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Old 01-05-2009, 03:02 PM
 
2,742 posts, read 7,478,303 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost View Post
Metabolism, I see. Two problems with that opinion:
- Do you consider metabolism to be a cause or a result?
- Do you acknowledge metabolism in sperm and ovum, hence consider them as living while also dismantling the notion that life begins at conception?
Is not an opinion, is how science defines it, in this case biology, the science that study life.
Sperm doesnt have actual metabolism, they have stores of ATP, because they can produce it, and it doesnt reproduce, ovum have non.
So sperm nor ovum are real life.
Metabolism is both the cause and the result.

 
Old 01-05-2009, 06:31 PM
 
Location: SW Missouri
15,853 posts, read 35,037,286 times
Reputation: 22693
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjma79 View Post
Respiration is one method, but not the only one.
Plenty of living things dont have respiratory system.
Again, do you know the meaning of anaerobe??
Here you have it:
Anaerobe is any organism that doesnt require oxygen. Some of them actually die in the presence of oxygen.
Lack of respiration is not lack of metabolism.
It is clear you didnt study.
Who said anything about oxygen? It does not have to be oxygen - it can be anything. There is no life in a vacuum. Why? Because there is NOTHING TO BREATHE (oxygen or anything else). It is the breathing that is the key here - not WHAT is breathed.

20yrsinBranson
 
Old 01-05-2009, 06:35 PM
 
Location: New Mexico
8,396 posts, read 9,417,025 times
Reputation: 4070
Quote:
Originally Posted by msconnie73 View Post
No ... Abortion is against God's will as it violates the commandment of thou shall not kill. God has given us free will to make our own choices but there are consequences when we choose to do things that violate His commandments.
You sound confused.

If God made man in his image, and God kills untold millions each year through miscarriages, shouldn't man follow God's example?
 
Old 01-05-2009, 08:32 PM
 
Location: The Chatterdome in La La Land, CaliFUNia
39,031 posts, read 22,965,228 times
Reputation: 36026
Quote:
Originally Posted by skoro View Post
You sound confused.

If God made man in his image, and God kills untold millions each year through miscarriages, shouldn't man follow God's example?
God made it clear through His commandments to not kill, period.
 
Old 01-05-2009, 08:38 PM
 
Location: SW Missouri
15,853 posts, read 35,037,286 times
Reputation: 22693
Quote:
Originally Posted by msconnie73 View Post
God made it clear through His commandments to not kill, period.
Oh goodness, don't get started with THAT one. Next think you know we'll all be trying to define KILL! lol

20yrsinBranson
 
Old 01-05-2009, 08:52 PM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,736,999 times
Reputation: 12341
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjma79 View Post
Is not an opinion, is how science defines it, in this case biology, the science that study life.
Sperm doesnt have actual metabolism, they have stores of ATP, because they can produce it, and it doesnt reproduce, ovum have non.
So sperm nor ovum are real life.
Metabolism is both the cause and the result.
I could do without the science you believe in, so it remains an opinion. Having said that, are you now telling me that there is an actual and a fake metabolism? I'm assuming you use the former to define life, while the latter doesn't matter.

Where does sperm get the ATP if not from metabolism? May I also assume that you believe sperm is "not alive" and just "dead" matter (chemical)?
 
Old 01-05-2009, 10:26 PM
 
29,939 posts, read 39,365,169 times
Reputation: 4798
Quote:
Originally Posted by 20yrsinBranson View Post
Who said anything about oxygen? It does not have to be oxygen - it can be anything. There is no life in a vacuum. Why? Because there is NOTHING TO BREATHE (oxygen or anything else). It is the breathing that is the key here - not WHAT is breathed.

20yrsinBranson
Really....how do you suppose 4 billion years ago we went from no atmosphere to one full of oxygen.... here is a hint.... it was something living that formed all the oxygen me and you know today....and not until they did that through a very large number of preconditions that have already happened was life in the form of trees and such were allowed to start the cycle of life we use today to survive.
 
Old 01-06-2009, 09:32 AM
 
Location: SW Missouri
15,853 posts, read 35,037,286 times
Reputation: 22693
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJon3475 View Post
Really....how do you suppose 4 billion years ago we went from no atmosphere to one full of oxygen.... here is a hint.... it was something living that formed all the oxygen me and you know today....and not until they did that through a very large number of preconditions that have already happened was life in the form of trees and such were allowed to start the cycle of life we use today to survive.
No one. Not you, not me, not ANYBODY knows what happened umpteen billion years ago when this planet was formed and life "occurred" (for lack of a better term). You cannot have a rational argument based upon that kind of theory and conjecture. There is no way to prove what came first, life or oxygen or any thing else.

20yrsinBranson
 
Old 01-06-2009, 10:38 AM
 
Location: New Mexico
8,396 posts, read 9,417,025 times
Reputation: 4070
Quote:
Originally Posted by msconnie73 View Post
God made it clear through His commandments to not kill, period.

Yet, through his own actions, God makes killing a divine example.
 
Old 01-06-2009, 10:57 AM
 
29,939 posts, read 39,365,169 times
Reputation: 4798
Quote:
Originally Posted by 20yrsinBranson View Post
No one. Not you, not me, not ANYBODY knows what happened umpteen billion years ago when this planet was formed and life "occurred" (for lack of a better term). You cannot have a rational argument based upon that kind of theory and conjecture. There is no way to prove what came first, life or oxygen or any thing else.

20yrsinBranson

Earth History Summary

Each number represents 100 million years. So 50 would be 5000 million, or 5 billion years ago, 49 would be 4900 million, or 4.9 billion years ago, and so on.

35 The origin of life. The microspheres eventually evolved into very simple cells. The earliest fossils we have found were formed at this time. These fossils are of very simple single celled organisms called bacteria that could feed on chemicals in the water around them. They could not use sunlight to make their own food. This means they were "heterotrophs", meaning they eat their food, rather than producing their food. They got their energy by converting food, such as sugar, into other substances, such as alcohol (this process is called fermentation), just as wine making microorganisms do today in the airless environment of wine bottles. These cells were "prokaryotic", which means that they had no nucleus inside of the cell. Bacteria are still prokaryotic cells today, three and a half billion years later!
34 The oceans are full of prokaryotic bacteria that do not use sunlight to make food. They did not use oxygen. Oxygen was a poison to them, and there was little or no oxygen in the earth's atmosphere.
25 Photosynthesis evolved. This is perhaps the greatest step in the evolution of life. Photosynthesis is life's ability to absorb sunlight and use the energy from it to make food from the carbon dioxide in the atmosphere. Organisms that can make their own food are called heterotrophic. The oceans very quickly filled up with bacteria that could perform photosynthesis (called cyanobacteria, or blue-green bacteria). One of the waste products of photosynthesis is oxygen. This is when the atmosphere first started to fill up with oxygen.
24 The oceans were filled with photosynthesizing bacteria, which were producing oxygen. Oxygen was becoming more abundant all the time.
20 Respiration evolved. Enough oxygen had built up that organisms evolved which could not only tolerate it, but use it as an important resource. Organisms evolved that could use oxygen to help convert food into energy. This process is called respiration (remember, fermentation is the process of converting food into energy without using oxygen).
19 Same. The oceans quickly filled up with organisms that could use oxygen to make energy.
18 Eukaryotic cells evolved. This is another of the "really big" steps in the evolution of life. Until this point, all organisms were bacteria that were prokaryotic (without a nucleus). It is thought that there were different types of these prokaryotic bacteria living together, one inside of the other, helping each other survive (this is called symbiosis). Eventually, they lived together so long that they lost the ability to live apart. The ones that lived inside the others became mitochondria. Mitochondria are the parts inside of all eukaryotic cells where respiration takes place (respiration is using oxygen and food to make energy). It is thought that other cell parts evolved in the same way, from partnerships between large and small bacteria. Cells that have these smaller parts inside of them are called eukaryotic. These first eukaryotic cells were the basis for all plant cells, animal cells, fungi cells, and protoctista cells. Animals would never have evolved at all without eukaryotic cells.
17 Same. Single celled eukaryotic organisms of all types evolved and filled up the oceans.




It was either the History channel or Natgeo just had a 4 hour special on earths formation might be interesting to you. It goes through the hundreds of steps that were required in succession for life as we know it today to have happened.
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