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Old 03-19-2009, 11:56 PM
 
27,624 posts, read 21,118,610 times
Reputation: 11095

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Here are a couple of headlines for those who haven't had the time to study both economics and history:

1. There is no such thing as a "free market."

2. The "middle class" is the creation of government intervention in the marketplace, and won't exist without it (as millions of Americans and Europeans are discovering).

The conservative belief in "free markets" is a bit like the Catholic Church's insistence that the Earth was at the center of the Solar System in the Twelfth Century. It's widely believed by those in power, those who challenge it are branded heretics and ridiculed, and it is wrong.

In actual fact, there is no such thing as a "free market." Markets are the creation of government.

Governments provide a stable currency to make markets possible. They provide a legal infrastructure and court systems to enforce the contracts that make markets possible. They provide educated workforces through public education, and those workers show up at their places of business after traveling on public roads, rails, or airways provided by government. Businesses that use the "free market" are protected by police and fire departments provided by government, and send their communications - from phone to fax to internet - over lines that follow public rights-of-way maintained and protected by government.


The rest of the article can be found at this link.

Democracy - Not "The Free Market" - Will Save America's Middle Class
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Old 04-11-2009, 11:25 PM
 
3 posts, read 13,958 times
Reputation: 17
There is something called a class divide in the united states that is required by the economy
in order to keep people working in the meat houses, and factory jobs. Desk jobs
are dream jobs and mark the divide between 'blue collar' and 'white collar'.
To keep corruption out of middle class communities laws construct a kind of
economic war that keeps people in the meat houses working away. Without
the base class that supports the hard 40 hour a week manual labor jobs
there would be no middle class. The upper middle class factory owners
have to pay ****ty wages to the base class and keep them in their place
- because who is there to take their place if they move up the economic
class system? Economic war is necessary Reagan showed us it works
on the national level and of course it works on the individual level,
the level of families and base class communities.

Two tickets in 7 minutes of eachother! That's a bit of an abuse of authorial power.
Are they really that bankrupt and unable to run their own finances that they have
to whiplash their failure upon the everyday resident of arizona?

C'mon its time for Change.

Picasso101
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Old 09-09-2010, 02:36 PM
 
27,624 posts, read 21,118,610 times
Reputation: 11095
This thread needs to be brought to the foreground now more than ever...
http://www.city-data.com/forum/7966689-post1.html
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Old 09-09-2010, 04:46 PM
 
6,084 posts, read 6,041,562 times
Reputation: 1916
Quote:
Originally Posted by sickofnyc View Post
This thread needs to be brought to the foreground now more than ever...
http://www.city-data.com/forum/7966689-post1.html
Yes indeed my friend, it definitely does.
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Old 09-09-2010, 04:51 PM
 
Location: Columbus
4,877 posts, read 4,506,282 times
Reputation: 1450
Quote:
Originally Posted by sickofnyc View Post
Here are a couple of headlines for those who haven't had the time to study both economics and history:

1. There is no such thing as a "free market."

2. The "middle class" is the creation of government intervention in the marketplace, and won't exist without it (as millions of Americans and Europeans are discovering).

The conservative belief in "free markets" is a bit like the Catholic Church's insistence that the Earth was at the center of the Solar System in the Twelfth Century. It's widely believed by those in power, those who challenge it are branded heretics and ridiculed, and it is wrong.

In actual fact, there is no such thing as a "free market." Markets are the creation of government.

Governments provide a stable currency to make markets possible. They provide a legal infrastructure and court systems to enforce the contracts that make markets possible. They provide educated workforces through public education, and those workers show up at their places of business after traveling on public roads, rails, or airways provided by government. Businesses that use the "free market" are protected by police and fire departments provided by government, and send their communications - from phone to fax to internet - over lines that follow public rights-of-way maintained and protected by government.

The rest of the article can be found at this link.

Democracy - Not "The Free Market" - Will Save America's Middle Class
The problem with all this is that the free market has provided all of this stuff. And at a cheaper cost with better results.

And the middle class was clearly created by the private sector. To suggest otherwise is plain ignorant.

Last edited by OhioIstheBest; 09-09-2010 at 05:06 PM..
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Old 09-09-2010, 06:07 PM
 
5,719 posts, read 6,446,033 times
Reputation: 3647
Absolutely right. A natural, unregulated free market naturally leads to a small elite class and a large have-not class. I would say to any ex-factory worker, "The free market is what exported your job to Asia." Protectionism and wealth redistribution, so called "socialist" policies, benefit everyone except the super rich.
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Old 09-09-2010, 06:13 PM
 
Location: Columbus
4,877 posts, read 4,506,282 times
Reputation: 1450
Quote:
Originally Posted by juppiter View Post
Absolutely right. A natural, unregulated free market naturally leads to a small elite class and a large have-not class. I would say to any ex-factory worker, "The free market is what exported your job to Asia." Protectionism and wealth redistribution, so called "socialist" policies, benefit everyone except the super rich.
A natural, unregulated free market lead to the agricultaral revolution, the industrial revolution and the internet revolution. And about a gazillion other things that have been beneficial to mankind.

Government gave us WW1, WW2, Vietnam, The Cultural Revolution, The Ukranian Hunger Famine and about a gazillion other senseless deaths.
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Old 09-09-2010, 06:23 PM
 
6,084 posts, read 6,041,562 times
Reputation: 1916
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioIstheBest View Post
A natural, unregulated free market lead to the agricultaral revolution, the industrial revolution and the internet revolution. And about a gazillion other things that have been beneficial to mankind.

Government gave us WW1, WW2, Vietnam, The Cultural Revolution, The Ukranian Hunger Famine and about a gazillion other senseless deaths.
You're the self proclaimed anarchist, are you not?

You'd probably enjoy the carnage and anarchy of brutal, savage war.

Or are you a coach potato anarchist that has yet to really roughed it?

Not surprisingly, you are flat out wrong (how recently has it been since you resurfaced from your bunker), especially about the internet because it is well known that DARPA and other government institutes had a major influence in developing it.
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Old 09-09-2010, 06:43 PM
 
Location: Columbus
4,877 posts, read 4,506,282 times
Reputation: 1450
Quote:
Originally Posted by kovert View Post
You're the self proclaimed anarchist, are you not?

You'd probably enjoy the carnage and anarchy of brutal, savage war.

Or are you a coach potato anarchist that has yet to really roughed it?

Not surprisingly, you are flat out wrong (how recently has it been since you resurfaced from your bunker), especially about the internet because it is well known that DARPA and other government institutes had a major influence in developing it.
Instead of answering my question or telling me differing ideas you make baseless acussations?

Anarchism has nothing to do with brutal, savage war. That is the job of government. Reference Hitler, Mao, Stalin, Rwanda, Somolia etc..

The World Wide Web was developed by the private sector, thank you very much. So was the agricultural revolution and industrial revolution.

P.S. You might want to research anarchism before you make you nonsensical claims. It's one thing to disagree. It's another to display ignorance.
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Old 09-09-2010, 06:51 PM
 
Location: Columbus
4,877 posts, read 4,506,282 times
Reputation: 1450
Quote:
Originally Posted by sickofnyc View Post
Here are a couple of headlines for those who haven't had the time to study both economics and history:

1. There is no such thing as a "free market."

2. The "middle class" is the creation of government intervention in the marketplace, and won't exist without it (as millions of Americans and Europeans are discovering).

The conservative belief in "free markets" is a bit like the Catholic Church's insistence that the Earth was at the center of the Solar System in the Twelfth Century. It's widely believed by those in power, those who challenge it are branded heretics and ridiculed, and it is wrong.

In actual fact, there is no such thing as a "free market." Markets are the creation of government.

Governments provide a stable currency to make markets possible. They provide a legal infrastructure and court systems to enforce the contracts that make markets possible. They provide educated workforces through public education, and those workers show up at their places of business after traveling on public roads, rails, or airways provided by government. Businesses that use the "free market" are protected by police and fire departments provided by government, and send their communications - from phone to fax to internet - over lines that follow public rights-of-way maintained and protected by government.

The rest of the article can be found at this link.

Democracy - Not "The Free Market" - Will Save America's Middle Class
During a recent interview with journalist Jeffrey Goldberg of The Atlantic, Cuban strongman emeritus Fidel Castro issued a surprising statement about the communist nation’s economy: "The Cuban model doesn't even work for us anymore."

LOLs.
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