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It took me a while to figure out that the people who say you can't be moral without religion are the ones who would be out doing all kinds of crazy things if they didn't believe.
I'd rather be forgiven than moral.
"I had money, women, drugs of choice," he said. "But none of it brings happiness. You'll never find fulfillment in those things. I did it. I was so low. I told God, 'Just kill me, please.'"
I do think there's a genetic predisposition in some to have faith in things they can't confirm, and really, that's okay with me. It's when they believe that others should believe as they do that it crosses the line, in my opinion.
I really don't understand. Is it that some people just can't cope with life on their own?
And then, not only do they use the Bible to guide them through life, they feel a need to use the Bible to pontificate and tell others how they should live.
If you can't figure out how to live your life without an ancient book of fairy tales telling you what to do, then why should anyone follow your lead? It sounds like the blind leading the blind.
If the Golden Rule is "do unto others as you would have them do unto you", I would like to add a second Golden Rule: Live and let live.
Why do some people obsess with other peoples religion? Why do atheists insist on wiping all signs of religion from public view?
I have a rule I would like implemented. If you don't like don't listen. Pretty simple but so hard for some to do.
The golden rule exists in all philosophy (secular or religious) because it's common sense. It's been written time and time again, many times by philosophers who were around before Christianity (or Judaims for that matter) even existed.
The greatest part of faith is that it can't be proven, nor disproven. Here's a question for those who don't understand the Christian faith: Can you show me someone who has truly lived the Christian life that is unhappy at the end of their life?
The issue here is "truly lived." I can guarantee that anyone who "truly lives" and that makes all the difference, will be a happy camper. Again, if you haven't "lived" the Christian life, don't knock it and more importantly, don't knock those that have.
I think the problem that some religious people have with non-religious people such as myself is that they think we are immoral, unethical, or lack any values. Believe it or not (no pun intended), I have no problem with things like the Ten Commandments. A reasonable non-religious person can see that those are generally reasonable 'rules' to live by. Personally, I think that a mortal man developed those rules but because the a-holes he was dealing with at the time wouldn't accept them, he gave them weight by saying God made those rules.
If you don't agree with this possibility, walk into your office or whatever and say, "We need to have ___ done by Friday." They might shrug (unless you're the boss). However, say, "The Boss says we need to have ___ done by Friday" and the job will get done (unless the boss is an a-hole).
Another one I don't have a problem with is the presence of "In God We Trust" on our money or various buildings. Or during the Pledge of Allegiance stating "under God". It is okay!! What is not okay is knocking on my door at 9:00am on Sunday...hello, sleeping !!
With that said, on the flipside of all that is some non-religious people think religious people are wack jobs. Based on my experience, this is only true for a minority of religious people. Most religious people are cool and, in the absence of them telling me they are Christian or whatever, I'd never know it.
Ultimately, the problem is the extremes on both ends of the spectrum have hijacked center stage and making the news.
It takes no faith to reject belief in something there is no proof for.
Repeating it enough times (as I do remember you starting a thread with the same ridiculous argument) doesn't make it true.
No proof of which you are aware. From my point of view, you're the flat-Earther. Unaware people like to dismiss others as being dim-witted, irrational and ignorant. This is because humans need social status and all status is relative. This need to dismiss others is driven by our own personal insecurities and prevents us learning the things others have to share. If you can't point to the books of the Bible that explained the rebirth of the modern state of Israel and its relationship to the events of WW2 thousands of years before the events came to pass, your not ready to make statements like the one above. You're speaking out of ignorance. That you dismiss Bible believers without knowing what they know indicates you are living what Socrates referred to as "..a life not worth living."
I think the problem that some religious people have with non-religious people such as myself is that they think we are immoral, unethical, or lack any values. Believe it or not (no pun intended), I have no problem with things like the Ten Commandments. A reasonable non-religious person can see that those are generally reasonable 'rules' to live by. Personally, I think that a mortal man developed those rules but because the a-holes he was dealing with at the time wouldn't accept them, he gave them weight by saying God made those rules.
If you don't agree with this possibility, walk into your office or whatever and say, "We need to have ___ done by Friday." They might shrug (unless you're the boss). However, say, "The Boss says we need to have ___ done by Friday" and the job will get done (unless the boss is an a-hole).
Another one I don't have a problem with is the presence of "In God We Trust" on our money or various buildings. Or during the Pledge of Allegiance stating "under God". It is okay!! What is not okay is knocking on my door at 9:00am on Sunday...hello, sleeping !!
With that said, on the flipside of all that is some non-religious people think religious people are wack jobs. Based on my experience, this is only true for a minority of religious people. Most religious people are cool and, in the absence of them telling me they are Christian or whatever, I'd never know it.
Ultimately, the problem is the extremes on both ends of the spectrum have hijacked center stage and making the news.
I don't think the non-religious person is necessarily immoral any more than I think a religious person is moral. I think worrying about what others think may be a natural tendency, but it is also a waste of time since most people believe what is convenient for them. What is often convenient is that other people are screwed up but I'm OK. The whole thing is a waste of time. Being moral doesn't mean you're forgiven. Being forgiven means you're forgiven. Jesus is the source for that.
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