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Old 01-14-2009, 03:52 PM
 
Location: Santa Monica
4,708 posts, read 7,716,781 times
Reputation: 1029

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Let there be no doubt in anyone's mind.

Guantanamo Detainee Was Tortured, Says Official Overseeing Military Trials

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The interrogation, portions of which have been previously described by other news organizations, including The Washington Post, was so intense that Qahtani had to be hospitalized twice at Guantanamo with bradycardia, a condition in which the heart rate falls below 60 beats a minute and which in extreme cases can lead to heart failure and death. At one point Qahtani's heart rate dropped to 35 beats per minute, the record shows.
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Tortured Reasoning: About Us: vanityfair.com

Last edited by ParkTwain; 01-14-2009 at 04:06 PM..
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Old 01-14-2009, 05:46 PM
 
2,190 posts, read 6,940,399 times
Reputation: 1287
Their defense was the people administering the "aggression" (as they'd never admit touture) were not directed to be THAT aggressive...

I'm for the majority of methods used for suspected terrorists...True terrorists want to kill as many of us as possible and do not care about their own life...What I have a problem with is that methods that qualifies a person as a suspected terrorist...Yet, there's no solution...
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Old 01-14-2009, 06:17 PM
 
4,406 posts, read 5,467,715 times
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Name one "true" terrorist as intimated by TheJagMan. Anyone? Everyone who resorts to acts of terror has an agenda and that agenda is to make a situation better, to right a wrong. The number of people who kill for the sheer joy of it is very small, exaggerated by the ridiculous "entertainment" from Hollywood that makes everyone with dark hair and a beard a bad person. These terrorists are the boogeymen of our minds, the ones our government claims are behind every curtain.

People who resort to terrorist activities are created when all hope has been dashed. They lose respect for their life and those of others. This occurs when their country is invaded and their family is killed in front of them, they themselves are tortured by people who don't speak their language, the business interests of foreign countries erase whatever means they have to get ahead and provide for their family, etc. When the situation is so hopeless that the only way out is to forgo your humanity, you resort to terrorist activities. What others don't seem to recognize or acknowledge is the rage such situations cause. How would you react to such conditions? How would you react if your nation or area had been subjected to these things for decades? I doubt very much you'd be a model citizen.

America has resorted to torture. That is NEVER acceptable. America's moral compass has ceased to exist. It attacks gay marriage and pregnant teenagers but allows its government to detain and torture innocent people and actually pays good money to go to the theater to see Saw V.

The solutions are so numerous and so simple but no one wants to be "big" and admit they're wrong. No one wants to give up the fight because it's too much fun, it's too powerful a force to reject. We love war, we love aggression, we love bombs, we love weapons. We don't know sh&t about peace.
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Old 01-14-2009, 06:19 PM
 
Location: Idaho Falls
5,027 posts, read 5,539,416 times
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Thanks to Bush - we're now a country that tortures. Right up there with the worst countries in the world.
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Old 01-14-2009, 06:33 PM
 
Location: The Woods
16,955 posts, read 22,268,498 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by idahogie View Post
Thanks to Bush - we're now a country that tortures. Right up there with the worst countries in the world.
Don't worry, several Western countries (Germany for instance) took part in the CIA run secret flights bringing people to other countries to be tortured. All it proves is nothing has changed, governments have little to no respect for anyone's rights except on paper (and that's not a good thing). I don't foresee too much changing under the new administration, except it'll be done in different locations and less publicly known. This stuff has happened under every administration for decades now to varying degrees.
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Old 01-14-2009, 06:46 PM
 
Location: Santa Monica
4,708 posts, read 7,716,781 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
This stuff has happened under every administration for decades now to varying degrees.
As "spy vs. spy" maybe. But not as part of the criminal justice system! As per usual, Cheney and the Neo-Cons took their distorted beliefs way too far over the line. They are the TRUE BELIEVERS! Heil!

These last eight years are the closest America has come to fascism in my 50 year lifetime. Kinda like Mussolini crossed with the Marlboro Man.

Last edited by ParkTwain; 01-14-2009 at 07:00 PM..
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Old 01-14-2009, 06:57 PM
 
Location: Seattle
500 posts, read 822,294 times
Reputation: 182
The greatest American military leaders of all time have said torture doesn't work. Then the bumbling Bush boy with a peanut brain that lied, er, I mean used faulty intelligence over 900 times leading up to the occupation of Iraq says that it works and the right wing eats it up.
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Old 01-14-2009, 07:00 PM
 
Location: The Woods
16,955 posts, read 22,268,498 times
Reputation: 9066
Quote:
Originally Posted by ParkTwain View Post
As "spy vs. spy" maybe. But not as part of the criminal justice system! As per usual, Cheney and the Neo-Cons took their distorted beliefs way too far over the line. They are the TRUE BELIEVERS! Heil!

These last eight years are the closest America has come to fascism in my 50 year lifetime.
They've simply been more open about it. Lots of torture, etc. has happened and deliberately kept out of the eyes of the justice system.
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Old 01-14-2009, 07:04 PM
 
Location: Santa Monica
4,708 posts, read 7,716,781 times
Reputation: 1029
Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
They've simply been more open about it. Lots of torture, etc. has happened and deliberately kept out of the eyes of the justice system.

So I guess you're saying that what Bush/Cheney did compares to the Gay Rights Revolution? What the civilized in society previously considered despicable is now seen to be acceptable, even normal. It was only a matter of gaining political approval for the activities by opening the activities up to public view in the form of new social and political institutions! Military and intelligence community torturers out of the closet! At last! hahahaha
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Old 01-14-2009, 07:10 PM
 
Location: Idaho Falls
5,027 posts, read 5,539,416 times
Reputation: 1479
Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
Don't worry, several Western countries (Germany for instance) took part in the CIA run secret flights bringing people to other countries to be tortured. All it proves is nothing has changed, governments have little to no respect for anyone's rights except on paper (and that's not a good thing). I don't foresee too much changing under the new administration, except it'll be done in different locations and less publicly known. This stuff has happened under every administration for decades now to varying degrees.
"The United States government has always engaged in war crimes and human rights violations. What's different this decade is that, under the leadership of a terrible president, our elites have become vociferous advocates of the goodness and rightness of war crimes and human rights violations."
Jim Henley
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