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Old 01-20-2009, 10:14 PM
 
1,117 posts, read 1,786,975 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ovcatto View Post
What a ludicrous argument.
I will definitely read anybody's counterviews, but you really need to give me more than, "What a ludicrous argument". Please back up your statement with some sort of rational debate.
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Old 01-20-2009, 10:18 PM
 
Location: USA
2,362 posts, read 2,574,015 times
Reputation: 1854
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerCaliforniaGirl View Post
Please explain to me what your idea of the correct view of racism is.

With the majority of Americans NOT being racist, that pretty much means it's over. Of course there will always be a small minority of biggots no matter where you go. But allowing the minority opinion of a few to justify your claim that racism still has a foothold in America, is illogical.
What the hell is a correct view of racism? Is that like, I don't know? Not being a racist?

First you said racism was over. Now you're conceding that it's not. Make up your mind.
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Old 01-20-2009, 10:19 PM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
30,492 posts, read 20,139,651 times
Reputation: 8396
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerCaliforniaGirl View Post
I'm sincere in my support of Obama (after all, I voted for him). He's moved way over to the middle since he was elected, and I think that he's a breath of fresh air for this country.

That's a given. But the point of this post is to ALSO suggest that Obama's presidency might just impact the "blame game" that Black-Americans have played for far too long now.

I sure hope you're correct because I am so tired of being blamed for the short-comings of blacks simply because I was born white. Plus it is so obvious when the black girl at Burger King can't make change that the reason she isn't making it isn't white male oppression. I'm a little more sceptically about Obama's election changing things though. Blacks will still fail to achieve because they are told in subtle ways that they will never be as smart as whites and Asians, So why bother to study? I expect they'll just take the Affirmative Action and continue to blame whites. It's convenient and risk free. So why give it up?
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Old 01-20-2009, 10:19 PM
 
9,334 posts, read 19,478,748 times
Reputation: 4442
I'm trying to understand.. you are happy he is president because black people will stop blaming their race for their failures? Thats it??? Thats how I interpreted your opening post.


Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerCaliforniaGirl View Post
Finally, a Black man holds the position of most powerful and influential man in the world. I wish him the absolute best, and I give him my whole-hearted support (I even voted for him, even though I'm a registered Repuplican).

While I don't think he's going to be able to enact all the "change" he promised in his campaign, I do believe that he will have a major impact on this country, simply for doing nothing more than being voted President.

Why?

Because after Americans ended slavery, enacted Civil Rights, de-segregated our schools, and enacted affirmative action, MANY Blacks are STILL blaming slavery and discrimination for their failures. But now Americans have voted a Black man (well, half-Black, anyway) as our President. And it will be interesting if Black-Americans can FINALLY recognize and acknowledge that the American people of today are not the slave-owners, racists and xenophobes of yesterday.

So any blame for failure among Black-Americans to succeed, from now on has to be placed where it belongs...with Black Americans. No more excuses. No more scapegoats.
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Old 01-20-2009, 10:27 PM
 
1,117 posts, read 1,786,975 times
Reputation: 967
Quote:
Originally Posted by Perkins Well View Post
What the hell is a correct view of racism? Is that like, I don't know? Not being a racist?

First you said racism was over. Now you're conceding that it's not. Make up your mind.
You accused me of not having a correct view on racism. So now I'm asking you what the correct view is. It's that simple.

Racism, as a governing and moral philosophy (which it was in the U.S. for two centuries), when it dictated U.S. policy, legislation, social norms, etc., is over. And that is a fact, period. We no longer tell Blacks that they cannot sit on the bus, or eat in certain restaurants, or go to certain schools, or hold certain positions. We no longer condone lynchings and hate crimes. Civil rights in the U.S. are for ALL people, regardless of race.

If you're trying to say that racism has any real hold in the U.S. based on a few smatterings of biggots out there, then I respectfully disagree with you. That's like saying that Leprosy is once again a pandemic in the U.S. because there were a few hundred cases last year.

Please try to distinguish between "racism" as a governing philosopy, and "racism" as a way of thinking for a hateful, misguided minority. When I say racism in the U.S. is over, I'm referring to the first definition in this paragraph.

So, if you're trying to say that racism is alive and well today because a Black person might be denied a job because the head of Human Resources is a biggot and throws the application in the trash, well hey...that could happen. But it also happens to women, gays, lesbians, obese persons, senior citizens, handicapped people, and probably other commonly discriminated against groups of people that I can't think of right now. Those people are discriminated against every day in this country. But they don't have any race card to play. And as far as I'm concerned, Blacks don't either. Not anymore.

Last edited by FormerCaliforniaGirl; 01-20-2009 at 10:45 PM..
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Old 01-20-2009, 10:31 PM
 
4,247 posts, read 9,377,326 times
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Sorry OP, but what you say is suspect. I suspect you hold racial views on some level.
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Old 01-20-2009, 10:36 PM
 
919 posts, read 1,705,291 times
Reputation: 478
I wont try speak for FCG. I for one am fedup with hearing how all the wrong done 400 years ago I owe something for. or that the last 50yrs dont count for much. and not just from blacks. (Im part indian) Get off my butt, I accept everybody as equal. and that includes my right to dislike any person I so choose. I think this country is going to start hearing more of this from everybody. get over it all folks and move on with your life, I did.
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Old 01-21-2009, 12:24 AM
 
Location: Imaginary Figment
11,456 posts, read 12,739,325 times
Reputation: 4760
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerCaliforniaGirl View Post

So any blame for failure among Black-Americans to succeed, from now on has to be placed where it belongs...with Black Americans. No more excuses. No more scapegoats.
You're assuming we accept your ridiculous assertion that all blacks make excuses, and use scapegoats for their lack of success (you of course are the sole barometer for success.)

I find that incredibly arrogant and stupid on your part.
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Old 01-21-2009, 01:03 AM
 
1,149 posts, read 5,249,458 times
Reputation: 590
The guy is very different in background from African-Americans. His mother is white and I wonder how she feels his son is called black all the time as it served an interest.

Anyway, racism and ethnocentrism shouldn't have a place in the truly global society of the future.
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Old 01-21-2009, 01:06 AM
 
24 posts, read 153,160 times
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I think Affirmative Action is used by blacks and whites as an excuse. I am personally tired of hearing from white people that that a black person got the job because of affirmative action. Could that person have been the best for the job? Could the white person have been lazy or not qualified? On the flip side, I hate when black people use affirmative action as a reason to complain when they don't get the job (I'm going to sue because they don't have any blacks so I should have gotten the job).

Yes racism is alive and well-on both ends of the spectrum- but it is often used too much as an excuse for personal shortcomings and we all should suck it up and do the best we can to be successful.

I doubt seriously that affirmative action had anything to do with the Obama election and I hope that this will have a broader effect on how we perceive equality here in the US and people will be inspired to be the best they can be.
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