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Old 06-20-2009, 03:04 PM
 
6,865 posts, read 9,315,231 times
Reputation: 6969
Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthCity09 View Post
why should the US president pick a side between to evils? yeah they are protesting because they got screwed but this Mousavi is not better than ahmadinejacket
True, he (Obama) has to walk a fine line, but that doesn't include walking away. That doesn't also include calling the ruling mullah the "supreme leader". I'm not sure about the other posters here, but I would just be happy with words of strong support for those that want fair elections - it lays the seeds down for a more moderate government in the future, it compels the protestors to fight in the future for a moderate government, and it portrays the US as still a world leader.

Looks like, with some prounoncements from Obama last night and this morning, he is comming around to a stronger stance.
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Old 06-20-2009, 03:08 PM
 
2,659 posts, read 1,656,013 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
As they say in Minnesota, "interesting".
haha, guess my "I won't speculate" statement is dumb after the preceding statement. It fit before I edited.
But yeah, I've been paying close attention to Iran (for about a week).

The top 10 clerics can remove Khamenei, in theory anyway.
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Old 06-20-2009, 03:13 PM
 
Location: Yes
2,663 posts, read 4,107,098 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miborn View Post
"It is up to Iranians to make decisions about who Iran's leaders will be. We respect Iranian sovereignty and want to avoid the United States being the issue inside of Iran," Obama said during the weekend.
This is exactly what an American president should say in this situation ... see my Thank God for Ron Paul thread.
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Old 06-20-2009, 03:17 PM
 
Location: here.
1,359 posts, read 1,412,428 times
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this is as far as Obama should go...he cannot pick a side in this situation....both are bad.

Quote:
In Washington, President Obama urged the Iranian government to stop the violence against its own citizens.
"The Iranian government must understand that the world is watching," Obama said in a written statement. "We call on the Iranian government to stop all violent and unjust actions against its own people."
Obama received intelligence briefings throughout the day and discussed the situation with senior advisers, an administration official told CNN.
In his statement, Obama repeated a message from his recent speech to the Muslim world in Cairo, Egypt, that "suppressing ideas never succeeds in making them go away."
"The Iranian people will ultimately judge the actions of their own government," Obama said in the statement.
"I believe that," Obama's statement said. "The international community believes that. And right now, we are bearing witness to the Iranian peoples' belief in that truth, and we will continue to bear witness.
"If the Iranian government seeks the respect of the international community, it must respect the dignity of its own people and govern through consent, not coercion."
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Old 06-20-2009, 03:18 PM
 
2,659 posts, read 1,656,013 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthCity09 View Post
why should the US president pick a side between to evils? yeah they are protesting because they got screwed but this Mousavi is not better than ahmadinejacket
Ahmadinejacket, lol.
Does he wear... Members Only jackets?
Kinda looks like it.

I'm not so sure they are the same.
I have very limited knowledge - seen them both talk 2-3 times (more of Ahmadinejacket).

Ahmadinejacket talks of wiping Israel off the face of the planet.
Mousavi sounds like he wants to champion women's rights.
Ahmadinejacket denies the holocaust.

Mousavi:
Quote:
once again reiterated his positions and declared that the followers of different faiths, creeds and religions will live side by side in a spirit of friendship and serenity; No one will ever be subjected to prosecution, mistreatment or exclusion because of her/ his belief; Freedom of expression and thought will never be violated and no one will ever be subject to torture or mistreatment for having exercised that right
…ˆج سˆ…› پاŒگا‡ اط„اع رسا†Œ «پˆŒش (ک…پŒ†) دعˆت از خات…Œ» (http://www.mowj.ir/ShowNews.php?7142 - broken link)

Y'know, hard to tell those two apart.

Haha, like I said, limited knowledge of both - but from what little I know, I like Mousavi's talk better. His wife is educated (not allowed much I understand) - said to be a strong woman.

Maybe they'll have their first woman president, just like during Bill's years.
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Old 06-20-2009, 03:20 PM
 
Location: here.
1,359 posts, read 1,412,428 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by compJockey View Post
Ahmadinejacket, lol.
Does he wear... Members Only jackets?
Kinda looks like it.

I'm not so sure they are the same.
I have very limited knowledge - seen them both talk 2-3 times (more of Ahmadinejacket).

Ahmadinejacket talks of wiping Israel off the face of the planet.
Mousavi sounds like he wants to champion women's rights.
Ahmadinejacket denies the holocaust.

Mousavi:

موج سوم؛ پایگاه اطلاع رسانی «پویش (کمپین) دعوت از خاتمی» (http://www.mowj.ir/ShowNews.php?7142 - broken link)

Y'know, hard to tell those two apart.

Haha, like I said, limited knowledge of both - but from what little I know, I like Mousavi's talk better. His wife is educated (not allowed much I understand) - said to be a strong woman.

Maybe they'll have their first woman president, just like during Bill's years.
Ahmadinejacket can say whatever he wants, he has no real power...
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Old 06-20-2009, 03:23 PM
 
Location: Chicagoland
41,214 posts, read 24,189,014 times
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This site has the updates coming out of Iran, the horrific videos;

Hot Air Blog Archive Chaos in Tehran: I’m ready for martyrdom, says Mousavi; Videos: Woman murdered in cold blood; Update: Obama calls on regime to end violence; Rumor: 30-40 dead in Tehran? Update: Obama goes for ice cream

Quote:
Looks like, with some prounoncements from Obama last night and this morning, he is comming around to a stronger stance.
A little late - but it is probably his attempt to try and take some credit if there is a true revolution in Iran and the government is overthrown. You can bet he will try even though his response so far has been glaringly inadequate and weak.

Quote:
Update (AP): CBS reporter Mark Knoller reports that the president decided today of all days would be a good time for a leisurely trip to the ice-cream parlor. Quoth Jim Treacher: “Imagine if Bush went on an ice cream run during something like this. He’d be ‘Worst Person in the World’ every day forever.” Any lefties care to dispute that, especially in light of the longstanding faux outrage over this clip?
Content warning;

Quote:
Update (AP): I linked the Facebook video of the young woman being murdered by the Basij earlier but it deserves wide dissemination so I’m giving you the embeddable LiveLeak version too. Forward the link around.
Watch the vid from the link. There can be no justification for this.

Is obama still unsure of what Iran is?
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Old 06-20-2009, 03:24 PM
 
2,659 posts, read 1,656,013 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthCity09 View Post
Ahmadinejacket can say whatever he wants, he has no real power...
I think Iran is past the point of removing Ahmadinejacket.
I speculate that Khamenei will be removed as well.

At least, I would tip a beer towards Iran if that happened.

So the question to me is:
Will a new government be formed?

Or will a new cleric be selected to take Khamenei's place?
And if so, do they have any moderately reasonable clerics, lol?
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Old 06-20-2009, 03:27 PM
 
Location: here.
1,359 posts, read 1,412,428 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by compJockey View Post
I think Iran is past the point of removing Ahmadinejacket.
I speculate that Khamenei will be removed as well.

At least, I would tip a beer towards Iran if that happened.

So the question to me is:
Will a new government be formed?

Or will a new cleric be selected to take Khamenei's place?
And if so, do they have any moderately reasonable clerics, lol?

the guy in charge of the Assembly of Experts(group that can take down Khamenei and elect the new Supreme Leader) doesnt like Khamenei and the Jacket...so if the protest keep going and keep gaining..i wouldnt be suprised if he tryed something.

this guy: Hashemi Rafsanjani
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Old 06-20-2009, 03:35 PM
 
2,659 posts, read 1,656,013 times
Reputation: 365
Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthCity09 View Post
the guy in charge of the Assembly of Experts(group that can take down Khamenei and elect the new Supreme Leader) doesnt like Khamenei and the Jacket...so if the protest keep going and keep gaining..i wouldnt be suprised if he tryed something.

this guy: Hashemi Rafsanjani
Nice, you've been reading some too.
I don't know much about Rafsanjani - other than he was involved in the 1979 revolution, if memory doesn't completely suck.
But it is a fun name to say.
Go Rafsanjani.

And this guy doesn't like Khamenei either - he was at one time the successor to Khomenei (sp?) - the guy before Khamenei.
Grand Ayatollah Hossein-Ali Montazeri - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Quote:
For almost three decades, Hossein Ali Montazeri has been one of the main critics of Islamic Republic's domestic and foreign policy. He has also been an active advocate of civil rights and women's rights in Iran. He is a prolific writer and has authored a number of books and articles.
Wikipedia makes the guy sound like a decent guy.

Hope they both are still freely moving around (not in jail)
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