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I think if Lincoln were resurrected today he would be shocked by many of societies tolerances such as interracial marriage, women's suffrage and gay marriage. Society's awakening from racism, sexism, etc has taken another 150 years since honest Abe took office and we all don't exactly love each other and share fairly yet. I do think Abe would have simply written the law for emancipation if he thought society could withstand it, but being a pragmatic pol he knew it was not possible so he had to be coy. Reading his speeches and debates clearly shows this.
However, if Abe lived to this day and absorbed the knowledge as society progressed, I think he would have been a women's libber and a gay rights activist ahead of society. Being pragmatic though, he would have known the world needed to change slowly.
Abe would certainly have not emancipated the slaves if Fort Sumpter had never been fired upon. Abe wanted legislation, not war. I'm not sure that his conduct of the Civil War was the right decision. Perhaps he should have let the South go and thus save 700 thousand precious lives. I'm not sure the Union was worth that. It could always have been renegotiated.
Abe and JFK, along with Jefferson, TDR, FDR, Jackson and Reagan had one thing in common. They all knew the real bad guys were the bankers and they dared challenge them. TJ of course defeated the Bank of England, and AJ defeated the Bank of the United States. Lincoln printed greenbacks, TDR shoved his fist in JP Morgan's face. JFK wrote and executive order to dissolve the Fed and was killed three months later. Reagan investigated the fed and was shot the day after his report came out.
JFK didn't botch the Bay of Pigs, the CIA did. The whole thing was based on the notion that the Cubans didn't support Fidel, but they did. Plus they failed to keep it secret, it was in the Miami Herald. It was already botched, Kennedy just didn't help. he should have just scrapped it altogether as he was advised. Note the Bay of Pigs operation was officially called Operation Zapata. George HW Bush's oil company was called Zapata Offshore and had a platform conveniently located 40 miles off the Cuban coast.
100 years ago, the red states were blue, the blue states red. Lincoln would immediately disassociate himself from the Republican Party, which bears no resemblance to the goals put forth by Lincoln.
It's 2009 and how many blacks feel represented by the Republican party in this country?
And today's Democratic Party bears very little resemblance to the Democratic Party of JFK.
Civil rights are not even the same as they were then.
I ask: Would JFK be in the current Democrat Party? NO!
Oooops!
Didn't know this was addressed.
If Lincoln were today's democrat, he would have let the racist, lowlife, brainwashed Jesus freak red states secede.
Abe Lincoln would not have wanted to be associated with the party of Robert KKK Byrd and the Democrats that voted against civil rights in the 1960's (ex. Al Gore Sr.). Byrd filibustered the civil rights bill of 1964 for 14 hours. Lincoln was the first Republican president and would be a Republican today...
The GOP doesn't have much use for fiscal conservatives anymore - the prevailing trend in the GOP seems to be social conservatism combined with fiscal liberalism - i.e. people like Mike Huckabee and Sarah Palin - they used to refer to people with those beliefs as Dixiecrats and the GOP wanted nothing to do with such people. If fiscal conservatism meant anything to the GOP Ron Paul (who is a fiscal conservative and social moderate) wouldn't have been shunned like he was.
JFK today would still be a Dem if he was alive - he wouldn't be in the most liberal wing of the party but he'd fit comfortably in the center of the party, e.g. the Joe Biden types.
At least the Republicans still pay lip service to conservative ideas, if that count for anything.
It seems odd hearing Republicans refer to Abraham Lincoln as their president even though they don't really honor President Lincoln. When the GOP went after the Southerner "racist" vote during Nixon they knew these former-Democrats hated Lincoln but that they hated blacks & gays even more. Frankly, I want to vomit when somebody like Bush speaks of Lincoln as a great Republican even though the 2 presidents have absolutely nothing in common.
Would Abraham Lincoln be proud of the Republican party of today? NO!
Nope, but he wouldn't be proud of a democrat either. The prominent politicians of BOTH parties are of the same cloth. Bush is a liberal Socialistic in nature with no regard whatsoever for individual rights & freedoms. The things that, more than any other let us become the greatest country on Earth. Sadly Obama is even worse. His focus is on reduction of liberty, with Bush it was a side effect.
Its funny to hear about the racism in the Rep party, as if the Democrats arent oozing it from their pores throughout history. Racism doesn't recognize political affiliation & historically the Democrats have worked harder to keep people of color down than the Republicans ever could.
And today's Democratic Party bears very little resemblance to the Democratic Party of JFK.
Civil rights are not even the same as they were then.
I ask: Would JFK be in the current Democrat Party? NO!
Nope, but he wouldn't be proud of a democrat either. The prominent politicians of BOTH parties are of the same cloth. Bush is a liberal Socialistic in nature with no regard whatsoever for individual rights & freedoms. The things that, more than any other let us become the greatest country on Earth. Sadly Obama is even worse. His focus is on reduction of liberty, with Bush it was a side effect.
Its funny to hear about the racism in the Rep party, as if the Democrats arent oozing it from their pores throughout history. Racism doesn't recognize political affiliation & historically the Democrats have worked harder to keep people of color down than the Republicans ever could.
They're still working on keeping minorities down. After trillions spent on liberal welfare programs, blacks are worse off now than they were 50 years ago. Democrats NEED blacks to struggling, so that Dems can keep scaring them with the Republican boogyman every 2 years at election time. If blacks actually started succeeding on their own, they might start to become well to do and, *GASP* vote Republican...can't have that.
Actually, as crazy as it sounds, Lincoln probably would still be a Republican in today's world.
Ever since the Republican party broke away as a separate entity in the 1850's, it had always been the less popular party of wealthy businessmen and their patrons. They lost initially, but Lincoln offered 'change' they were all looking for. It would seem to me that the party relies on whatever support they get, back then it was 'progressives' and abolitionists.
Interestingly enough, Lincoln had close ties to a lot of wealthy Northern robber barons, and an especially close tie with the railroad companies. The Civil War caused the individuals that owned such companies to become extremely wealthy in a short period of time. With the South no longer importing from Europe in the post war years, the North had an effective monopoly.
Lincoln's intentions were never to free the slaves; sure he pandered to the abolitionist for their votes, but his plan was not all that radical. His idea was more or less getting rid of slaves over a period of 20 years or so, easing the South off slavery instead of the sudden stop that would equate to economic turmoil.
Honest Abe was just another politician, and I don't think that a divide nation was the 'change' his voters were looking for. Never the less, if Lincoln were here today he would probably be quite pissed off at how crappy both parties have gotten, and how low some folks are willing to go in order to win...
Ah, yes, very convincing. I was kinda sitting on the fence here...then you came along with this and, well, you've made me a believer.
Thanks.
JFK certainly wouldn't be a NeoCON if that clears it up enough for ya!
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