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Old 04-04-2009, 09:42 AM
 
Location: North Cackelacky....in the hills.
19,567 posts, read 21,862,853 times
Reputation: 2519

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Quote:
Originally Posted by JackTheRipper View Post
What do you think the solution would be to get out of this huge debt and this financial crisis?
The answer is simple,we cannot go back to the way we did things,we cannot go back to a society built upon endless and ever expanding credit...we cannot continue to simply borrow and borrow and borrow more money to maintain the system that makes us borrow more....

We have to allow businesses that cannot function to fail,we have to cut spending to the bone,stop maintaining hundreds of thousands of troops around the world,stop being involved overseas,we need to focus TOTALLY on repairing the USA.

Doing the same thing only using more borrowed money makes no sense...if a person did it they wold be called irresponsible,somehow when the fedgov. does it it is saving us.
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Old 04-04-2009, 09:49 AM
 
Location: Reeds Spring, MO
974 posts, read 1,586,760 times
Reputation: 455
very well said oz. I agree completely.
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Old 04-04-2009, 09:49 AM
 
Location: South FL
5,528 posts, read 7,490,456 times
Reputation: 3582
Quote:
Originally Posted by oz in SC View Post
The answer is simple,we cannot go back to the way we did things,we cannot go back to a society built upon endless and ever expanding credit...we cannot continue to simply borrow and borrow and borrow more money to maintain the system that makes us borrow more....

We have to allow businesses that cannot function to fail,we have to cut spending to the bone,stop maintaining hundreds of thousands of troops around the world,stop being involved overseas,we need to focus TOTALLY on repairing the USA.

Doing the same thing only using more borrowed money makes no sense...if a person did it they wold be called irresponsible,somehow when the fedgov. does it it is saving us.
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Old 04-04-2009, 01:17 PM
 
Location: Charleston, WV
3,106 posts, read 7,372,081 times
Reputation: 845
Quote:
Originally Posted by oz in SC View Post
The answer is simple,we cannot go back to the way we did things,we cannot go back to a society built upon endless and ever expanding credit...we cannot continue to simply borrow and borrow and borrow more money to maintain the system that makes us borrow more....

We have to allow businesses that cannot function to fail,we have to cut spending to the bone,stop maintaining hundreds of thousands of troops around the world,stop being involved overseas,we need to focus TOTALLY on repairing the USA.

Doing the same thing only using more borrowed money makes no sense...if a person did it they wold be called irresponsible,somehow when the fedgov. does it it is saving us.
I agree.

Also, if nothing else good comes of this whole mess - perhaps one good thing will....
Perhaps the US citizens will quit being so focused on having more, more, more and it will end the "Me" mentality.

Sad thing is - the proposed plans are laden with more govt freebies and handouts. How about some regs that do not encourage people to avoid working?
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Old 04-04-2009, 03:54 PM
 
11,944 posts, read 14,776,564 times
Reputation: 2772
Quote:
Originally Posted by vec101 View Post
I agree.

Also, if nothing else good comes of this whole mess - perhaps one good thing will....
Perhaps the US citizens will quit being so focused on having more, more, more and it will end the "Me" mentality.

Sad thing is - the proposed plans are laden with more govt freebies and handouts. How about some regs that do not encourage people to avoid working?
1st bold-- we need a better plan, and the right is empty handed because they are beholden to the system of special interests the same way the left is beholden to the system of special interests. We the people need to INSIST that the only special interest that is valid is WE the PEOPLE.

2nd bold-- Your policy must equally apply to those benefiting most from corporatism. What human being is really worth 30 million dollars a year salary? It's a whole lot of BS smoke and mirrors. Their real worth should be determined at the end of the fiscal year company profits the way it would any other humble business owner. Vital word ownership means responsibility is 100%, the good with the bad. There is no risk for these characters for anything they do, there is only schmooze fest good old boy networks voting each other a pay raise based on accounting shell games. This comes at the expense of every shareholder owning stock in that corporation getting diminished dividends, or worse, losing money when share valuations are determined to be negative.

I'm not saying these things because I hate rich people. Some people consider me rich and it's all relative, as you know yourself. I'm saying the way people make money is either honest or it's a legal form of theft. How heavily american law has cultivated corruption- legal theft using the arm of commerce- is the real issue. I am not against capitalism. I am against the tilted market that keeps all rewards disproportionately on the top and simultaneously puts a boot on the head of labor when labor needs a raise. Our government did do that when Reagan & the courts undermined the unions. Those consequences, favoring commerce over labor, has had horrible consequences for capitalist system.
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Old 04-04-2009, 03:57 PM
 
11,944 posts, read 14,776,564 times
Reputation: 2772
Quote:
Originally Posted by oz in SC View Post
The answer is simple,we cannot go back to the way we did things,we cannot go back to a society built upon endless and ever expanding credit...we cannot continue to simply borrow and borrow and borrow more money to maintain the system that makes us borrow more....

We have to allow businesses that cannot function to fail,we have to cut spending to the bone,stop maintaining hundreds of thousands of troops around the world,stop being involved overseas,we need to focus TOTALLY on repairing the USA.

Doing the same thing only using more borrowed money makes no sense...if a person did it they wold be called irresponsible,somehow when the fedgov. does it it is saving us.
The repairing part needs to be expounded upon please. We all can agree that the road we've been on has been wrong on many levels, no matter what people attribute as the primary cause. I want to see an alternative plan for getting america on track. I don't care if you post 50 pages, I will read all of it.
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Old 04-04-2009, 05:56 PM
 
84 posts, read 219,030 times
Reputation: 30
A clear cut solution? It would have to start with ending the privately owned federal reserve bank. They loan money to the US gov @ interest, when our government could print it without them for free. JFK tried to get rid of the Fed by printing US Notes because he realized that if private super rich bankers own the Fed & they loan money to the government, they essentially own the government. The Federal Reserve is the MAJOR reason why this country has declined financially! Woodrow Wilson even stated he "RUINED" his country when signing the fed reserve act in 1913, LOOK IT UP. Congress exercises little to NO oversight over the Fed's activities.

There are three major problems with the events of 1913, 1944, and 1971. The first is that the Fed, the World Bank, and the IMF are allowed to create money out of nothing. This is the primary cause of global inflation. Global inflation devalues our work and our savings by raising the prices of necessities. In 1971, President Richard Nixon signed an executive order declaring that the United States no longer had to redeem its paper dollars for GOLD. With that, the first phase of the takeover of the world banking system and money supply was complete.

In 2008, the world is in economic turmoil. The rich are getting richer, but most people are becoming poorer. Much of this turmoil is directly related to those meetings that took place decades ago. In other words, much of this turmoil is by design. The 12 regional Federal Reserve Banks are owned by the member banks who buy shares in it. Alan Greenspan, the former Chairman of the Federal Reserve, admitted recently ON VIDEO that the Fed operates without Congressional oversight.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L50iTkXbcgg

YouTube - CNBC: Ron Paul's question makes Ben Bernake's voice quiver

YouTube - Ron Paul "Let's End The Fed" Speech - A Historic Moment Feb. 25. 2009

YouTube - Ron Paul on Bloomberg "I see no Purpose for the Federal Reserve..." 03-17-09
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Old 04-04-2009, 06:24 PM
 
Location: Socialist Republik of Amerika
6,205 posts, read 12,858,104 times
Reputation: 1114
THe Nationalism begins.
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Old 04-04-2009, 06:34 PM
 
Location: The Woods
18,356 posts, read 26,481,472 times
Reputation: 11349
Quote:
Originally Posted by freedom View Post
It does matter.
And our currency has been around for more than 40 yrs. so i don't get that part of your point.

Hard assets don't digest very well, and they won't be usefull for very long.

Invest in equipment and assets that will help the whole, and that fulfill our base needs. Getting materials and equipment will not be easy in the near future. Famine is coming to a neighborhood near you.
Not as fiat. The gold standard ended in the 70's. Not 40 years yet...
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Old 04-04-2009, 08:06 PM
 
Location: Socialist Republik of Amerika
6,205 posts, read 12,858,104 times
Reputation: 1114
Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
Not as fiat. The gold standard ended in the 70's. Not 40 years yet...
Fiat is defined to narrow from my pov. Gold is a form of fiat. It is based on faith.

As a commodity Gold has limited industrial use, due to its inflated value, there are much rarer elements than gold, if that is the standard of measuring value. Gold is used as coinage (fiat), and jewelry. It's intrinsic value is one of smoke and mirrors, not life sustenance.
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