When will Obama+Democrats grow a pair? (NAFTA, Iraq, companies)

[Azalea City Man]

Originally Posted by compJockey

But your thread title will likely not attract much debate.

Yes, and I have started a few senible threads in my time. I felt that I deserved one time of "fanning the flames" with an over-the-top title.

[AeroGuyDC]

Originally Posted by ♠atizar♠

Why would I bother to argue with your straw-man construct?(Fallacy: Straw Man)



I see you've intentionally ignored the bit where I qualified my statement by saying "cowboy". The order to close Gitmo, good or bad, hasty or not, has has nothing to do with (Fallacy: Ad Hominem Tu Quoque) the Bush Admin's reckless and aggressive "cowboy" foreign policies (including creating the Girmo can of worms in the first place).

Come back with the next attempt at a gotcha, that's all you kids seem to have anymore.

I'm not sure where you went astray (other than being a liberal), but this thread is about Barack Obama, not George Bush. Barack Obama made a knee-jerk reaction by ordering Gitmo to be closed. Real "balls" would come from admitting his mistake, but I won't hold my breath. Just because you can't keep up with the topic on hand, and instead interject liberal drivel, doesn't negate the fact that your Savior did indeed make a knee -jerk reaction just like that of the "cowboy" you mentioned.

Liberal mentality is a total sham, and you proved that with your cut-and-paste philosophy above.

[compJockey]

Originally Posted by shorebaby

Well looky here.

Bush Deficit vs. Obama Deficit in Pictures » The Foundry

Bush did not start the auto bailout. Paulson specifically said TARP should not be used for the auto companies.

Who was in office in December 2008?
It wasn't Obama.

Your new graphic presents the same information that was presented in your previous post.

Did you not understand what I'm asking you for?
I'm asking you to list roughly HALF of the massive spending you complain about.

So far you have $252.3 billion in increased spending, with me guessing at $50 billion for the auto bailout (do you have real numbers to assign to Obama) and using the total cost listed in the proposed budget for the stimulus.

With the deficit increasing by 1.4 trillion (your graph), it should be no issue for you to identify more of this "spending".

Originally Posted by oscottscotto

Yes, and I have started a few senible threads in my time. I felt that I deserved one time of "fanning the flames" with an over-the-top title.

Yeah, I agree with the first statement - so I won't argue the second.

[thatguy1]

Originally Posted by compJockey

Who was in office in December 2008?
It wasn't Obama.

Your new graphic presents the same information that was presented in your previous post.

Did you not understand what I'm asking you for?
I'm asking you to list roughly HALF of the massive spending you complain about.

So far you have $252.3 billion in increased spending, with me guessing at $50 billion for the auto bailout (do you have real numbers to assign to Obama) and using the total cost listed in the proposed budget for the stimulus.

With the deficit increasing by 1.4 trillion (your graph), it should be no issue for you to identify more of this "spending".


Yeah, I agree with the first statement - so I won't argue the second.

Please do us all a favor, educate yourself on current and historic US economics and then come back for debate.

Yes, our foreign subsidized military expenditures (Bush) wreaked havoc on our deficit and subsequently, our debt.

Keep in mind, the overall fundamentals that led up to these events was runaway capitalism. And that my friend, has been exploited since the creation of our Federal Reserve many decades ago.

Trust me, Bush was not smart enough to re-write history and carry the load on his shoulders. And not to forget, you and I are just as guilty for this entire mess. I'm guessing the liberal side of you would like the government to save us from ourselves?

[Geechie North]

Originally Posted by oscottscotto

Quit worrying about mid-terms and/or 2012. Admit that extra revenue will most likely have to be raised by various tax increases. Most Americans are okay with increased taxes for Health Care Reform. In my opinion, a majority of people will appreciate the brutal honesty. If cable news throws a fit, who cares ... it's time to do what is right - 1) Reform Health Care 2) Be honest about revenue.

Please do not lump in ALL Democrats with the pro-Corporate, Clinton wing which Obama seems to embrace by action, if not word:

* There are 76 members in the House (largest caucus) of Progressive Democrats, the anthesis of the pro-biz/rich Clinton crowd.

* Granted in the Senate (which is now the "new" old Millionaires Club), the pickings are far fewer.

Sanders of VT (a Socialist who caucauses with the Dems), Feingold, and maybe one or two I'm forgetting are the only representitives of the working American to be found.

[compJockey]

Originally Posted by burgerflipper

Please do us all a favor, educate yourself on current and historic US economics and then come back for debate.

Yes, our foreign subsidized military expenditures (Bush) wreaked havoc on our deficit and subsequently, our debt.

Keep in mind, the overall fundamentals that led up to these events was runaway capitalism. And that my friend, has been exploited since the creation of our Federal Reserve many decades ago.

Trust me, Bush was not smart enough to re-write history and carry the load on his shoulders. And not to forget, you and I are just as guilty for this entire mess. I'm guessing the liberal side of you would like the government to save us from ourselves?

Why don't you try it.

List the massive spending.

[Geechie North]

Well, there is the Oil War, and the massive raid on the Treasury by the rich, for starters.

[thatguy1]

I think it's hilarious how many people sit here and point fingers at a select group of people when in fact the fingers should be pointed at ourselves. The spending habits of the masses is what created this.

[compJockey]

Originally Posted by Geechie North

Well, there is the Oil War, and the massive raid on the Treasury by the rich, for starters.

Specifically Obama's massive spending.
The "massive spending" freaks don't have a clue how we got here.

[Geechie North]

Oh, Thought you meant Bush.

Well, Obama is spending, because that's how you get out of a depression.

But: it's not the spending per say, but how it's used:

His handling of TARP (which. fyi, proves everyone who says the New Deal did NOT ameolerate the 30's Depression wrong) under Geithner is the exact ("seamless" is the term on CNBC) as under Paulson (Bush).

So that's just a massive waste of money.

Then there are the auto deals- not that they were done, but the multinational way in which they're centered.
Crazy to say the least, US taxpayers subsidizing multinats to open plants in Mexico and China. while closing identical ones here.

Bottom line:

Bush was the pits- the first non-elected US Prsident to serve full terms.

But Obama is doing NOTHING to change the course.