be a big issue, if people didn't get special rights for being married. If people didn't receive tax breaks, hospital visitation, shared insurance, inheritance rights, etc. when they got married, I don't think it would be an issue. Obviously, married people do receive special rights.

The status of marriage in this country is ridiculous anyways, people who of the opposite sex can get married, even if they don't know each other and get divorced months later, but a gay couple that has been together for thirty years can't get married in most of the United States and in most of the world. However, many countries in Europe do allow gay marriage. Countries in the European Union have to recognize gay rights. Even Canada allows gay marriage. To be one of the most powerful nations in the world it seems odd that can't even achieve equal rights for all Americans. Beyond marriage, most states don't even have domestic partnerships or civil unions. Some states don't even acknowledge LGBT in anti-discriminatory laws. Which means that it isn't illegal for gay people to get fired for being gay in certain places.

I don't think that incest, pedophilia, or even polygamy is even on the same page as gay marriage. Gay marriage like heterosexual marriage is between two consenting adults, just two.

I don't think that gay marriage will harm family or traditional marriage at all. Heterosexuals are good enough at doing that on their own. If anything, by allowing gay people to get marriaged, it seems like it would promote the idea of family, by promoting healthy relationships between two people. It would promote American economy; by encouraging people to get married, that's encouraging joint incomes legally.

[NintendoTogepi]

Originally Posted by arizona sunset

Face it. You can't possibly justify gay marriage, without justiying the others I mentioned too. No matter how you try to gain support for your cause, you are also doing the same for the others.
Not really. It's a whole different scale. Two consenting adults who are not related. How does that get stretched to "multiple consenting adults", "one consenting adult and a child" "a consenting adult and a dog?".

I don't care if gay men and woman are "biology" attracted to the same gender. (By the way, scientists have yet to prove that. Heck, I have a likeness and preferences for apples, but that doesn't mean that I couldn't like and oranges. That is not say though that you have to like oranges!) The fact of the matter is, hetero's have way more appeal to humanity as a whole, considering that we are the ones that, through our "biology" (your definition of it), perpetuate the human race forward. Sure, if the whole world went homo, humanity could still exist. I do not argue that! But if you were one to trully believe in Darwinism, that could not be. Namely because we would not evolve to exterminate our own race. That goes against the most basic of all basic instincts of being a human!!!
Actually, homosexuality was useful in evolution. They did not have kids, and so they could gather food, take care of others etc. Very useful, infact.

I trully believe that men can sodomize other men, and find it to be a great time. I don't understand it, but that is more than likely why I'm hetero. I trully do believe that it comes right down to the whole "I have a preference for oranges over apples" kind of thing. (And no, I'm not calling gays fruits!) I'm not a homphobe. I'm just a realist that knows that once we give an inch to the homosexual populations, other groups will take it the whole way! So how come in other countries where gays have been given the right to marriage, none of these wackos have come in and done all these weird laws.

You cannot deny that simple fact! Look at what liberals have done with abortion. You give an inch, and you get the whole nine yards!

Again you keep contradicting yourself very badly.