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Old 04-18-2009, 09:18 PM
 
69,372 posts, read 55,471,219 times
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Odd that people keep claiming that states can not leave the union and form their own government when the Declaration of Independence very clearly says this right exists..

IN CONGRESS, JULY 4, 1776
The unanimous Declaration of the thirteen united States of America
hen in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government,

Leaving the union is abolishing the US government..
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:22 PM
 
Location: Hoboken
19,891 posts, read 16,311,417 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
Odd that people keep claiming that states can not leave the union and form their own government when the Declaration of Independence very clearly says this right exists..

IN CONGRESS, JULY 4, 1776
The unanimous Declaration of the thirteen united States of America
hen in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government,

Leaving the union is abolishing the US government..
Because it can't. The civil war settled that question.

That Texas Magazine - Articles (http://www.countrystyletx.com/articles/062/062_01.aspx - broken link)
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:29 PM
 
Location: North Cackelacky....in the hills.
19,556 posts, read 19,300,312 times
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Kind of funny that no amendment stating as much was added....
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:31 PM
 
Location: St. Joseph Area
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Well, technically a new government takes charge whenever there's an election--hence the 1st, 2nd, 3rd congresses and so on. So actually we have the ability to "alter or abolish" the government every 2-4 years. It's just that nobody takes advantage of it
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:34 PM
 
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Originally Posted by shorebaby View Post
Because it can't. The civil war settled that question.

That Texas Magazine - Articles (http://www.countrystyletx.com/articles/062/062_01.aspx - broken link)
So your telling me that the Civil War threw out the Declaration of Independence? The document isnt valid anymore? I'm going to need a little more explanation because last I checked, we still use these documents as basis for our governments foundation.
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:36 PM
 
69,372 posts, read 55,471,219 times
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Originally Posted by mackinac81 View Post
Well, technically a new government takes charge whenever there's an election--hence the 1st, 2nd, 3rd congresses and so on. So actually we have the ability to "alter or abolish" the government every 2-4 years. It's just that nobody takes advantage of it
Technically your wrong, if you were correct we would have to issue new debt every 2-4 years.. How wonderful that would be..

We simply hire new CEO's to run the "company", we dont scrap the whole thing and start from scratch..
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:36 PM
 
19,216 posts, read 12,982,827 times
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Originally Posted by oz in SC View Post
Kind of funny that no amendment stating as much was added....
Kind of funny that no Amendment states that American children must be forced into educational compounds and be obedience-drugged either.
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:38 PM
 
69,372 posts, read 55,471,219 times
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Originally Posted by ergohead View Post
Kind of funny that no Amendment states that American children must be forced into educational compounds and be obedience-drugged either.
Agreed, thanks for further supporting where I stand usually on these issues, that the Federal Government has no right to dictate to the states how to operate.
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:40 PM
 
61 posts, read 192,673 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oz in SC View Post
Kind of funny that no amendment stating as much was added....
I also wonder about that.

But Abe Lincoln surmised that succession from "the whole" was entirely contradictory to forming a more perfect "union". Hence the rationale for the Civil War.
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:40 PM
 
Location: Hoboken
19,891 posts, read 16,311,417 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
So your telling me that the Civil War threw out the Declaration of Independence? The document isnt valid anymore? I'm going to need a little more explanation because last I checked, we still use these documents as basis for our governments foundation.

No the Declaration of Independence was talking about getting rid of England. I am not sure but I don't think it is a guide for governance Like the constitution. Also leaving the country wouldn't abolish the government. If Texas left the government would still be intact. When we left England we all left together. And don't forget the consequenses for leaving, a brutal war.
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