U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 1.5 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Jump to a detailed profile or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Business Search - 14 Million verified businesses
Search for:  near: 
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 03-27-2009, 01:57 PM
 
Location: Houston (Memorial) and Western NC
8,981 posts, read 15,681,311 times
Reputation: 4120

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
Many of the immigrant populations in the past did not learn English until the kids went to school. Pretty much the same with first generation Hispanic immigrants, legal or not. Why shouldn't a President attempt to talk with all the citizens? Why should he ignore a population just because they do not speak the dominant language? I do not think he should and I encourage him to speak in Spanish when it is appropriate.
I'm sorry I live in Texas. They don't LEARN Spanish when their kids go to school. They USE their kids to translate for them. They live in communities that totally enable them not to learn one word in English. You don't have those in NH.

Whole sections of the city with not a word of English to be found on shops, bill boards, food products or street signs. Freeway signs that flash in Spanish........we enable them.

Past generations HAD to learn English to get a job and past the citizenship test. Now it's given in Spanish, if they even bother to take it at all. Which most of them don't.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 03-27-2009, 02:02 PM
 
7,352 posts, read 6,395,254 times
Reputation: 1854
Quote:
Originally Posted by vicket View Post
To the OP - would you be just as upset if Obama had a sign language interpreter delivering the speech as well?
I think there are plenty of other things to be upset about in this world than someone striving to communicate with everyone.
Not the same thing. If millions of Americans moved to Brazil and demanded that the culture adapt to the English language, through bilingual programs, signage, etc., and demanded political representation based on race, they would rightly be castigated as ethnocentric and/or racist. Hispanics do it, and somehow it's okay. No, it is not okay. To pretend that the people of the United States--which is already absorbing millions of people who were neither invited nor welcomed, and which has made many concessions on their behalf--are somehow mean and racist because they wish not to have their culture torn from them is myopic. Because if you would defend Hispanic culture from the ethnocentric and racist colonialism of white culture, then you have no grounds not to defend American culture against racist political agendas which seek to push Americans and American culture out of the way in order to install Hispanic culture in its place. Hispanics are not the only immigrants in the United States. They need a smackdown. They want to speak Spanish? They can--like my family--speak their native language in their home and among their friends. But they do not have the right to impose their cultural holidays or language on the rest of Americans. Appalling behavior. It is, in fact, nothing less than colonialist. To pretend otherwise is to engage in a weird form of cultural racism--fully excusing in one group of people what you would condemn in another.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2009, 02:44 PM
 
Location: Houston, TX
1,418 posts, read 1,217,963 times
Reputation: 1473
Quote:
Originally Posted by MovingForward View Post
Not the same thing. If millions of Americans moved to Brazil and demanded that the culture adapt to the English language, through bilingual programs, signage, etc., and demanded political representation based on race, they would rightly be castigated as ethnocentric and/or racist. Hispanics do it, and somehow it's okay. No, it is not okay. To pretend that the people of the United States--which is already absorbing millions of people who were neither invited nor welcomed, and which has made many concessions on their behalf--are somehow mean and racist because they wish not to have their culture torn from them is myopic. Because if you would defend Hispanic culture from the ethnocentric and racist colonialism of white culture, then you have no grounds not to defend American culture against racist political agendas which seek to push Americans and American culture out of the way in order to install Hispanic culture in its place. Hispanics are not the only immigrants in the United States. They need a smackdown. They want to speak Spanish? They can--like my family--speak their native language in their home and among their friends. But they do not have the right to impose their cultural holidays or language on the rest of Americans. Appalling behavior. It is, in fact, nothing less than colonialist. To pretend otherwise is to engage in a weird form of cultural racism--fully excusing in one group of people what you would condemn in another.
Huh? You mean we don't celebrate St. Patrick's Day in this country?
I don't "fully excuse in one group of people what I would condemn in another". I just think it would be nice if we were not all so quick to get offended by communication.
By the way it's hard to "defend Hispanic culture from the ethnocentric and racist colonialism of white culture" since there is no such thing as "white culture". White is a mix of a lot of things...sometimes including HISPANIC.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2009, 02:49 PM
 
Location: Up in the air
19,126 posts, read 15,190,247 times
Reputation: 15785
Maybe I'm just bitter because I can speak 3 other languages besides english, and yet I'm still not considered bi-lingual because I don't speak Spanish. Try working at a home improvement store... I constantly got berated for not knowing how to speak spanish FROM spanish speaking people. It was always fun to get 'talked to' by the store manager because he had a complaint from a spanish speaking customer because I didn't know how to speak the language. Bah.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2009, 03:01 PM
 
16,106 posts, read 16,116,997 times
Reputation: 7153
Quote:
Originally Posted by JetJockey View Post
Maybe I'm just bitter because I can speak 3 other languages besides english, and yet I'm still not considered bi-lingual because I don't speak Spanish. Try working at a home improvement store... I constantly got berated for not knowing how to speak spanish FROM spanish speaking people. It was always fun to get 'talked to' by the store manager because he had a complaint from a spanish speaking customer because I didn't know how to speak the language. Bah.
When my son (who's now in college getting a linguistics degree which involves profiency in five different languages) started first grade at a public school (barf; it wasn't long before we put him in a good private school), I assumed that he would be welcome to ride the school bus that stopped near our home. I called the school to find out the bus schedule and was told that the bus was only for "bi-lingual" students; they weren't amused when I told them that he knew quite a bit of Italian and asked if that qualified him to ride on the bus.

So...I had to either rearrange my work schedule--something that not everyone can do, or allow my six year old child to walk almost a mile to school (often in bad weather and through a very high traffic area).

Yes; I know, a lot of people walked 20 miles barefoot through six feet of snow all uphill back in the stone age. The distance wasn't what bothered me; it was the traffic.

And the fact that he was being treated as a second class citizen and not allowed to ride the bus.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2009, 03:05 PM
 
Location: Houston (Memorial) and Western NC
8,981 posts, read 15,681,311 times
Reputation: 4120
I guess bi-lingual students have a transportation disability?

As a taxpayer, I bet you hit the roof.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2009, 03:06 PM
 
16,106 posts, read 16,116,997 times
Reputation: 7153
And...same school...they had a couple of what they called "bi-lingual" classrooms in the elementary school. These classes were taught only in the Spanish language. The school would put about five Enligh speaking students into each classroom. I would have objected had they tried to include my son in that; not because I have anything against children learning different languages but because I would have been concerned that he would not do well in subjects such as math and science et al had he been forced to begin first grade completely immersed in Spanish.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2009, 03:08 PM
 
Location: Houston (Memorial) and Western NC
8,981 posts, read 15,681,311 times
Reputation: 4120
what state is this?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2009, 03:09 PM
 
16,106 posts, read 16,116,997 times
Reputation: 7153
Quote:
Originally Posted by EasilyAmused View Post
I guess bi-lingual students have a transportation disability?

As a taxpayer, I bet you hit the roof.
As a mother, I hit the roof on the few occasions before I got my work schedule straightened out when my son had to walk to school and the Hispanic children were picked up a few feet from their homes.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2009, 03:10 PM
 
16,106 posts, read 16,116,997 times
Reputation: 7153
Quote:
Originally Posted by EasilyAmused View Post
what state is this?
This was in Oregon.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $84,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:05 PM.

2005-2014, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25 - Top