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Mrbob, I don't know if you're old enough to remember, but, I recall the 70's, long gas lines, gas shortages, and the introduction of fuel efficient vehicles by toyota, etc.., and it seemed the big 3 were on track, in making fuel efficient vehicles, but, somewhere, that idea fell off the wagon like a loose wheel. where did these ideas go? I sort of blame the automakers for not continuing the production of vehicles that sip gas. since fuel is now so expensive (but not at the moment) people are looking for fuel effficient cars and trucks, because they can't afford the big guzzlers. flash back to the 70's, per say.
in a way, the execs of the big 3 may be to blame for their recent cries for help, by not having research done to downsize. their ideas of downsizing is cutting benefits for autoworkers, and trying to earn concessions with unions, but, that's no excuse for the way they have acted recently, flying corporate jets when commercial flights will do. how about they begin putting on their pants like the rest of us do? and quit thinking that they themselves are luxury items? pretty foolish people, aren't they? if a beggar drove up next to me in his new mercedes and asked me for a handout, I would assume he weren't serious about asking for money, or, needing it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrbob
The sad facts are that the Big-3 cannot survive long-term unless certain changes occur:
a) Top management has to go
b) Strict CAFE fuel efficiency standards have to be accepted in return for a bailout
c) The UAW contracts have to be renegotiated, or don't bother with a bailout - because they will eventually go belly-up. The Big-3 have a significant cost-disadvantage when compared to the foreign implants building cars here in the U.S. - and that is a big part of the reason why they cannot compete.
In 2010 GM will shift it's retiree health care benefit costs to the union - per an agreement last year - but more than that is required. Things like the work-pool - where workers can get 95% of their pay for 2-years during layoffs either have to be eliminated - or the companies should go thru a Chapter 11 bankruptcy - with Governenment support and guarantees to make the public willing to continue to buy their cars.
Sounds harsh, but even during the 70's, I was in awe at how much the UAW was demanding from the car companies - they just went way overboard - and should come back down to reality before a chapter 11 filing shreds their contracts to pieces.
Thats one of the problems with this bail out as it is it includes the CEOs salary of tens of milliions and perhaps the extra 10 million bonus at Christmas time which they dont talk about.
Dems are for the bail out but are you for working,paying taxes for those CEOs? As it is its part of the bail out.
I am for the bail out myself but every CEO replaced NOT A PENNY for any of them . Without real big changes its a bail out lie .
someone trying to hijack a thread, turning it into a left-right issue, for shame, for shame.
but it is a left vs right issue as most Reps are against the bail out and rightfully so because for us to work and pay taxes for these unreal salaries is a tragic. Most Dems are for it .
Small businesses go out of business by the drones yearly they employ more people that these corps but no bail out for them .
We will be a society where tax money no longer goes for social services,infastructure,etc it will go for corporate bail outs and who is kidding who we will never see that money again.
Bail out might be needed but the way it seems planned now with CEOs on the payroll its money thrown away . OUR money thrown away.
CEOs of large corprations fly on private jets. They just do. I guess I am the only one in the world who shrugs at this one.
You can fire them if you wish but car sales for ya'lls paragons of greatness Toyota is down 23% and Honda down 25%. At these rates all lose. Sales of the big 3 have to be near death now since no one will buy a car without a warranty.
Really congress has to vote on something. They need to either unequivocally kill them now or give them the bailout. There is no point in bleeding more. BTW watch for 20% unemployment in MI, 14% in OH... Be careful what you wish for. You just might get it.
this thread is about CEO's of the big3 flying jets around the country while their corporations are going belly up. it's not a left-right issue (thread). it's about people using corporate jets while commercial airliners would work. if my company is going belly up, I would think twice about turning the key on something wasteful.
the bailout itself might be a left-right issue, but corporate waste is about CEO's who think nothing of laying off workers, or cutting worker benefits to propogate their futures. WHAT IS THIS? GOD SAVE THE EXECS?
There is another thread that deals with the "BAILOUT"
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luiso
but it is a left vs right issue as most Reps are against the bail out and rightfully so because for us to work and pay taxes for these unreal salaries is a tragic. Most Dems are for it .
Small businesses go out of business by the drones yearly they employ more people that these corps but no bail out for them .
We will be a society where tax money no longer goes for social services,infastructure,etc it will go for corporate bail outs and who is kidding who we will never see that money again.
Bail out might be needed but the way it seems planned now with CEOs on the payroll its money thrown away . OUR money thrown away.
If I'm driving a brand new caddy, and can afford luxuries, would it be correct or right to come to a taxpayer and ask for more big cars, furs and jewels?
and everyone of them should be fired...this isn't JUST the auto makers CEO's but the concept all over the country...it's time they get paid a reasonable salary, they aren't even putting their life on the line like football players...they are greedy and full of themselves...and it's time All CEO's learn to work for a living.
CEOs of large corprations fly on private jets. They just do. I guess I am the only one in the world who shrugs at this one.
You can fire them if you wish but car sales for ya'lls paragons of greatness Toyota is down 23% and Honda down 25%. At these rates all lose. Sales of the big 3 have to be near death now since no one will buy a car without a warranty.
Really congress has to vote on something. They need to either unequivocally kill them now or give them the bailout. There is no point in bleeding more. BTW watch for 20% unemployment in MI, 14% in OH... Be careful what you wish for. You just might get it.
yeah, but it's like the CEO's were told yesterday...Congress fears giving them the money, and having them make the same mistakes as they've made in the past 25 years. I don't believe anyone is aware just how incompetent, these men are...they hire consultants to tell them how to do their jobs, and do nothing really, other then show up at meetings...I don't believe America is aware of the corporate money that is wasted on do nothings in our world today?
Years and years ago when my dad was working for a huge World wide company in Europe, he had to travel all over the world. When the company wasn't doing so well they told the people who traveled a lot that they had to travel economy class instead of business class. My dad never complained about having to sit in economy class since he was happy that he still had a job he liked.
Than the company told the workers they had to stay in cheaper hotels and eat in less expensive restaurants, still my dad never complained and he always told us that this was the best thing to do since it would keep other at work as well and they really didn't need the expensive dinners and luxurious hotels. I never once heard him complain! We learned a lot growing up and having to spend less in our family and I'm telling my kids about it and we make sure we live below our means so we won't get in financial trouble.
The 3 CEO's should at least have traveled business class which would have cost them $ 840.- to get there instead of $ 20,000 to get to Washington. It would have showed they cared and they would do everything to help out them self. But no they can't scale down.....
This is only the talk about their flights, can you imagine what their hotel bills, incl. spa's, massages, drinks, etc. will cost?
Let the union guarantee the auto makers with the UAW pension funds and sell it as employee ownership.
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