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Old 01-25-2009, 05:23 PM
 
Location: Palm Springs, CA
25,256 posts, read 14,958,842 times
Reputation: 6467
Quote:
Originally Posted by melinuxfool View Post
I think don't ask, don't tell is fine.

The military is for the defense of our nation, if you want to express your sexuality, perhaps you need to consider an alternate career.

I don't understand why people have a problem with don't ask, don't tell. Why do people feel the need to talk about their sexuality at all? It's a private matter that is nobody's business but your own, so keep it at home!
You're clueless. Honestly.

When hetero soldiers are at risk of losing their jobs for mentioning their wives and girlfriends, then I'll agree with you. Until then, Don't Ask Don't Tell is discriminatory and needs to be abolished.

If the hetero male soldiers are so tough, surely they can handle another soldier saying that he or she is gay.
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Old 01-25-2009, 05:25 PM
 
Location: San Antonio, TX
384 posts, read 363,553 times
Reputation: 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by marmac View Post
Bill Clinton didn't accomplish allowing open gays in the military.
Neither will Obama accomplish that.
2010. It will happen.

Obama aide: Ending 'don't ask, don't tell' must wait - CNN.com
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Old 01-25-2009, 05:27 PM
 
Location: Palm Springs, CA
25,256 posts, read 14,958,842 times
Reputation: 6467
Quote:
Originally Posted by marmac View Post
Bill Clinton didn't accomplish allowing open gays in the military.
Neither will Obama accomplish that.
Based on what?
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Old 01-25-2009, 05:30 PM
 
Location: San Antonio, TX
384 posts, read 363,553 times
Reputation: 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
We have had homosexuals in the military since before the revolutionary war.

DADT has nothing to do with homosexuals being in, or getting thrown out of the military.

We have a volunteer military. Everyone in service asked to be in service.

But once in, and stationed somewhere 'crappy', kids get bored and want out.

The numbers of 'DADT' kids being booted, means that many volunteered, were trained, reported to a duty station, and then later decided that they did not want to fulfill their commitment.

They told, so they could go home.

It has nothing at all to do with sex.
So your theory is that no one is actually kicked out of the military against their will for being gay? According to you, service members who are gay just happen to get bored and/or not like their assignments and speak up so that they can be discharged?
Am I understanding you correctly?
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Old 01-25-2009, 06:18 PM
 
1,079 posts, read 1,125,039 times
Reputation: 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by boywithstick View Post
So your theory is that no one is actually kicked out of the military against their will for being gay? According to you, service members who are gay just happen to get bored and/or not like their assignments and speak up so that they can be discharged?
Am I understanding you correctly?
Not all of them, but yeah, some soldiers, probably of both persuasions, have used it to get out of the military. Like female soldiers who get pregnant to get out of deployments...obviously not all of them, but it does happen.
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Old 01-25-2009, 07:53 PM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
21,671 posts, read 27,674,785 times
Reputation: 8703
Quote:
Originally Posted by boywithstick View Post
So your theory is that no one is actually kicked out of the military against their will for being gay? According to you, service members who are gay just happen to get bored and/or not like their assignments and speak up so that they can be discharged?
Am I understanding you correctly?
I am a US servicemember.

I have served with homosexuals. Some of them I knew where homosexual. I am certain that there were many others whom I did not know about. So what, they did not violate any laws so who cares? Nobody did, nobody does.

It only becomes an issue when they begin to violate the law.

Or if they bring it up before a superior. Which I have seen done, in order to get a discharge. I have even seen men 'fake' being homosexual, so they could get discharged.

I repeatedly kept getting stationed in Groton. Near the Subase is a homosexual bar, called the 'salty dog'. It has been there since, at least the 70s. Most sailors stationed in Groton know that it is there. But it is off base. what you do off-base and away from the military is your own business. The 'Salty dog' was popular long before DADT.



In the past 100 years has someone been kicked out of the US Navy for being a homosexual when they did not want out?

Sure, that is likely. But what were they kicked out for? They committed a felony. They performed an act which they knew was illegal.

And not only that but they perfromed this illegal act in a manner where they got themselves caught doing it.

So, to answer your question.

Yes, they got kicked out because they wanted to get kicked out.

They knew what they were doing and they did it.



Committing a felony is not about a thought. It is about an action.

Walk off base, and they were all free to do whatever.

But commit a felony on-base, where folks will caught you in the act, and then act surprised? No I do not buy that.
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Old 01-25-2009, 08:09 PM
 
Location: Not far from Fairbanks, AK
12,955 posts, read 13,927,062 times
Reputation: 8327
Quote:
Originally Posted by chielgirl View Post
Brush aside the rights of those who serve?
How archaic.
It wasn't too long ago that women weren't allowed in the military.
It wasn't too long ago that blacks and asians were segregated in the military.

You can't catch being gay.
If they're willing to give their lives for their country, why not respect the people that they are.

So long as straights talk about their relationships and have photos on their desks and get special benefits for those they love, and these things are denied others who are willing to serve their country, then there exists no justice and what we say we are fighting for is a lie.
-Women have always been allowed in the military. Some were nurses, secretaries, etc. Some of them were flyers in WWII. But it's true that women were not allowed in the trenches at the front line (combat).

-Segregation existed throughout the US, not just in the military.

The point is not "giving their lives for their country," but instead force other military members to accept another form of sexuality against their will, just like has been tried with The Boy Scouts Of America, which translates to destroying both institutions.

Nobody is denying homosexuals serving their country. They can serve under the present rules. Advertise their sexuality, and they are kicked out. Those are the rules.

Straights are not trying to force you to accept them as the norm.
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Old 01-25-2009, 08:38 PM
 
Location: Indiana
2,047 posts, read 667,117 times
Reputation: 391
Gays in the military is a disaster waiting to happend.men and weman have saperate sleeping quarters.So are we giong to have to provide three more seperate quarters,one for gay men,one for gay weman and one for bis.this is rediculous.I am from mexico and when I came to this country I was thought in school that majority rules,yet I see 299.99 million people bending over back ward for .01 percent of the people. Where am I DID I cross a river,OR AN OCEAN.iS THIS THE U.S.A.or france.
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Old 01-25-2009, 09:39 PM
 
Location: Pensacola, Fl
656 posts, read 616,313 times
Reputation: 366
Quote:
Originally Posted by gysmo View Post
Gays in the military is a disaster waiting to happend.men and weman have saperate sleeping quarters.So are we giong to have to provide three more seperate quarters,one for gay men,one for gay weman and one for bis.this is rediculous.I am from mexico and when I came to this country I was thought in school that majority rules,yet I see 299.99 million people bending over back ward for .01 percent of the people. Where am I DID I cross a river,OR AN OCEAN.iS THIS THE U.S.A.or france.

Majority rules until the majority infringes upon the rights of the minority. This is repeated in the case of blacks, mexicans, asians, and [insert oppressed group, or minority here]. If gays aren't allowed to be open about their homosexuality, then neither should heterosexuals. Gays shouldn't have to sit and listen about a heterosexual's sex life, kids, wives, and etc., all the while not being able to talk about their life outside the military in the fear of their homosexuality being found out because they might live with their boyfriend who has decided to adopt, or they can't talk about the struggles of their relationships and what not for the simple fact that they are gay/lesbian/bisexual. I don't know why people who are against gays in the military always go for the argument that gays will somehow start raping, hiting on, and sexual harrass others just because they won't get discharged for the simple fact of being gay; please realize that the offenses I mentioned can get a person discharged, REGARDLESS of their sexuality. Gays are people just like you and me, with feelings just like you and me, with desires just like you and me; there are in no way inherently different because of their sexuality. They are not one eyed aliens who are here to push there "homosexual lifestyle" (which is a load of sh*t btw) on us and are not trying to hit on every person of the same sex that they see. Quite frankly I'm tired of seeing the bullsh*t on this board acting as if gays are going to be the end of [insert institution, religion, or any other thing you can think here] just because of their sexuality. Sexuality does not decide the content of someone's character, it is the decisions and actions of a person that does. I will respect, support, and admire a man or woman who fights diligently and faithfully for our country, willing to put their life on the line, REGARDLESS of their sexuality.

Rant off.
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Old 01-25-2009, 09:55 PM
 
Location: Palm Springs, CA
25,256 posts, read 14,958,842 times
Reputation: 6467
Quote:
Originally Posted by RayinAK View Post
Nobody is denying homosexuals serving their country. They can serve under the present rules. Advertise their sexuality, and they are kicked out. Those are the rules.
And the rules will be changing in the near future. Rules have a way of doing that from time to time.
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