U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 02-10-2009, 12:54 PM
 
Location: Southern NH
2,490 posts, read 4,794,504 times
Reputation: 1668

Advertisements

Are these elements of the bill solid needed investments that will boost the economy and add jobs or are they "pork"?

http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$50 million for the National Endowment for the Art (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$380 million in the Senate bill for the Women, Infants and Children program (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$300 million for grants to combat violence against women (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$2 billion for federal child-care block grants (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$6 billion for university building projects (ok)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$15 billion for boosting Pell Grant college scholarships (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$4 billion for job-training programs, including $1.2 billion for “youths” up to the age of 24 (ok)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$1 billion for community-development block grants (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$4.2 billion for “neighborhood stabilization activities” (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$650 million for digital-TV coupons; $90 million to educate “vulnerable populations” (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$150 million for he Smithsonian (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$34 million to renovate the Department of Commerce headquarters (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$500 million for improvement projects for National Institutes of Health facilities (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$44 million for repairs to Department of Agriculture headquarters (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$350 million for Agriculture Department computers (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$88 million to help move the Public Health Service into a new building (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$448 million for constructing a new Homeland Security Department headquarters (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$600 million to convert the federal auto fleet to hybrids (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$450 million for NASA (carve-out for “climate-research missions”) (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$600 million for NOAA (carve-out for “climate modeling”) (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$1 billion for the Census Bureau (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$89 billion for Medicaid (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$30 billion for COBRA insurance extension(pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$36 billion for expanded unemployment benefits (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$20 billion for food stamps (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$4.5 billion for U.S. Army Corps of Engineers (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$850 million for Amtrak (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$87 million for a polar icebreaking ship (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$1.7 billion for the National Park System (ok)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$55 million for Historic Preservation Fund (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$7.6 billion for “rural community advancement programs” (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$150 million for agricultural-commodity purchases (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$150 million for “producers of livestock, honeybees, and farm-raised fish” (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$2 billion for renewable-energy research ($400 million for global-warming research) (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$2 billion for a “clean coal” power plant in Illinois (ok)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$6.2 billion for the Weatherization Assistance Program (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$3.5 billion for energy-efficiency and conservation block grants (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$3.4 billion for the State Energy Program (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$200 million for state and local electric-transport projects (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$300 million for energy-efficient-appliance rebate programs (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$400 million for hybrid cars for state and local governments (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$1 billion for the manufacturing of advanced batteries (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$1.5 billion for green-technology loan guarantees (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$8 billion for innovative-technology loan-guarantee program (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$2.4 billion for carbon-capture demonstration projects (pork)
http://article.nationalreview.com/images/bullet_blue.gif (broken link)$4.5 billion for electricity grid (pork)

50 De-Stimulating Facts by Stephen Spruiell & Kevin Williamson on National Review Online=
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 02-10-2009, 01:03 PM
 
4,047 posts, read 4,377,436 times
Reputation: 1321
Pork means it is only to benefit a few people as a reciprocity for their campaign funds or other support. Things that benefit the nation as a whole or large geographical locations are not pork. The point of the stimulus is to stimulate. Do you have a better way to stimulate the economy than spend on things that will not only create jobs short-term, but will also create long-term benefits with much needed modernizations to U.S. infrastructure, education, etc.?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-10-2009, 01:08 PM
 
Location: Southern NH
2,490 posts, read 4,794,504 times
Reputation: 1668
The alternative is a 6 months Federal income tax holiday, March 1 to October 31. That is a more efficient and wiser way for the money to get into the economy.....

Pork to me is wasteful government spending. I don't care where it goes. If wasteful spending benefits my state, I am not happy about it, as it will surely benefit the other 49 states (with no benefit to me) until that same Fed spending comes back to benefit my state again. Waste is waste...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-10-2009, 01:12 PM
 
4,669 posts, read 3,906,481 times
Reputation: 409
Quote:
Originally Posted by seamusnh View Post
The alternative is a 6 months Federal income tax holiday, March 1 to October 31. That is a more efficient and wiser way for the money to get into the economy.....

That doesn't benefit the obama constituency that doesn't pay taxes, though...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-10-2009, 01:16 PM
 
8,180 posts, read 11,041,525 times
Reputation: 2873
If the point of the stimulus was to create jobs.......I really see very little job creation going on. And really, why are we spending any money at all redecorating/renovating/moving to new headquarters of various federal institutions? Maybe a little job growth in the short term but nothing that will last beyond a few months for a very small percentage of people. Of course beurocrats will be able to enjoy swankier surroundings but I would hardly classify that as vital at this time.
And yes, some of the things in there could even be classified as noble such as the 300 billion going to combat violence against women --- but just how the hell does that stimulate a faltering economy?

My worst fear leading up to this election was that Obama did not learn from the 100 million dollar mistake he made in Chicago. I hope he proves me wrong, but the items included in what is being hyped as a noearmarks, no pork stimulas bill makes me worry.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-10-2009, 01:21 PM
 
4,047 posts, read 4,377,436 times
Reputation: 1321
Quote:
Originally Posted by seamusnh View Post
The alternative is a 6 months Federal income tax holiday, March 1 to October 31. That is a more efficient and wiser way for the money to get into the economy.....
You're alternative will mostly only benefit the rich. A good amount of the taxes come from the rich, as that money is transferred from the general population to the corporations etc. But if most of the money goes to a small amount of the people, there would be much less spending than if it went to more numbers of people (everyone needs to spend money on basics, and everyone has a little project they need done).

But what I fail to see in your plan is: how does it create jobs?
Quote:
Pork to me is wasteful government spending. I don't care where it goes. If wasteful spending benefits my state, I am not happy about it, as it will surely benefit the other 49 states (with no benefit to me) until that same Fed spending comes back to benefit my state again. Waste is waste...
We have a different definition of "waste" I guess... I find it necessary to spend money on education, protecting women and children, communities, our failing transportation system, alternative/efficient energy, etc. There are no corporations with even an ounce of altruism to take care of those things for us just because of a tax break. Watching school levies fail time and again, the general public doesn't seem to want to spend money on those things either. What's wasteful is for the majority of the money to go into the Swiss bank accounts of the richest few who get to keep 100% of what they squeezed from the consumers for 6 months.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-10-2009, 01:24 PM
 
19,216 posts, read 12,476,040 times
Reputation: 2337
I think about 90% of all Government spending is pork.

Probably why the Mid-East religions despise us.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-10-2009, 01:28 PM
 
419 posts, read 528,033 times
Reputation: 82
Thanks for the link
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-10-2009, 01:31 PM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,777 posts, read 24,024,080 times
Reputation: 12105
Quote:
Originally Posted by seamusnh View Post
The alternative is a 6 months Federal income tax holiday, March 1 to October 31. That is a more efficient and wiser way for the money to get into the economy.....

Pork to me is wasteful government spending. I don't care where it goes. If wasteful spending benefits my state, I am not happy about it, as it will surely benefit the other 49 states (with no benefit to me) until that same Fed spending comes back to benefit my state again. Waste is waste...
And how many jobs does your wiser way promises to kill? At what cost? What are the chances that even 20% of the money the government gives up, comes back into the market? Remember, reduced income is as good as spending, both will have an effect on national debt like all tax cut policies have resulted in.

In fact, a leaked Congressional Research Service document (http://wikileaks.org/leak/crs/R40104.pdf - broken link) advises against tax cuts (especially high/mid income class), and suggests that government spending towards infrastructure (which can come in many forms, BTW, like that "$4.5 billion for electricity grid" thing you believe to be pork (likely because you have been told so). But, when was the last time republicans operated on logic and non-partisan studies designed to help the congress and ultimately the nation?

The misinformation you spew doesn't say much against the recovery package. But it does highlight the understanding, or lack of, in a vast chunk of populace, when it comes to details.

PS. Repeat after me:
$50 million for a Rainforest in Des Moines as demanded by Sen. Chuck Grassley: Pork
$50 million for NEA towards needs of 5.7 million employees as called pork Sen. Chuck Grassley: Not Pork

Yeah, both are "spending", but that doesn't make it pork.

Last edited by EinsteinsGhost; 02-10-2009 at 02:04 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-10-2009, 01:36 PM
 
16,707 posts, read 18,937,200 times
Reputation: 6808
How much of an electric grid do you think 4.5 billion will pay for? Is it significant? No? Then its pork... it is wasteful... if you are going to do it then do it right...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top