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View Poll Results: Where do yoy stand on unions
Support unions in all industries 44 47.83%
Think unions have the time and place but should not be everywhere 20 21.74%
Do not support any union 25 27.17%
could care less 3 3.26%
Voters: 92. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-03-2009, 11:56 AM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
7,090 posts, read 10,737,095 times
Reputation: 4107

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I think it's silly to unionize retail, besides increasing the costs on already slim margins the basic working protection employment protections already given by the government doesn't make sense. It will also take away the incentive to work above the minimum level of service required, since unions are largely based on years of service.

If you have some one who is really very specialized or in a high risk activity that needs protection over the government standards, it makes sense...not for minimum wage slave, little skill service positions. I have worked a number of retail/customer service positions, and I think if it is not a fun job already it is incentive for people to get out of it and move on to bigger and brighter things. If people want more out of life, they need to make it happen.
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Old 06-03-2009, 12:01 PM
 
Location: Tyler, TX
15,202 posts, read 18,209,317 times
Reputation: 8031
Quote:
Originally Posted by DOUBLE H View Post
If management would treat workers right you wouldn't need unions.
Explain to us why we do need unions. They've done their job - effectively and well. We now have the legal framework in place, thanks to the unions, to render them obsolete. They only exist now to get undeserved pay and benefits for their members, and to make their own leadership very wealthy.

Anyone who believes that unions are actually still necessary is a fool. Most of the pro-union people I meet in real life and converse with online are already members of one union or another. Of course they're going to support unions - they'll keep getting them their undeserved raises. Deep down, though, I have to believe that they know that their employers are being bent over by these extortionists. And make no mistake about it - that's exactly what it is: extortion.

The most glaring example I've seen of unions abusing employers is in the entertainment industry. Why does anyone need multiple, overlapping health insurance policies? Why should someone be paid for eight hours of work when they were there less than fifteen minutes? Think about these things the next time you pay an astronomical ticket price for a movie or are complaining about half the TV show being commercials...
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Old 06-03-2009, 12:02 PM
 
3,906 posts, read 3,238,446 times
Reputation: 11149
Tying unions to anything you don't like seems to be in favor nowadays, the very thing that gave rise to the kind of stratified labor compensation that literally built the so called middle class is now seen as a thing of the past. That middle class is being systematically taken down by the same people that brought so much resistance to these unions in their formative years.

I think the propaganda machine has done a fairly good job of turning working folk's against themselves, after all, we wouldn't want the real cause of America's ills revealed, or are we already seeing a revalation in the recent transfer of wealth. Are you getting your share of the pie that taxpayers baked?
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Old 06-03-2009, 03:47 PM
 
1,780 posts, read 2,089,609 times
Reputation: 616
Quote:
Originally Posted by DOUBLE H View Post
If management would treat workers right you wouldn't need unions.
You do realize that is a common misconception. Management need to treat workers right...youre correct, a manager needs to punish those that work against a company and not for it. So a manager that punishes an employee for slacking on the job and talking to friends when he/she should be working, this manager is seen as the bad guy when all he is trying to do is set an example, it isn't fair for that employee to slack off when others are working.

Most managers are actually just doing as they are told. I am not going to say that there arent any bad managers out there. But compared to the amount of quality managers it is small. The only reason we hear about bad managers is because people don't care about the good, we focus on the bad.

When it comes down to it...unions are a mistake, maybe not always but they are now. While working for a store that was union, I one day decided to stop paying the dues. Why? becasue the union wasn't doing anything for me. Yes, I had benefits, but so did the non union members. They claim to fight for you all the time...the only time they fight is when they arent getting their dues. upon stopping my payments to them they kept sending letters to my managers to fire me. My managers realizing what I was doing supported me and kept me on. They put me in a generalized position as a secondary manager, this way I could still work there and do what I was doing, my benefits where better and I was promoted due to merit. I recently left that company to persue my own goals. If I ever needed a job I have no doubt that I could go back.

Some people say that unions protect your job. That they keep your employer from firing you for no reason. This is bull, I once had a supervisor who was verbally abusive, she wasnt a "manager" just a glorified cashier. One day she decided it was wise to grap the arm of a female associate who was trying to walk away from her verbal abuse. Upon grabbing her arm she managed to leave a bruise in the shape of her hand. That supervisor was going to be fired for assault on a minor. She played the racial card and said that the union was being racist against her. And the union requested that the other employee be terminated instead.

finally only after a year of complaints and making that manager feel uncomfortable was she finally transfered and demoted to another store. SHE SHOULD HAVE BEEN FIRED!!!

UNIONS ARE A JOKE, THEY ARE PURELY OUT TO GET MONEY FROM INNOCENT HARD WORKING PEOPLE AND PROTECT THE LAZY PEOPLE LIKE THEM THAT ARE FORCED TO WORK IN RETAIL BECASUE THEY ARE LOO LAZY TO DO REAL WORK.

No offence to retail workers, I love that line of work. I am just pointing out the lazy ones who support unions.
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Old 06-03-2009, 04:13 PM
 
5,273 posts, read 12,367,748 times
Reputation: 5770
In my opinion, labor unions were nearly single handedly responsible for ending child labor, creating fair wages, creating benefits, fighting sweat shop labor and bringing safety to the work place. They are to be honored for so doing.

By the same token, they have also spawned more corruption than organized crime, created such high wage & benefit situations by holding a gun at business heads that it has, literally, ended 80% of the industrialization in this country and forced millions of those jobs to other countries.

While there is still a place for unions, it is more administrative rather than combative. I’m a veteran of working as a union person in three separate unions (as a Teamster at UPS, federal worker in SEIU and briefly a member of the union for Air Traffic Controllers). It’s sad to say this, but the unions did as much damage to laborers as they did to help them.

As to retail, they have no reason to be there and will only do what they have recently done to other businesses- systematically destroy them.
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Old 06-03-2009, 04:35 PM
 
Location: 125 Years Too Late...
10,851 posts, read 10,526,347 times
Reputation: 9515
At one time ‘slacking on the job’ meant that you were unwilling to work 12 hours a day seven days a week in a mine (for example) or a factory (for example) where you didn’t know if you were going to survive through the day and if you did, you didn’t know if you were going to be able to get up the next morning and start all over. Workers were nothing but an expendable resource and there was quite a well to draw from.

... thus, the labor union was born. You tell me they didn’t have a purpose or a just cause. If you do, you are very blind.

Cut to today: as a few of you have observed, the things the unions were fighting for are largely now in place. Every worker in the US that is treated fairly can thank a union for that. I will agree that what unions are doing now is breeding laziness in many cases--hurting business. But you can still thank unions of the past for having fair work conditions.



As for another poster’s comment about being ‘mediocre’ if you’re not out to earn a million dollars, have a big car, and a barn for a house... screw that. That’s not mediocrity, it’s living your life the way you want to live it and not jumping on the over consumption bandwagon like a lemming. If I don't want to compete in your silly game, it doesn't mean I'm mediocre.
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Old 06-03-2009, 04:52 PM
 
Location: Planet Eaarth
8,955 posts, read 17,643,864 times
Reputation: 7193
Quote:
Originally Posted by fracturedman View Post

I worked for Albertsons for a while and it was a union store, the union did jack for the workers. The benefits where a joke, and all the pro union employees where lazy, and did bare minimum work. I worked my but off to get promoted but, but no, everything is based off seniority. Promotions and raises should be based on hard work, work ethics, and experience, not based on how long you have worked for a company.
I see you have an ax to grind with unions in general because of your one
bad experience. To bad........
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Old 06-03-2009, 10:29 PM
 
1,780 posts, read 2,089,609 times
Reputation: 616
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tightwad View Post
I see you have an ax to grind with unions in general because of your one
bad experience. To bad........
Actually I have had several run ins with unions. I have worked in retail for about 12 years and Have been a manager in various stores for 8 of those years. Union reps would constantly pull workers to the side to "talk union" I would kindly stop by and ask them to leave. I would tell them that they are working and if they feel the need to contact you they can on their own dime and time. One tried passing out papers and business cars, I must have tossed him out a dozen times. Finally marked him with trespassing and harassing workers.

Yes, unions had their time and place about 30-40 years ago, I applaud the original unions for what they did. But unions today are nothing but bullies. There is nothing a union can do for you that a lawyer can't.

If you work for a company that is union for 25 years and never once have an issue where you needed them you would have paid them atleast 5x what you would pay any lawyer to defend you. Plus once you get the union involved with your job, others look down on you and not just managers.

I do not have a problem with all unions, some are good and are still needed. But Having them in every job is overkill. Have you ever seen a broke union rep? nope, why? becasue you give them all your money...
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Old 06-03-2009, 10:33 PM
 
1,780 posts, read 2,089,609 times
Reputation: 616
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tightwad View Post
I see you have an ax to grind with unions in general because of your one
bad experience. To bad........
Actually I have had several run ins with unions. I have worked in retail for about 12 years and Have been a manager in various stores for 8 of those years. Union reps would constantly pull workers to the side to "talk union" I would kindly stop by and ask them to leave. I would tell them that they are working and if they feel the need to contact you they can on their own dime and time. One tried passing out papers and business cars, I must have tossed him out a dozen times. Finally marked him with trespassing and harassing workers.

Yes, unions had their time and place about 30-40 years ago, I applaud the original unions for what they did. But unions today are nothing but bullies. There is nothing a union can do for you that a lawyer can't.

If you work for a company that is union for 25 years and never once have an issue where you needed them you would have paid them atleast 5x what you would pay any lawyer to defend you. Plus once you get the union involved with your job, others look down on you and not just managers.

I do not have a problem with all unions, some are good and are still needed. But Having them in every job is overkill. Have you ever seen a broke union rep? nope, why? becasue you give them all your money...

I know I am going to start a union for stay at home moms...Simple monthly payment of $40+, cheap health coverage and I will promis that they will never have to work as long as they pay their dues. But if they get a job then they are out of the union.

Also did you know that if you work for a union store you cant work for any non union company as a second job. If they find out they could get you terminated. Thats another thing, unions run business's not the business. They take almost all of the control from the company.
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Old 06-03-2009, 10:39 PM
 
Location: Jonquil City (aka Smyrna) Georgia- by Atlanta
16,248 posts, read 21,258,584 times
Reputation: 3587
Unions are necessary because many managers are just horrible people. Unions balance the power in a way that is beneficial to the worker and the business. Unions make managers do their jobs- which is to manage! Most managers do not want to do their jobs and when they mess things up- which they often do- they want to sacrifice the workers and throw them under the bus to cover their own failures.
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